P38 v8 no spark but engine turns.

[Ian A]

Hi one and all

I have read quite a bit on this site in the last week or so and i like it a lot.

I decided to treat myself to a Range rover 4.6 and found one that ticked most of the boxes, i have only had it since the beginning of December, it's a late 99 on a V plate, 4.6 with multi point lpg in dark green, it is so nice to drive and feels a mile away from my 95 Disco v8 3.9 lpg.

I did look into possible faults before i bought it, bad blocks, air suspension, airbags etc, but i love it or did until Friday.

I didn't use the car on Thursday, went to go out on Friday and it wouldn't start, the battery is a little suspect, but it turned over OK, i put my jump battery on as well but still wouldn't fire.

I then went through my DVD i bought and it said for not starting check start relay, well not much use that is then.

I next checked for a spark, ahhh found the problem w've run out of them, back to DVD and this site, crankshaft position sensor, right i will order one, it came today, i tested the ressistance of the old unit and the new one and they were the same , so fitted the new one and it started went in to have me dinner, came out to drive into town and the f****r wont start, no spark again, i have checked the fuses and relays and all looking very clean.

There are no fault messages on the dash like alarm/immobiliser, battery, alternator, only the airbag fault message that was there when i bought it.

Has any one else had this problem on the v8, i know there are postings on here for the diesel and others that the engine won't even spin over, but that's all i have been able to find.

Any help, ideas would be very much appreaciated, many thanks in advance.

Ian

 

[al-one-arm]

i dont know where the crank position sensor is, but could you have touched any other wires around it, or have you checked its wires and connector? also , is the switch set to petrol not gas?

 

[gavbriggs]

unplug as many plugs as you can find and check for corrosion, clean and replace.

also check yr in N or P otherwise it wont start. i believe the CPS is on the front of the engine? cant remember without the rave cd(The Green Oval - Downloads | Land Rover Data cd2 if you dont have it) there are plugs on the top of the engine, front, attached to the plenum. i removed one or both of these at one point and it wouldn't start but would turn over. also i have tried starting in drive and that did the same. if you have yr eka code and all the plugs are in tact and clean, take the earth lead off the battery and leave for half an hour then try to start it. ONLY DO THIS IF YOU HAVE THE EKA CODE AS YOUR ENGINE WILL BE DISABLED!!

also check your gas system is switch to petrol only as this could be causing the problem or maybe as said above a wire is loose

 

[Ian A]

Hi Al-one
The sensor is positioned at the rear left hand side of the engine by the sump, behind the cat, there aren't any wires other wires there, but i did check the plug again, i did try with the lpg switch in petrol only, it is a auto change over system, you can only have it on auto or petrol only.

this is one thing i didn't like about the lpg system, in my Disco a tank of petrol lasted me 12000 mls, left it on gas only.

Thanks
Ian

 

[eightinavee]

Getting bored with the same question - the answer is its lost its security link between the engine ecu and the BECM.

 

[Ian A]

Hi Gavin
I will go right through the plugs and sockets tomorrow, everything looks very clean as i don't think it's ever been off roaded, i got a rave DVD that i think covers the whole Landrover range, (bring back the old style Haynes manuals).

Mine has not got the oblong plenum chamber, it is the newer one with the cross over pipes, but it would still have the sensors though i presume.

The engine turns over unless it is not in Park or Neutral, i have the eka code and have tried it and it's the same, havn't tried it after disconnecting the battery, but i have no fault message

Many thanks
Ian

 

[gavbriggs]

Getting bored with the same question - the answer is its lost its security link between the engine ecu and the BECM.

that'd be a trip to the stealer/call out then?

question is why would it work then not then new sensor, work then not? something is causing the problem to occur and it may return if its not sorted? best to try the obvious first cos usually its free and easy and not knowing the op's abilities or what he may or may not have tried and my knowledge of only the stuff i have read or experienced, however stupid like the 'N or P' escapade i got into then i assume the fella wants some advice on what it may be before he spends hundreds going to a stealer to find it needs a plug cleaning or a switch moving. or even worse for them to keep the car trying the things he could do at the roadside and be charged for the privilage.

althoughi do agree it could be the link between the ecu and becm, it could also be other things and the stealer is, in my opinion a last resort for a fault that is unknown!

