4.4 rv8 build thread (Doc evil need not post)

[jamesmartin]

not like that as standard! myn are not

ground on the 2 lower lugs ?cant say ive seen any sets that arent when stripping a v8

 

[discomark10]

ill get a pic of myn when i finished putting it together, I could be wrong

 

[Mr Noisy]

the only thing that was harder than getting good bits for a 3.5 was the mains because I wanted them at .10 but people only had std or .20, now I have hassled them so much they put the .10 back in to production then you would be laughing.

with the price of that stroker kit and the fact that you would have to buy/have machined most of the bits I have done anyway for any full re-build I would say you are better off with the aussie 4.4 as its cheaper and has such ridiculous torque even as standard which is ideal for landys

the things I still need to buy are the bits I would have buy for a 3.5 too, like a better spec cam- maybe??? and also the expensive timing chain deal which I want as ****ed off with the others stretching.

if I could be arsed to spend more time and cash re-building heads and could get the quality bits in the uk the 3.5 efi heads I have are actually way better for breathing than the 4.4 heads which are only about as good as early 3.5 heads but getting decent rocker arms and shafts in this country seems hard and honestly that 3.5 efi has been running on tar for the last 10 years by the look of it so all that rocker gear would be fooked.

I suppose I also have to think of my 1972 driveline, will it handle 285 ftlbs anyway lol, let alone more

I know money doesn't actually grow on trees but how about some 4.6 heads or ideally some heads off a disco 2, you could get very late rocker gear that way.

I'm sure it's worth some effort at this stage to put decent heads on it be used you will only kick yourself otherwise

 

[fett]

I dunno bud, tbh you are the expert on the heads after all your troubles with those injector reliefs but I didnt think the late 4.6 heads would fit?

what about the fact they are 94mm bore as opposed to my 88mm bore?

Anyway I am not sure the rest of my drivline will handle much more than the 220bhp and 330ftlbs a decent cam and the higher compression will give me- I know the lt95 will be ok as its a new one from james when it arrives but I dont think the props,diffs and axles will handle it as they are original 72 parts lol.

if I was building it to put in a mk1 granada conversion or the like it would be a different story

 

[fett]

just to show you, thats the other thing they put the engine in:

Leyland Terrier Tray back Truck 1976 can be registered on club rego P76 4.4lt v8 | eBay

it must have some balls to move that fully loaded!

 

[POAH]

you would only need to use composite gaskets with the later 10 bolt heads on your 3.5 as the combustion chamber volume is different (36cc v 29cc).

I dunno bud, tbh you are the expert on the heads after all your troubles with those injector reliefs but I didnt think the late 4.6 heads would fit?

what about the fact they are 94mm bore as opposed to my 88mm bore?

Anyway I am not sure the rest of my drivline will handle much more than the 220bhp and 330ftlbs a decent cam and the higher compression will give me- I know the lt95 will be ok as its a new one from james when it arrives but I dont think the props,diffs and axles will handle it as they are original 72 parts lol.

if I was building it to put in a mk1 granada conversion or the like it would be a different story

 

[fett]

I was wondering if I will need to anyway tbh as I am upping the compression anyway?

still waiting for the Admin on the v8 forum to approve my membership btw- why the long wait?

 

[POAH]

no idea TBH - you are there on the member list

 

[fett]

cant even find anywhere to email the admin or webmaster without logging in, which I cant do FFS!

 

[discomark10]

as long as your valves don't hit the pistons , it'l b fine!

 

[fett]

no ****

thats what I would like to know, I am now think Crow cams TBH as they actually have people who know! I am sure it wont be cheap though!

 

[discomark10]

well the tin ones at least dont cost much at all! try em n if they do get comp

 

[fett]

I have a set of payne ones, although they have not been stored very flat- wonder if thats ok?

RE cams, this is what crow recommends:


---------------------------CROW COMPUTER CARD----------------------------
| PART NUMBER 37776 Date 29-MAR-04 |
| Cam type: Hydraulic type Profile MIN LIFTER DIA.744 |
| ----------------------------------------------------------------------|
| Advance Ground on Cam: 2 Lobe separation: 112 |
| .050 VALVE TIMING |
| Inlet opens: -8 BTDC Closes: 32 ABDC .050 Duration: 204 |
| Exhaust Opens: 41 BBDC Closes: -7 ATDC .050 Duration: 214 |
| ADVERTISED VALVE TIMING |
| Inlet opens: 24 BTDC Closes: 64 ABDC ADV Duration: 268 |
| Exhaust Opens: 73 BBDC Closes: 25 ATDC ADV Duration: 278 |
| Inlet lobe lift at TDC on the over lap:.036 |
| ----------------------------------------------------------------------|
| Valve lift Inlet: .4065 Inlet Rocker Ratio: 1.50 |
| Valve lift Exhaust: .4170 Exhaust Rocker Ratio: 1.50


How does that compare to the ones we talked about? TBH I am a bit lost with all this cam info and still cant get on the v8 forum to ask :doh:

 

[discomark10]

I have a set of payne ones, although they have not been stored very flat- wonder if thats ok?

