Very black under rocker cover...

tom1979 · Aug 7, 2023

I know that engine oil in diesels does turn black quite quickly, but quite honestly this is filthy and the second time I've seen it like this in a row when changing the oil. I don't normally remove the rocker cover when changing the oil but I noticed this the last time I changed the oil so wanted to check again.

Any ideas what causes it to get *this* dirty? Attached photo is after approx 3000 miles. It's not a sludge, just a very fine layer of cr*p that wipes off easily. It seems like slightly more than just dirty oil.

Someone has suggested piston rings, another injector seals. However I have no running issues whatsoever and I would expect something if either of those were the cause. Mileage is around 135,000 miles and I use Comma PD Plus oil, no additives etc, genuine LR filters.

Plan at the moment is to just change the oil weekly for a few weeks and check again, but interested in other peoples ideas....

lynall · Aug 7, 2023

Could be worrying over nothing.
Does it use any oil?
Does it start well?
Keep on trucking.

steve2286w · Aug 7, 2023

Same under timing cover and sump too and anywhere oil flows, I guess if you clean all these areas up it might stay a bit cleaner for a while , but some areas might not have seen daylight In decades, I’m rebuilding this diesel, and hoping to get it running on th e ground so will be interesting to see how quickly oil blackens

saxavordian · Aug 7, 2023

tom1979 said:
I know that engine oil in diesels does turn black quite quickly, but quite honestly this is filthy and the second time I've seen it like this in a row when changing the oil. I don't normally remove the rocker cover when changing the oil but I noticed this the last time I changed the oil so wanted to check again.

Any ideas what causes it to get *this* dirty? Attached photo is after approx 3000 miles. It's not a sludge, just a very fine layer of cr*p that wipes off easily. It seems like slightly more than just dirty oil.

Someone has suggested piston rings, another injector seals. However I have no running issues whatsoever and I would expect something if either of those were the cause. Mileage is around 135,000 miles and I use Comma PD Plus oil, no additives etc, genuine LR filters.

Plan at the moment is to just change the oil weekly for a few weeks and check again, but interested in other peoples ideas....

View attachment 294611

I wouldn't show the picture of oily engine block to a effeminate just stop oil protesters. They probably hyperventilate.

saxavordian · Aug 7, 2023

saxavordian said:
I wouldn't show the picture of oily engine block to a effeminate just stop oil protesters. They probably hyperventilate.

Then again, might make it easier to lift the bunch with a bucket digger, and dump the lot to one side.

tom1979 · Aug 7, 2023

lynall said:
Could be worrying over nothing.
Does it use any oil?
Does it start well?
Keep on trucking.

Could well be, it just seems odd. I work on a lot of different Td5's and not seen another like it - even the neglected ones! It doesn't use oil, starts drives and stops fine so I guess I'll just change the oil a few times over the next few weeks and see.

lynall · Aug 7, 2023

tom1979 said:
Could well be, it just seems odd. I work on a lot of different Td5's and not seen another like it - even the neglected ones! It doesn't use oil, starts drives and stops fine so I guess I'll just change the oil a few times over the next few weeks and see.

Has the small spinner filter been changed?

tom1979 · Aug 7, 2023

lynall said:
Has the small spinner filter been changed?

Every oil change, which there has been about 4-5 changes in the last 17,000 miles. Always genuine too.

tom1979 · Aug 8, 2023

I changed the oil again today, and actually took the centrifugal filter out and cut it open - there was nothing in there except the same filthy film of crud as everywhere else! I'll run it another 500 miles and change the oil again....

Discodevon · Aug 23, 2023

tom1979 said:
I changed the oil again today, and actually took the centrifugal filter out and cut it open - there was nothing in there except the same filthy film of crud as everywhere else! I'll run it another 500 miles and change the oil again....

Hi Tom hope you are well mate I would definitely be using a different oil if I was you, especially if the oil says c3 on it

tom1979 · Aug 30, 2023

Discodevon said:
the oil says c3 on it

Sorry only just seen this! I use Comma PD Plus 5w40 normally. I believe that is a C3 oil, what do you think the issue with that would be? I've been using it since the font of all knowledge @sierrafery recommended it many years ago! Smith and Allan do a 5w40 to VW spec that is ACEA A3/B3

Henry_b · Aug 30, 2023

201k TD5

So long as the cam and roller rockers are in good nick just change the oil a few times, it might clear her out.

depends on the quality of the oil used too and the frequency of the changes, its probably had a few extended drain intervals in its life which would be to blame..

tom1979 · Aug 30, 2023

Henry_b said:
201k TD5

So long as the cam and roller rockers are in good nick just change the oil a few times, it might clear her out.

depends on the quality of the oil used too and the frequency of the changes, its probably had a few extended drain intervals in its life which would be to blame..

That's what I like to see! I don't know the history of the engine as it was a replacement engine from a breaker about 3 years ago. I did do the head gasket before fitting the engine so I could have a good look and it all looked in good order.

It's tempting to use one of those engine flush additives but I can't help but think they are like snake oil and a few extra changes would probably do a better job.

Henry_b · Aug 30, 2023

I think you'd be better off with just a few extra changes.

sierrafery · Aug 30, 2023

Hi, Even though i'm sick of oil debates i'd like a scientific explanation for that statement:

Discodevon said:
I would definitely be using a different oil if I was you, especially if the oil says c3 on it

as about the subject of this thread, if the Comma PD oil was the problem my engine would be the same like Tom's while mine is clean as a whistle which IMO is normal as C3 has a lower portion of sulphate ash, phosphorus, and sulphur than A3/B3 which keeps the oil "cleaner" also it has higher thermal breakdown limit.

sierrafery · Aug 31, 2023

On the subject... what about the blow by on your engine, undo the filler cap and let it idle, it should behave like this, if it's not so smooth and bouncing then IMO your probem is with excessive crankase gasses which are contaminating the oil

tom1979 · Aug 31, 2023

sierrafery said:
On the subject... what about the blow by on your engine, undo the filler cap and let it idle, it should behave like this, if it's not so smooth and bouncing then IMO your probem is with excessive crankase gasses which are contaminating the oil

Evening! No mine is just like that, no blow by at all. As suggested above it may just be that in "history" it wasn't so well looked after and needs more regular changes than I normally do. My Defender uses the same oil and is clean as a whistle. I'll change it a few more times at extremely frequent intervals and see if it improves.

sierrafery · Aug 31, 2023

tom1979 said:
It's tempting to use one of those engine flush additives but I can't help but think they are like snake oil and a few extra changes would probably do a better job.

I had positive experience about two years ago with liqui moly engine flush on my wife's formal Hyundai Santa Fe which was quite the same as your's in this thread(didnt know it's service history as well) so i tried it, i followed this video which was new then ... i sold that vehicle one year later but at that time it was nice and clean as i changed the oil before that

Discodevon · Aug 31, 2023

Not wishing to start an oil debate but can you wipe the black stuff off with your finger Tom ?

tom1979 · Aug 31, 2023

Discodevon said:
Not wishing to start an oil debate but can you wipe the black stuff off with your finger Tom ?

Yep it comes straight off but it's a job to wash off your hands. Horrible stuff whatever it is.

Very black under rocker cover...

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