Td5 - petrol in diesel - trouble ?

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dooroy

Active Member
Posts
272
Location
Co. Galway , Ireland
My Td5 when being refilled this evening had about 16 L of unleaded added before mistake was noticed .
It was then filled to the brim with diesel and has been driven about 2 miles since .
Should it be OK or should it be drained - advice greatly appreciated .
It ran fine for the 2 mls but I'm not too familiar with the Td5 and want to find out what you guys think
 
Thanks for prompt replies - really like the Td5 but didn't want to do any expensive damage .
Treworgey 90 , do you mean ordinary engine oil such as Duckhams Semi synthetic which I use for the engine .
I also have some Millers fuel additive - would this help ?
 
The TD5 is the one diesel you should try NOT to add petrol to because of the extremely high return fuel temperatures involved.

The fuel in the injectors gallery, and the injectors and the return rail up to the fuel cooler becomes easily hot enough to vapourise petrol, and that could cause a TD5 system a bit of bother.

But you'll probably be OK with 16 litres into a full tank.

You might hear the engine sound a little different with petrol in the tank.

CharlesY
 
In the 'old' days . . . it was quite common to add up to 10% petrol to a diesel to help prevent 'winter waxing' of the diesel . .

16 Ltrs in a Disco tank, as long as you fill up with diesel asap will do NO harm
 
As mentioned by charles you may get probs with petrol vapourising which can be very inconvenient, i made the same mistake with a toyota surf, it ran fine but if you switched it off you couldnt start it again until it had cooled down as the fuel in the pump/lines was getting warm and the petrol vapourising.
 
most landrovers have a drain bung (bolt) in the bottom of the tank. If you have one you could always drain out the tank and either dispose of the contaminated fuel or use a small quantity of it at a time with fresh fuel.
 
Just to update and thanks for the replies - I just couldn't believe what happened on Thur night :eek: and it was great to have so much advice readily available .
* I did add almost a litre of engine oil ;
* On Friday the Disco ran fine - but became very slow to start after a run of
only a few miles - thanks to the forum I knew why ;
* On Fri night I decided to take no more chances as I would be putting up a
lot of miles on Sat - so I raised the D a few feet on the lift and drained out
about 65L of fuel into drums which a friend will use in his tractor .
* This morning I filled up with 75L of diesel and put up 170 mls. today and it
was running and starting as good as ever :). So no harm done . There was
18.2L of unleaded added. I had put about 55mls. up with the 'mix' .
 
some time ago I owned a 2.2 Diesel Nissan Xtrail (I saw the error of my ways and bought a Disco)
I literally filled up with petrol early one morning, about 40 litres, and was blissfully unaware, and drove some 165 miles (without stopping)

After a stop for some breakfast, it refused to restart, to cut a long story short, it was recovered to a garage, where the mistake was discovered (embarresed or what) It was drained, and ran on for another 30,000 miles before I sold it.

To this day the garage could not belive that I had driven 165 miles in a diesel running on Petrol . . it just shows how resilient modern engines are to 'abuse' !!!
 
disco_steve said:
some time ago I owned a 2.2 Diesel Nissan Xtrail (I saw the error of my ways and bought a Disco)
I literally filled up with petrol early one morning, about 40 litres, and was blissfully unaware, and drove some 165 miles (without stopping)

After a stop for some breakfast, it refused to restart, to cut a long story short, it was recovered to a garage, where the mistake was discovered (embarresed or what) It was drained, and ran on for another 30,000 miles before I sold it.