 

[Ian A]

Hi Eightinavee
Is this the case i need to disconnect the battery for 30 mins + and do the key in the door job then.

Ian

 

[Ian A]

that'd be a trip to the stealer/call out then?

So i gotta get phoning around tomorrow then, what is a rough cost of this, any idea.
Ian

 

[brutusmotorsport]

£50

 

[Ian A]

hi all
just a bit of an update, trailered my r/r to a garage today, the guy took one look at my car and informed me he had allready looked at it before i had bought it, he then informed me that he was not able to fix it back then.

he got the phone number of the guy that did manage to get it going, so a phone call to the garage and the range rover is there now, the problem he thinks, is a broken wire in loom to the module at the rear of the engine bay near the air suspension box.

so waiting for a call to say he has found the culprit.

so back to the disco v8 till then, will let you know the outcome.

ian

 

[johnboyairey]

hi i hope you have got it all sorted by now, but i had a similar problem not too long ago myself. i previously had the inlet mainifold off, and not knowingly had stretched the wire leading down to the Crank Position Sensor (CPS) it goes down the back of the engine/bellhousing, on the oil dipstick side, and has a block connectior onto the cps. rear of block towards bellhousing, above CAT..... after getting no spark, i checked it, -gave it a wobble, no, removed it. replugged it, no. cups of tea, still no. got back under, PULLED EACH ACTUAL WIRE ENTERING THE CPS CONNECTOR PLUG, AND ONE CAME OUT! revealing a spade terminal. removed connector, re-inserted spade term, replugged, pulled wires, -ok, started it -PRESTO, kettle on!
I had half pulled the wire out, working on the induction area of the engine, but it looked ok. -it was oily, and i didnt want to get too dirty i reckon! there is also a camshaft sensor on the front timing cover. on my GEMS engine, remove viscous fan to access, thats a massive spanner hit in the clockwise direction, mind the radiator fins as for the camshaft sensor they are expensive! CPS is not, and also, there is a coilpack connector block at the rear of engine, difficult to see, -worth looking at, runs up to coil pack, quite short,

-read up on EKA in handbook/wallet before dicionnecting battery, you will get a 30 minute lockout when reconnecting, before you can even start to fix it. this was put in by a clever land rover designer. so the owner can have at least two more cups of tea before having another attempt at re-synching the key/becm do things slowly and methodically it will work. do this wrong three times, and its another two cups of tea. (30min lockout) dont leave the key in the barrel without a window down. a low/disconnected battery will lock the car, with key in!

 

[Ian A]

Hi Johnboy
still not got my range rover back yet, went over on Monday and they have not even loked at it yet :doh:

Someone else on here (freppesito) had excactly the same fault and his was it lost the computer code.

Having spoken to people who have tried to fix last time, everyone has changed the crank position sensor and with the one i changed it has had 4 in just over a year.

I noticed when i changed the cps that the cable from the plug to the loom had got hot in the past, i think it was resting on or near the cat converter, so i was thinking that it might be the fault, bang it on the code reader to confirm, repair the cable, and drive away ha ha ha.

mine is the later one with the Motronic injection, so i can't easly see the camshaft sensor, i thought it was going to be a quicker option to get it pluged in and find the fault that way.

I have tried the eka code and it didn't make any differance, but it locked, unlocked, little red light flashes and no fault displayed on the dash, so i don't know, just waiting for them to pull there thumb out of there a** and get on with it.

Ian

 

[Irishrover]

Viscous coupling on a petrol P38 is a standard **Right Hand** thread!!!

 

[johnboyairey]

Ian, i forgot all about this thread, what was the fault, so we can all benefit. (please) -that assuming that it IS fixed!

 

[gavbriggs]

the module near the eas on a p38, isnt that for the cruise contol?

 

[Jamiehol]

the module near the eas on a p38, isnt that for the cruise contol?

On the later cars its where the ECU sits.

 

[gavbriggs]

ahhh, so whats the module he's on about? isnt it the fuel drier or reciever or something of that ilk?

 

[eightinavee]

Ahh,decent product knowledge,its so reassuring.....

 

[gavbriggs]

i only know the bits that have gone wrong on mine, i'll get round to em all eventually!