RE cams, this is what crow recommends:


---------------------------CROW COMPUTER CARD----------------------------
| PART NUMBER 37776 Date 29-MAR-04 |
| Cam type: Hydraulic type Profile MIN LIFTER DIA.744 |
| ----------------------------------------------------------------------|
| Advance Ground on Cam: 2 Lobe separation: 112 |
| .050 VALVE TIMING |
| Inlet opens: -8 BTDC Closes: 32 ABDC .050 Duration: 204 |
| Exhaust Opens: 41 BBDC Closes: -7 ATDC .050 Duration: 214 |
| ADVERTISED VALVE TIMING |
| Inlet opens: 24 BTDC Closes: 64 ABDC ADV Duration: 268 |
| Exhaust Opens: 73 BBDC Closes: 25 ATDC ADV Duration: 278 |
| Inlet lobe lift at TDC on the over lap:.036 |
| ----------------------------------------------------------------------|
| Valve lift Inlet: .4065 Inlet Rocker Ratio: 1.50 |
| Valve lift Exhaust: .4170 Exhaust Rocker Ratio: 1.50


How does that compare to the ones we talked about? TBH I am a bit lost with all this cam info and still cant get on the v8 forum to ask :doh:

the gasket will be fine aslong as its not kinked.

Post a standard cam info and i can tell you what difference's there are and what they mean

 

[fett]

thats thee standard p76 and rrc ones :

CAM SPECS:

ETC6850: INLET OPENS: 30 BTDC, CLOSES 75 ABDC, DUR 285, VALVE PEAK 112.5 ATDC. EXHAUST OPENS 68 BBDC, CLOSES 37 ATDC, DUR 285, VALVE PEAK 105.5 BTDC

ETC6849: INLET OPENS: 36 BTDC, CLOSES 64 ABDC, DUR 280, VALVE PEAK 99 ATDC. EXHAUST OPENS 74 BBDC, CLOSES 26 ATDC, DUR 280, VALVE PEAK 119 BTDC

I read somwhere that the lift on that crow cam is too high for stadard valve springs anyway. also it looks like the power doesnt come in till 1800 rpm which is a bit high- I wonder how much torque you have before it comes in?

 

[fett]

just to add to the confusion, the standard cam (same as etc6850) give peak torque at 2500rpm, which I dont think is bad for rrc use?

however that when its running 9:1 comp.

I read somwhere I could be running as high as 10.6:1 with these pistons lol, although that is a minority view I will need to do a volume exercise when all the bits are here lol

 

[fett]

and finally from turners:

H180 Camshaft Sports Torque (ln)
In stock

Price: £204.00 (Excluding VAT at 20%)

Quantity:

Kent Cams H180 'Sports Torque' camshaft has been designed as a straight forward replacement performance cam for the Rover V8 engine.

With a duration of 262º and a valve lift of 11.2mm the H180 improves low end torque and is capable of increasing peak power by 22bhp, all whilst retaining the use of OE valve springs and maintains stable idle characteristics essential for: everyday use, on or off road, manual or automatic gearbox cars.

The new camshaft is produced on an improved 'Chilled Iron' cam blank which gives significantly superior reliability over the original production cams.

We also recommend replacing the hydraulic cam followers when changing a camshaft


More...

 

[Dr_evil]

just to add to the confusion, the standard cam (same as etc6850) give peak torque at 2500rpm, which I dont think is bad for rrc use?

however that when its running 9:1 comp.

I read somwhere I could be running as high as 10.6:1 with these pistons lol, although that is a minority view I will need to do a volume exercise when all the bits are here lol

Isn't a discovery peak value on the Tdi somewhere around 1800-2000 ?

The 4.0 D2 V8 is at 2600 too

So at 2500 but with the ****loads more torque you have you should get a nice power band up through the gears with that ?

 

[discomark10]

thats thee standard p76 and rrc ones :

CAM SPECS:

ETC6850: INLET OPENS: 30 BTDC, CLOSES 75 ABDC, DUR 285, VALVE PEAK 112.5 ATDC. EXHAUST OPENS 68 BBDC, CLOSES 37 ATDC, DUR 285, VALVE PEAK 105.5 BTDC

ETC6849: INLET OPENS: 36 BTDC, CLOSES 64 ABDC, DUR 280, VALVE PEAK 99 ATDC. EXHAUST OPENS 74 BBDC, CLOSES 26 ATDC, DUR 280, VALVE PEAK 119 BTDC

I read somwhere that the lift on that crow cam is too high for stadard valve springs anyway. also it looks like the power doesnt come in till 1800 rpm which is a bit high- I wonder how much torque you have before it comes in?

It doesnt say how much lift its got but if there is much differance in lift the springs will need to be changed, the only big difference is in the exhaust opening longer, inlet hasnt changed that much, what that does to power i dont know.

 

[POAH]

standard cam is 0.39" lift so you don't really want to go beyond 0.43" or you'll need to make alterations to the valve springs

the H180 cam mentioned above is a very mild cam


if you are going for a Crower cam then I'd recommend the 50229, not sure where you got the 37776 part number from (it gets good reviews for both the 4.2 and the 4.6 engines)

It doesnt say how much lift its got but if there is much differance in lift the springs will need to be changed, the only big difference is in the exhaust opening longer, inlet hasnt changed that much, what that does to power i dont know.