Freelander 1 Getting a feeling for the Freelander

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monkfish24

monkfish24

Well-Known Member
Posts
1,296
Location
Cornwall
So the more I have been spending time with the freelander, the more I like it. It has gone from me making a quick buck on it to, I'll keep it for the winter to now thinking it may stay for a bit longer...

At the moment, the car hasn't done any real moving around since it was dragged out of the field where it sat for nearly 6 months. I know brakes and things will be a bit stiff and will take a good run to bed in etc, it doesn't help by the fact that the front bottom wishbones and drop links aren't tight which give a feeling that the front left tyre is buckled.... I'll double check all that tomorrow when I fit the new parts.

However, without getting into the in's and out's of the VCU and OWUT (which I will do and provide results) I had the freelander on a slight slope backwards. With the wheel straight the car would start to roll under it's own weight. with the wheel hard over, it would stop and it would only take a slight bit of clutch to make it move again.

As I say, I am just trying to get a feel for the car at the moment, does this sound correct? I have a spare GBX/IRD, VCU and rear diff from the other freelander. Both freelanders had their full drive train connected up before being parked up, with both being on over 100k miles (who knows, may have got very lucky and had a good batch of VCU's)
 
Last edited:
monkfish24 said:
So the more I have been spending time with the freelander, the more I like it. It has gone from me making a quick buck on it to, I'll keep it for the winter to now thinking it may stay for a bit longer...
Click to expand...
I know exactly what you mean - the car seems so likeable! Hopefully I'll get mine running this weekend, and then put some miles on it: I haven't done much off-road stuff yet (other than some tuition in a Disco 1, and some time in a LandCruiser in Africa many years ago), so really keen to get it muddy!

New tyres will be required though! Mine has some road-car Chinese brand nastiness - no doubt to get it cheaply through its last MoT I suspect...
 
Its funny because, and correct me if I'm wrong, but both you guys have come into Freelander ownership with "project" cars that you've both had to put lots of effort into. Mine was the reverse, bought a car in good condition. Having come from Disco ownership for 10 years, I was rather "underinspired" by the Freelander. Then after a couple of years the the transmission blew and I needed to put a lot of effort into getting it back road worthy. It was putting the effort in that really got me hooked on the Freelander. Learning about how it works and how its put together and being able to do major work on the car relatively easily. It was only after going through that that I got to appreciate the Freelander. Wouldn't be without it now :)
 
monkfish24 said:
So the more I have been spending time with the freelander, the more I like it. It has gone from me making a quick buck on it to, I'll keep it for the winter to now thinking it may stay for a bit longer...

At the moment, the car hasn't done any real moving around since it was dragged out of the field where it sat for nearly 6 months. I know brakes and things will be a bit stiff and will take a good run to bed in etc, it doesn't help by the fact that the front bottom wishbones and drop links aren't tight which give a feeling that the front left tyre is buckled.... I'll double check all that tomorrow when I fit the new parts.

However, without getting into the in's and out's of the VCU and OWUT (which I will do and provide results) I had the freelander on a slight slope backwards. With the wheel straight the car would start to roll under it's own weight. with the wheel hard over, it would stop and it would only take a slight bit of clutch to make it move again.

As I say, I am just trying to get a feel for the car at the moment, does this sound correct? I have a spare GBX/IRD, VCU and rear diff from the other freelander. Both freelanders had their full drive train connected up before being parked up, with both being on over 100k miles (who knows, may have got very lucky and had a good batch of VCU's)
Click to expand...
Hi mate.. your VCU needs replacing - the so called OWUT will tell you nothing as you already have the info

http://www.bellengineering.co.uk/5.html

take the shafts out and replace the vcu
 
monkfish24 said:
However, without getting into the in's and out's of the VCU and OWUT (which I will do and provide results) I had the freelander on a slight slope backwards. With the wheel straight the car would start to roll under it's own weight. with the wheel hard over, it would stop and it would only take a slight bit of clutch to make it move again.
Click to expand...
A slight braking effect/resistance is expected on full lock and is a "characteristic of the model" according to LR...

http://www.myfreelander.co.uk/Transmission/transprobs1.htm

It makes sense really when you consider what the VCU does. So going by LR "When manoeuvering on full lock at low speed, slight resistance to rolling is felt in both forward and reverse directions." and therefore there are no problems.

The Bells link above says there are problems "If your Freelander feels "tight" or it appears the brakes are binding, especially when reversing on full lock".

Rather contradictory - is there a difference between slight resistance and tightness? Open to interpretation really.

If you think it feels like your brakes are binding then the VCU is definitely shot - but it doesn't sound like that.
 
I'm with you grumpy, there is a difference and it doesn't feel on the bad end of that scale. if it comes to it, I have a spare IRD VCU and rear diff when it all goes wrong.
 
When I reversed mine onto the drive with lock applied and ticking over at fast idle, the car practically stalled - and needed some welly to overcome the resistance. My interpretation is that this is "bad" and the VCU needs replacing. If you can reverse with lock applied at idle without the car coming practically to a halt, then I suspect that all is well.

Is that everyone's experience?
 
rob_bell said:
When I reversed mine onto the drive with lock applied and ticking over at fast idle, the car practically stalled - and needed some welly to overcome the resistance. My interpretation is that this is "bad" and the VCU needs replacing. If you can reverse with lock applied at idle without the car coming practically to a halt, then I suspect that all is well.

