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L322 Vanos rattle? And fault codes- help!

Discussion in 'Range Rover' started by GavV8, Mar 4, 2018.

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  1. brianp38dse

    brianp38dse Well-Known Member

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    Having just looked closely at the invoice for the work as it mentioned sunbury @ovalandrover had dealings with these guys rebuilding his m51 engine and they buggerd it up twice and his nanocom went walkies, I would not trust their work as to what has been done.
     
  2. GavV8

    GavV8 Member

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    Quite possibly. I have just fired it up from cold and using a stethoscope it was definately from the front of rocker cover area. Will upload cold start vid now.

    Will wait for 30mins until hot and then i will again probe around for where its coming from with the stethoscope
     
  3. GavV8

    GavV8 Member

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  4. GavV8

    GavV8 Member

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    5 mins in and it sounds spot on. Quiet as a mouse. Will wait until it gets hot. Reset the fault cose but they have come back quickly same 3 codes
     
  5. Goc3k

    Goc3k Active Member

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    Which side of V was the noise coming from when warm, same side you changed the chain guide? (or did you change the center one?) - and was the noise from the top of the rocker right over the vanos / cam sprocket or front as in almost central to the cam sprocket?

    Does the timing error code come back within 3 minutes of idling, or not until the engine warms up also? (once cleared)

    That cold rattle at the start is acceptable, never had a hydraulic lifter bmw engine in any configuration that doesn't have a momentary rattle before going quiet when stone cold
     
  6. GavV8

    GavV8 Member

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    The item i changed was the hydraulic tensioner drivers side. Not a guide.
    The sound hot and cold is from passenger bank. I have just taken a video now its hit and will upload that
     
  7. GavV8

    GavV8 Member

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    And the sound is back now warmed up.......
     
  8. Goc3k

    Goc3k Active Member

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    Too busy misreading your op or being in shock about only changing one guide there lol

    Did this change the tone even marginally?

    I'm still tempted to say its chain / guide related with the extra info & after hearing yesterday & again today with new vids it is probably not the vanos. Worn guides can cause slack in only certain areas of the chain, and even a few millimeters of slack out of spec being taken up and let off as the engine turns at idle can create a whole array of bizarre sounds and effects, especially also as the thundering seems to ease off considerably as you apply throttle.

    Is taking it apart enough to get a borescope in feasible? Even if its totally unrelated to the current issue it might shed cheap light on the subject. I'd assume you can check the drivers bank guides through the oil filler (at a total guess), and the passenger bank with the valve cover off? Might be worth having a look for plastic in the sump as well if you have the time, but no doubt there is stuff in the way of it on the l322.

    Fingers crossed anyway mate. let us know how you get on if there are developments
     
  9. Saint.V8

    Saint.V8 Dyed-in-the-wool 100% RR Junkie

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    Thats not VANOS....far too deep, what you hear on initial start when cold - thats VANOS rattle, but once it is warm, that is a deep rhythmic knock....

    Chains tend to slap and rattle with a cadence, what I can hear is a very constant, rhythmic knock in time with engine speed.....lifters are a hot toned tick, I am tempted to say a big end bearing possibly.....it sounds heavy and something with momentum to it.
     
  10. Goc3k

    Goc3k Active Member

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    Aye it's only from stabbing in the dark thoughts. I used to work with a chap who had a hobby of wrecking old BMW's, or "drifting" as he insisted it was, and after ruining 2 e36's with m52s in he moved onto an e39 with an m62, and that came with a similar steady noise at idle once warmed up, touch more clattery than Gav's but it had a degree of the thunder sound to it, sort of like air being shoved about out of time, and the running theory was the the valvework jumping with the slack on the "bad" bank, while the other side stayed nearer in time, giving the on off sound (not that we ever stripped it and looked, being proficient workmen)

    That's partly what made me think of the thermostat swap, as the noise pretty much went away with a gruesomely thick 60 weight in it and an 85c stat (used to overheat with the original in it after a few runs). It did another 6-8 months or so before he ripped the nearside rear wheel and hub assembly off without trouble if memory serves, though.

    Seems to go away somewhat with revs in the first vid, and a bad big end traditionally gets worse with load, sort of hard to tell without being there in the flesh though. Does the rattle worsen or clear up while actually driving about, especially foot down?
     
  11. GavV8

    GavV8 Member

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    When you put your foot down or even cruising its barely audible. Only when you come to a junction and back down to idle can you hear it
     
  12. holidaychicken

    holidaychicken Well-Known Member

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    watching this with interest, i have new guides chains and rebuilt vanos and i am getting a warm idle knock but not as loud as this, I have seen many with the same issue after timing chain job.
    I have blocked cats, a leaking exhaust, and a few other issues to contend with inclduing a bearing noise that goes away after a few minutes, then quiet, then warm idle knock although sometimes it is dead quiet after a good run which leads to to think HVA. i have bought a GAS timing kit and will remove my cam covers and if i don't find anything I will start to strip and re time. i also have a spare vanos unit that i have rebuilt again with beisan seals.
    This engines are notoriously noisy with a million different causes.
    In your case I would be resolving the timing issue first.
    Normal start up rattle followed by warm idle knock is vanos units.
    there are a number of people offering re manufactured vanos units that are actually stripped down which i could do.
    I'll let you know what i discover.
    Apart from the light knock mine pulls well but i know i have an issue with the cats that i need to resolve.
    check your spark plugs are to the correct torque as they can leak

    my potential theory is the cheap timing kits that are used to retime these engines are not quite accurate and can cause a slight mismatch between banks and the cam chains to fight one another slightly causing the knock bu that could be bollox
    Also i think turning the engine over by hand with no oil pressure could cause the HVA to leak down and tap as again people have had tapping after the timing chain job
     
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