1 litre of coolant - 120 miles - what's the likely cause...

major truma 2 said:

if you can smell coolant in the cab its not h g , check heater matrix and the pipes down from it ,leave the motor running till its up to temp, turn heaters on , now check for leaks , check the hose down from the matrix , and foget about h g

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If it's blowing coolant out of the radiator cap he may well smell coolant in the cab.

Ok, the ongoing saga (of denial) continues

The heater core is now bypassed at the end of the hoses that lead from the engine compartment.
(I'm aware that this may have cooling issues when running at a standstill)

The coolant leak is much reduced - hoorah!

We still get the occasional whiff (but not stench) of coolant - which I'm hoping is coming from the coolant system finding its own running level.

So I am now hoping that the coolant level will bottom out.

There is a metal pipe under the viscous fan that seems to have coolant staining on it - maybe that is the cause of the reduced leak and whiffs - I'll keep an eye on it!

TaDa said:

Ok, the ongoing saga (of denial) continues

1. The heater core is now bypassed at the end of the hoses that lead from the engine compartment.
(I'm aware that this may have cooling issues when running at a standstill)

2. The coolant leak is much reduced - hoorah!

3. We still get the occasional whiff (but not stench) of coolant - which I'm hoping is coming from the coolant system finding its own running level.

So I am now hoping that the coolant level will bottom out.

4. There is a metal pipe under the viscous fan that seems to have coolant staining on it - maybe that is the cause of the reduced leak and whiffs - I'll keep an eye on it!

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1. By-passing the heater should not create any overheating issues at all.

2. Hoorah!

3. Good and I suspect this is because there is no more coolant going through the heater matrix.

4. The pipe is called the EGR cooler - it is a water-jacket device designed to circulate coolant around the exhaust gases to cool them.

When/if you de-EGR your car, you can remove the metal pipe and join the two rubber hoses together to complete the circuit.


Reading your comments today seems to confirm my early suspicions that the leak is related to the heater matrix and it's pipework.

If you lift the front footwell carpets you may find coolant underneath.

Anyway, all positive news, well done for sticking with it.

Dave

Thanks thebiglad.

Under the carpets is bone dry - maybe the coolant was escaping through the air-con condensation drains?

The pipes I am wondering about are the ones that run along behind the bottom of the radiator about 9 inches beneath the viscous fan.
They have some coolant staining on them and look like a possible candidate for the minor leak.

It'll be cold next winter with no heater - Do you reckon I should replace the pipes to that matrix along with it?

get the old unit out, u should be able to tell where it was leaking

The old unit did not have any obvious leaks.
It'd leak now as it needed a screwdriver stabbed in it to get any purchase to pull it out.
This is what makes me suspect the pipes leading to the heater core were the real problem.

But what are the pipes beneath the fan (and behind the radiator)?

Could it be the water pump leaking on to the pipes?

TaDa said:

The old unit did not have any obvious leaks.
It'd leak now as it needed a screwdriver stabbed in it to get any purchase to pull it out.
This is what makes me suspect the pipes leading to the heater core were the real problem.

But what are the pipes beneath the fan (and behind the radiator)?

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Assuming this is a TD5 we're talking about, the coolant pipes below the viscous fan are to and from the thermostat housing (mucky cream colour) and the rad. If the hoses still have the factory spring clips, replace them with jubilee clips.

There is cylinder shaped cooler on the lhs of the engine block, that has coolant pipes going to and from it. In this cooler are rubber 'O'-rings that deteriorate and allow leakage - which could be an issue for you.

If you are going full tilt to solve this coolant leak, I would:

1. Replace all clips;

2. Replace top hose and at the same time check the condition of the alloy coolant hose mounting point, on the front rhs of the head. These are know to deteriorate and leak;

3. Replace the 'O'-ring in the lhs cooler;

4. Replace the thermostat. The coolant system is multi-stage on the TD5 and does require this compônent to work optimally. It's cheap to replace too!

5. Give the block and rad a thorough flush with a hosepipe;


What colour is the coolant at the mo? Pink, blue or green?

Sorry for the delay in replying - I just found the window still open from editing my reply last week (!!!)

Thats a pretty comprehensive list of things to check - thanks!

I'm using the landrover specific coolant (green?)
though it does seem to have a red tinge and I see red stains in various places (!!) On the whole, though, green

Yes she's a TD5

TaDa said:

Sorry for the delay in replying - I just found the window still open from editing my reply last week (!!!)

Thats a pretty comprehensive list of things to check - thanks!