Is that everyone's experience?
Click to expand...
If you can reverse on full lock without any feeling of tightening - as you put it
"If you can reverse with lock applied at idle without the car coming practically to a halt, then I suspect that all is well."
is not reallycorrect. - The car shouldnt feel any different to straight ahead - a tiny fraction of tightening is acceptable. But nothing more. Nothing more than ANY fwd vehicle on full lock due to CV joint limiting - NOT VCU limiting.
If you feel a positive resistance the vcu is captain cooked.
I have driven many many freelanders and the full lock makes no discernible difference at all in a working VCU. In fact, you are more likely to feel a slight kick from the ABS due to wheel speed difference.
Any tightness on tick-over is a major on full lock cause for concern.
There is no other way of testing it in any objective manor. - the results you indicate are positive of a new unit needed.
At least they are cheap enough Rob.

Joe
 
Joe_H said:
If you can reverse on full lock without any feeling of tightening - as you put it
"If you can reverse with lock applied at idle without the car coming practically to a halt, then I suspect that all is well."
is not reallycorrect. - The car shouldnt feel any different to straight ahead - a tiny fraction of tightening is acceptable. But nothing more. Nothing more than ANY fwd vehicle on full lock due to CV joint limiting - NOT VCU limiting.
If you feel a positive resistance the vcu is captain cooked.
I have driven many many freelanders and the full lock makes no discernible difference at all in a working VCU. In fact, you are more likely to feel a slight kick from the ABS due to wheel speed difference.
Any tightness on tick-over is a major on full lock cause for concern.
There is no other way of testing it in any objective manor. - the results you indicate are positive of a new unit needed.
At least they are cheap enough Rob.

Joe
Click to expand...
You say "The car shouldnt feel any different to straight ahead" then you say "a tiny fraction of tightening is acceptable" - that is contradictory, please let us know which you think is correct.

"ANY fwd vehicle on full lock due to CV joint limiting - NOT VCU limiting." - so when the front and back axles are moving at different speeds, the VCU is spinning freely with no viscosity?

"the results you indicate are positive of a new unit needed." - please confirm that you have no way of knowing that your statement is correct or not. You don't know how "slight" the "slight slope" is, what the speed was, tyre condition or, from your description, what resistance the CVs were giving, etc etc.

Actually, is not everything you wrote contradictory or just plain wrong?

Personally I'd have thought the OPs VCU is coming towards the end of its serviceable life - but there is nothing described to indicate that it is yet a danger to the transmission. Similarly nothing fully conclusive that it is not a danger to the transmission, but it would lean that way.
 
I really don't want this descending into another argument about testing of VCU's, it's all that seems to go on, on here, at the moment......

I respectfully ask that all conversation on people's thought's on VCU testing finishes here on this thread.

It would really help ,me however if you could let me know how the clutch slave cylinder is fitted to the gearbox, i have seen some photo's where the white tabs are locked in to piston outer cover, is this just for transport and should be removed?
 
When they are shipped there is a (white) plastic clip holding the piston pushed into the cylinder. These will break the first time you use the clutch - don't cut them before installing it or else there's nothing to stop the piston extending and letting the fluid leak out.

The cylinder slots into the bracket on the side of the box and there's a semi circular clip that then holds it in place. The clip does not look up to the job, but somehow works!
 
Should add, while you have the air box off and have good access to give the clutch release arm some lubrication where it goes through the bell housing - they are notorious for siezing. Its a good idea to give it a regular lubrication (eg when you service the car) - just a couple of drops of (engine) oil.

Also the bracket the clutch slots into is notorious for bending and cracking with fatigue over time. If you change the hydraulics, they're quite cheap to change at the same time.
 
I had a pedal that was on the floor and when I checked it was the master cylinder had excessive movement. If you have nothing to compare it to it isn't that obvious but at the time I had two K series Freelanders so was able to see exactly where the problem lay.
I probably should have replaced the master/slave but got round the issue by extending the master where it clips onto the clutch pedal by a couple of mm.
https://www.landyzone.co.uk/land-rover/k-series-clutch-replacement.296104/page-3#post-3703843
 
GrumpyGel said:
You say "The car shouldnt feel any different to straight ahead" then you say "a tiny fraction of tightening is acceptable" - that is contradictory, please let us know which you think is correct.

"ANY fwd vehicle on full lock due to CV joint limiting - NOT VCU limiting." - so when the front and back axles are moving at different speeds, the VCU is spinning freely with no viscosity?

"the results you indicate are positive of a new unit needed." - please confirm that you have no way of knowing that your statement is correct or not. You don't know how "slight" the "slight slope" is, what the speed was, tyre condition or, from your description, what resistance the CVs were giving, etc etc.

Actually, is not everything you wrote contradictory or just plain wrong?

Personally I'd have thought the OPs VCU is coming towards the end of its serviceable life - but there is nothing described to indicate that it is yet a danger to the transmission. Similarly nothing fully conclusive that it is not a danger to the transmission, but it would lean that way.
Click to expand...
Nope :) - to your general hypothesis - - enjoy your bottle - but still nope...
Lay off the pop dear boy (every night so it would seem) - it does not do you any good.

The VCU is captain cooked. :rolleyes:
 
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