Error codes and performance issues

Hi all,

I have just purchased a 2001 P38 HSE 4.6 Vogue. Took it to a Land Rover "mechanic" and he looked it over (computer test, drove it around and checked the paint if original) and assured me that everything was running well and it was a good buy for the year etc. The Land Rover Service Centre wouldn't look over the car for me as it has LPG.

When I was driving home on LPG, I noticed that when I was pressing the gas a little bit for stable town driving, the car was shuddering.. when I accelerate more, then it feels normal. But over 90-100 km/hr the car is not easy to drive, shuddering and it doesn't feel very powerful. When I change it to petrol, the engine is shuddering a lot (especially noticeable when starting in the morning before switching to LPG). Also, it doesn't go over 60-70 km/hr very easily on petrol. On LPG the engine is quiet and semi-ok when the tank is full, after half-way it feels less powerful.

When I got home I read the codes that were given to me (which the mechanic said were normal when running LPG and I wished I paid attention to before buying - I think because they don't speak English, they don't pay attention to them).
- KOD001 = Lambda sensor upstream catalyst bank 1
- KOD002 = Rough road signal implausible
- KOD003 = Oxy sensor heater upstream cat bank 1
- KOD004 = Oxy sensor heater upstream cat bank 2
- KOD005 = Mixture adaption factor FRA bank 2
- KOD006 = Lambda sentor upstream catalyst bank 2
- KOD007 = Catalyst damaging misfire multiple cylinders
- KOD008 = Catalyst damaging misfire cycl 4
- KOD001 = Short circut fault in SRS warning lamp circut 1
- KOD002 = Short to GND in RH pretensioner circut
- KOD003 = Short circut fault in driver airbag circut

Also then saw a whole lot of errors on the dash (mechanic said was due to car not being used for awhile and probably battery):
- Airbag Fault
- Bonnet open
- Traction failure, slow 55km/hr
- Sunroof not set (drove home in torrential rain/snow and sunroof was leaking)
- Occasionally an ABS error comes up

I am not mechanically-minded but sick of people saying they know what they are fixing, pulling the whole thing apart, charging me lots and then not actually fixing it. Would like to go to the Service Centre with an idea so I don't get ripped off.

Any help would be much appreciated.

Cheers,

Cathy

If the LPG is set up correctly there should be no error codes, and it should be indistinguishable from running on petrol.

Is your battery in good condition? There are a lot of error codes there, from multiple sources, it's quite hard to know where to start!

But Range Rovers need good batteries to work properly and if yours is shot it could be causing you random errors.

Put your location on your account, and someone nearby with diagnostics might be able to have a look for you.

Anyone with diagnostics fancy a holiday in Turkey ?

Looking at that list of codes, it's possible that the diagnostics kit was not communicating correctly. Poor battery/alternator can cause many errors.

Thanks all, I will get a new battery and see if that makes a difference re the codes. The electronics in the car are not great, perhaps this may help. The heater is stuck on hot on the drivers side (will be great in the summer!), and then the heater stops running all together and only starts again when turning the car off and on again!

What I am most worried about it the performance. I can't drive a stable speed in town without it shuddering, if I apply the gas, then the shuddering stops. On the open road, it can't drive comfortably at over 80 km/hr. There is just no power and it shakes a lot. When I switch to petrol, it is very shaky and there is no power over 60 km/hr. I am guessing the previous owners never used petrol and that there was always only enough to get the LPG started. When the LPG is full, it runs ok.. when it is at half-way, it feels as if it is not getting enough gas.

I will take it to the LPG "specialist" and check that the system is working ok and perhaps a filter or hose needs changing.

I am just worried that something is not great with the engine... something my passat had which resulted in a costly (and unsuccessful) rebuild. The land rover "master" mechanic is back on Monday, but if I don't like what he says it may be a trip to Ankara to see the mechanic everyone recommends.

Single point or multi point LPG?

Having the fuel trims reset may help a bit, but the first rule with Range Rover troubleshooting is ensure you have a good known strong battery and alternator charge....then go from there.

As MrGorsky says, a sorted LPg system wont throw codes and will be almost undetectable from running on petrol.

I'd be tempted to look at live data for the MAF flow, lambda switching voltages etc, as it seems to point to fueling issues.

Also the LPG system wont throw SRS or ABS faults...these are mostly likely down to low battery condition.

MrGorsky said:

If the LPG is set up correctly there should be no error codes, and it should be indistinguishable from running on petrol.

Is your battery in good condition? There are a lot of error codes there, from multiple sources, it's quite hard to know where to start!

But Range Rovers need good batteries to work properly and if yours is shot it could be causing you random errors.

Put your location on your account, and someone nearby with diagnostics might be able to have a look for you.

Click to expand...

Could you recommend a battery? I see that we had a Bosch battery previously. Again, I will need to shop around as I don't trust the people here to supply a good, or genuine, battery. Unfortunately, I had trouble importing batteries in the past for science equipment and can imagine it would be the same for a car battery.

1000cca 130a from battery megastore believe this is the one Hankook / Hankook Batteries / Batteries by Application

Datatek will confirm

Put the biggest battery you can fit in 120-130ah alphaline works well, but in Turkey its probably a case of what you can get hold off,xand gheck alternator should be 14.5-14.7 at 2000rpm if i remember correct.

I am a relative newbie to the P38 and along with the others here I cannot overemphasise the importance of a known good battery.
Also, I'm with Datatek & MrGorsky in that the error codes don't look right at all.