I'm using the landrover specific coolant (green?)
though it does seem to have a red tinge and I see red stains in various places (!!) On the whole, though, green

Yes she's a TD5

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Land Rover TD5 coolant is PINK, if anything else is mixed with it, there is a chance of the coolant turning into a jelly-like substance.

I would be changing that immediately!

It sounds like you have various small leaks which might well add up to the total loss. The small staining does not reflect the amount of loss - the bulk of the loss is evaporated.

Could be way off but no one mentioned the fuel regulator,has a water jacket these can fail and it can sometimes be a little intermitant,worth a look?

All the places mentioned as potential leak points have been checked - thanks - but she was still losing coolant - about 250ml per 100 miles.

Last night we changed the PAS hoses (due to a leak in them too) - this required the radiator to be removed and hence a full drain of the system.

When the drain plug was removed we got a fair few litres of pink looking fluid.
When the thermostat top pipe was removed the pipe it discharged a few litres of green tinted fluid (which looks like the stuff I'd been topping up the system with for the past few months)
(I don't think it was due to the different lighting conditions)

We went on to replace the 'stat and most of the hose clips with jubilee clips.
(and of course the PAS hoses)
We filled the coolant system with unipart summer coolant and antifreeze mixed with water

Hopefully the system will stop leaking (coolant and PAS fluid) but can anyone explain the colour difference?

TaDa said:

All the places mentioned as potential leak points have been checked - thanks - but she was still losing coolant - about 250ml per 100 miles.

Last night we changed the PAS hoses (due to a leak in them too) - this required the radiator to be removed and hence a full drain of the system.

When the drain plug was removed we got a fair few litres of pink looking fluid.
When the thermostat top pipe was removed the pipe it discharged a few litres of green tinted fluid (which looks like the stuff I'd been topping up the system with for the past few months)
(I don't think it was due to the different lighting conditions)

We went on to replace the 'stat and most of the hose clips with jubilee clips.
(and of course the PAS hoses)
We filled the coolant system with unipart summer coolant and antifreeze mixed with water

Hopefully the system will stop leaking (coolant and PAS fluid) but can anyone explain the colour difference?

Click to expand...

The pink stuff is extra longlife coolant (which doesn't mix with normal coolants well) - supposed to be good for 5 yrs

The green is normal stuff good for 2 yrs.

Does the differing positions within the system of red and green coolant suggest a likely location for a leak - after all I have only topped her up with the green coolant for the last couple of years.
It suggested to me maybe a leak between the header tank and the top thermostat hose.
Or would the differing colours have chased themselves around the system and it was just going to be pot luck which colour came out of where?
(The red somehow managing to not be the one leaking out each time)

Could it be that the old stat was faulty and therefore your topping up of the system with green was over pressurising the top of the sytem and it was being expelled from the overflow in the expantion tank. Does sound like things have not be circulating very well for a while, hopefully the new stat will now sort this out. Oh and it it fairly common to have to top up again say after 100 miles or so after a full drain down so don't count the first top up as its still leaking if you know what I mean!! have fun

TaDa said:

Does the differing positions within the system of red and green coolant suggest a likely location for a leak - after all I have only topped her up with the green coolant for the last couple of years.
It suggested to me maybe a leak between the header tank and the top thermostat hose.
Or would the differing colours have chased themselves around the system and it was just going to be pot luck which colour came out of where?
(The red somehow managing to not be the one leaking out each time)

Click to expand...

What surprises me is that the 2 colours of coolant hadn't mixed - it might be an indication that the 'stat wasn't working correctly.

This is all sound quite positive

When the coolant and PAS fluid stop dripping off the front of the car and the two levels have settled I will be a happy man.

Thank you for your endurance on this trial

some green coolants are long life.

The Mad Hat Man said:

some green coolants are long life.

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Correct
It appears that manufactors can use any colour of dye they choose in their antifreeze..
As stated in this link below,

"The color of antifreeze is no longer an accurate indicator as to whether it is an IAT,​

OAT, HOAT or NOAT formulation."

http://cc.derekharris.com/Antifreeze in 2010A4V1.pdf

I'll stick to Halfords stuff which is red/yellow when pouring it from the bottle into the rad.

I like to come back to this!

I recently (finally) got a new heater matrix. When it was replaced I got the pipes leading to it replaced too.
This required the whole dash to come out.
When the dash was out the rubber coolant pipe that runs down the back of the engine was visible and - surprise surprise - it had a hole in it!
It had diesel on it and it is surmised this is what caused it to perish and leak.
It wasn't the biggest of leaks but they all seem to have added up!

Anyway hopefully that'll be an end to it

At least it'll be warm for the winter!