To this day the garage could not belive that I had driven 165 miles in a diesel running on Petrol . . it just shows how resilient modern engines are to 'abuse' !!!
Click to expand...
Did something similar in a Gaylander. Got to the top of an Alpine pass, stopped to admire the view, wouldn't start. Embarassment all round. That was less distance, but all uphill. Again no harm done.
 
dooroy said:
Just to update and thanks for the replies - I just couldn't believe what happened on Thur night :eek: and it was great to have so much advice readily available .
* I did add almost a litre of engine oil ;
* On Friday the Disco ran fine - but became very slow to start after a run of
only a few miles - thanks to the forum I knew why ;
* On Fri night I decided to take no more chances as I would be putting up a
lot of miles on Sat - so I raised the D a few feet on the lift and drained out
about 65L of fuel into drums which a friend will use in his tractor .
* This morning I filled up with 75L of diesel and put up 170 mls. today and it
was running and starting as good as ever :). So no harm done . There was
18.2L of unleaded added. I had put about 55mls. up with the 'mix' .
Click to expand...

A good lesson learned for all TD5 owners!
I think the problem was being caused by vapourisation of the petrol in the EXTREMELY HIGH and HOT TD5 fuel system. If the engine was COLD it would probably be fine, but as soon as it heated up ... problems.

It may well be that TD5 owners (like me) should think again about using gasoline / petrol as a fuel dilutant when running on BIO or Veg oils. The vapourisation temperature of gasoline / petrol is just too low for use in an engine where the return fuel temperature will easily reach 140°C or more routinely, hence the RETURN FUEL COOLER fitted to TD5 engines, which is supposed to reduce return fuel temp to under 70°C before sending it back to the filter and tank.

CharlesY
 
CharlesY said:
It may well be that TD5 owners (like me) should think again about using gasoline / petrol as a fuel dilutant when running on BIO or Veg oils. The vapourisation temperature of gasoline / petrol is just too low for use in an engine where the return fuel temperature will easily reach 140°C or more

CharlesY
Click to expand...
Charles, I know my biofuel supplier uses ethanol as part of his mix, although he says the flashpoint of his fuel is below that of ordinary diesel. Presumably the ethanol would exacerbate the vapourisation effect???
 
As I said the forum had alerted me to the problem of vapourisation but even so I was surprised how quickly it became noticeable when starting - on a few occasions after only about 2/3 mls. And I was driving very gently due to the circumstances. The starting was as good as ever when cold but once warmed up - problems ( as CharlesY said )
If it were summer for example I imagine it would take the system much longer to cool down sufficiently . It's starting as well as ever again much to my relief - and considering Disco Steve's and Pastmaster's experiences it should be back to normal service .
 
Hopefully - no harm done.

The TD5 engine is an extremely strong and forgiving unit, afterall it was designed to operate in extreme conditions, ofetn with minimnal maintenance . . The artic all the way to the jungle !! and be capable of running on a variety of 'fuels' . . . depending on what is available (not for 'normal drriving in Europe I suppose)
 
PASTMASTER said:
Charles, I know my biofuel supplier uses ethanol as part of his mix, although he says the flashpoint of his fuel is below that of ordinary diesel. Presumably the ethanol would exacerbate the vapourisation effect???
Click to expand...

I suspect he is using METHANOL CH3OH and not ETHANOL C2H5OH.

Methanol is methyl alcohol, ethanol is the ethyl alcohol as in booze.
Methanol is five times as toxic as ethanol, and makes you blind.

Either alcohol will do to make biodiesel, but methanol is much easier to get, and cheaper.

You Bio man mixes sodium hydroxide into his methanol to make a horrible stuff called sodium methoxide, and he tosses X litres of that into about seven times that much of warm veg oil. Then he stirs it for a couple of hours, and lets it settle overnight. Job done.

So, yes, your man uses alcohol in his process, but if he gets the formula right, and does the process well, there won't be any significant alcohol left in the fuel.

CharlesY
 
CharlesY said:
I suspect he is using METHANOL CH3OH and not ETHANOL C2H5OH.
Click to expand...
Right. As he is an eco-nut, and not someone just out to make money, I wouldn't put it past him to be sourcing bio-ethanol from Brazil or somewhere (you can buy most things in London). I'll ask him next time I fill up.:)
 
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