Whereabouts in Turkey are you?

Saint.V8 said:

1000cca 130a from battery megastore believe this is the one Hankook / Hankook Batteries / Batteries by Application

Datatek will confirm

Click to expand...

Right battery, wrong link I think. www.batterie-megastore.fr for Europe

brianp38dse said:

Put the biggest battery you can fit in 120-130ah alphaline works well, but in Turkey its probably a case of what you can get hold off,xand gheck alternator should be 14.5-14.7 at 2000rpm if i remember correct.

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14.2 for the diesel, 14.5 for the 4.6 but 14.7 is also OK for either

New you would correct me Data if i was wrong I nearly got it right, at least i wasnt low

Saint.V8 said:

Single point or multi point LPG?

Having the fuel trims reset may help a bit, but the first rule with Range Rover troubleshooting is ensure you have a good known strong battery and alternator charge....then go from there.

As MrGorsky says, a sorted LPg system wont throw codes and will be almost undetectable from running on petrol.

I'd be tempted to look at live data for the MAF flow, lambda switching voltages etc, as it seems to point to fueling issues.

Also the LPG system wont throw SRS or ABS faults...these are mostly likely down to low battery condition.

Click to expand...

Thanks so much. I will see what shows up when they take a good look at Land Rover Service on Monday.

Have just been to see the LPG technician - no faults shown up on computer and changed a filter. It is a multi-point system. Seems less shuddery at lower speeds in town now. Need to test on open road to see if I can get over 80 km/hr. Will need to sort out the petrol problems now

Castor said:

I am a relative newbie to the P38 and along with the others here I cannot overemphasise the importance of a known good battery.
Also, I'm with Datatek & MrGorsky in that the error codes don't look right at all.

Whereabouts in Turkey are you?

Click to expand...

Thanks Castor, I am in a small town in SE Turkey. Bit hard to get things here, but should be able to order from Ankara/Istanbul if I can't find anything locally.

Datatek said:

Right battery, wrong link I think. www.batterie-megastore.fr for Europe



14.2 for the diesel, 14.5 for the 4.6 but 14.7 is also OK for either

Click to expand...

Thanks alot, I will try and find a good one and see if they can order it here for me.

It had been shuddering a lot since changing to winter tyres (summer ones completely bald) and was told it needed new axle (? or arms is the direct translation I got). All the wheels had cracks and were bent outa shape. Got that fixed and a lot smoother ride. Also got them to take a good look underneath and it doesn't need the arms/axle and just had some minor tweaking. Definitely a lot more comfortable!

Cathys said:

Thanks so much. I will see what shows up when they take a good look at Land Rover Service on Monday.

Have just been to see the LPG technician - no faults shown up on computer and changed a filter. It is a multi-point system. Seems less shuddery at lower speeds in town now. Need to test on open road to see if I can get over 80 km/hr. Will need to sort out the petrol problems now



Thanks Castor, I am in a small town in SE Turkey. Bit hard to get things here, but should be able to order from Ankara/Istanbul if I can't find anything locally.



Thanks alot, I will try and find a good one and see if they can order it here for me.

It had been shuddering a lot since changing to winter tyres (summer ones completely bald) and was told it needed new axle (? or arms is the direct translation I got). All the wheels had cracks and were bent outa shape. Got that fixed and a lot smoother ride. Also got them to take a good look underneath and it doesn't need the arms/axle and just had some minor tweaking. Definitely a lot more comfortable!

Click to expand...

Reset the fuel trims and see if it is better with the MAF disconnected.

Thanks all for your help.

Got a new battery and to avoid any engine immobilisation, a new battery was attached without disconnecting a power source (ie. hooked up to a smaller battery... if I am explaining it well). However, the error codes mentioned on the dash are still there. Took it a place to clear the codes and this was also unsuccessful. Any hints as to how I can do this?

Looking like we will avoid the Land Rover service in SE Turkey and drive 12 hours to Ankara to get the recommended mechanic to look it over and fix all the problems

If you're in the back of beyond, its probably worth investing in a nanocom which can read the fault codes on most of the modules in the P38

the diagnostics on the Range Rover are pretty specific and most places or generic readers wont able able to access anything deeper on diagnostics.

If you have an ELM 327 cable i have a generic software (i've used it and another member here has as well) that can access and clear fault codes, but for the RR the nanocom will be the better bet, yes it is more expensive, but there's probably a cottage industry for fault code reading in Turkey !

Thanks a lot. Do you know if there are different brand ELM 327 cables? I have found some from a website in the UK... then checked in Turkey and they are 1/4 of the price. BUT, are they genuine?

Elm327 - GittiGidiyor

Generic OBD and ELM327 will only give limited information on the petrol models...you won't be able to access anyother system on the P38....you'll need LR specific diagnostics...nanocom is by far the most popular

For the sake of a few quid investment it's worth getting one for educational purposes in my view. It's quite informative finding a code and looking it up...

Any of those should work* by the way - I have both hard wired and bluetooth ones, both of which work fine. The bluetooth ones are less faff and good with free software on a mobile phone. Google "bluetooth OBD apps".

*Subject to limitations on the RR which are many.

But will do nothing for the dash warnings of ABS/TRACTION/SRS that the OP seems to be refering too....

Will give information on engine parameters, which as you say is very useful, but for the OP's issues of

However, the error codes mentioned on the dash are still there.

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It won't help!