Legal towing with a Series III 88 - Sankey related

This site contains affiliate links for which LandyZone may be compensated if you make a purchase.
300bhp/ton

300bhp/ton

Well-Known Member
Posts
5,029
Location
Near MK
I know there are a lot of threads and info on towing out there. However, I hadn't seen this answered, so thought I post it for a sanity check.


According to a Series III manual, a SWB (88) has a Gross Vehicle Weight of 2120kg. Which I assume is equivalent to a MAM.


Page 26: http://www.landroverweb.com/Pdf-files/Manuals/Land_Rover_Series_III_Part_1.pdf


And a Max Permissible Towed Weight of a 2000kg trailer with over-run brakes.

Land_Rover_Series_III_Part_1.pdf.png


As I understand it, for those who took their driving test after Jan 1st 1997 and haven’t taken their trailer test. A Series 88 Land Rover should allow you to tow a trailer with a weight (MAM) of 1380kg assuming it is a Station Wagon.

Rational:
  1. The trailer AND tow vehicle combined MAM cannot exceed 3500kg.
  2. The trailer (assume MAM) can’t weigh more than the tow rating of the vehicle.
  3. And the snag… the MAM of the trailer cannot exceed the Unladen Weight of the tow vehicle.

The different body configs of an 88 have different unladen weights, although all have the same Gross Vehicle Weights.


The result of this is for petrol powered 88's:
88 Canvas Hood Unladen Weight = 1298kg
88 Truck Cab Unladen Weight = 1307kg
88 Hard Top Unladen Weight = 1338kg
88 Station Wagon Unladen Weight = 1418kg​

Diesels weight a little more unladen.


This would mean only the Station Wagon can attain the total combined MAM of 3500kg. The other body configs (Canvas hood, Truck Cab, Hard Top) would need to limit the trailer MAM to that of their laden weight.

The silly thing here is, the same vehicle just with a different roof on can tow different weight trailers…..

From what I understand, a “Sankey” style trailer Wide Track:
  • Payload = 750kg
  • Trailer Weight = 509kg
MAM = 1259kg​

I suspect there might be some variation of Sankey style trailers in terms of their weight, but would guess they are all similar.

However it looks like it should be perfectly legal to tow a Sankey style trailer with any Land Rover SIII 88 without the need for an additional trailer test.



Anyone able to confirm or deny any of this?
 
Hicap phill said:
I thought you could only tow a trailer up to 750 kgs max without a test?
Click to expand...
Nope, which is why I posted.

You can tow a max 750kg trailer, if your tow vehicle has a MAM of 3500kg. Meaning the total MAM can exceed 3500kg. However, if you keep the total MAM below 3500kg, you can tow more than 750kg trailer, based on the variables in my opening post.
 
Hicap phill said:
Going by dvla website you can have a MAM of 3500kgs.including the trailer.
Hope your correct with your calculations? ;)



View attachment 155478
Click to expand...

Okay so I could tow a sankey with my 90 unladen or lightly loaded based on that.

Are my calcs correct?

Sankey - 509kg + 750kg payload = 1259kg

Defender 90 - 1870kg (MAM 2550 - payload 680kg)

Laden sankey 1259kg + laden 90 2550kg = 3809kg - not allowed as over 3500kg MAM

laden sankey 1259kg + unladen 90 1870kg = 3129kg allowed as under 3500kg

Is that correct?
 
flat said:
Okay so I could tow a sankey with my 90 unladen or lightly loaded based on that.

Are my calcs correct?

Sankey - 509kg + 750kg payload = 1259kg

Defender 90 - 1870kg (MAM 2550 - payload 680kg)

Laden sankey 1259kg + laden 90 2550kg = 3809kg - not allowed as over 3500kg MAM

laden sankey 1259kg + unladen 90 1870kg = 3129kg allowed as under 3500kg

Is that correct?
Click to expand...

Erm....no.

The MAM doesn't change. Max Authorised Mass assumes fully laden whether talking about vehicle or trailer.
 
flat said:
Okay so I could tow a sankey with my 90 unladen or lightly loaded based on that.

Are my calcs correct?

Sankey - 509kg + 750kg payload = 1259kg

Defender 90 - 1870kg (MAM 2550 - payload 680kg)

Laden sankey 1259kg + laden 90 2550kg = 3809kg - not allowed as over 3500kg MAM

laden sankey 1259kg + unladen 90 1870kg = 3129kg allowed as under 3500kg

Is that correct?
Click to expand...
The stumbling block is the combined MAM figure of the tow vehicle and trailer. This can’t exceed 3500kg. If the MAM of the 90 is 2550kg, then the max MAM trailer you could tow is 950kg.

If you got a Sankey replated to that amount and didn’t overload it. Then yes you’d be fine. But the payload of the trailer would be significantly reduced.

It’s stupid legislation and ill thought out. As it means better, safer tow vehicles can’t be used to tow the same weight trailer.
 
blue beasty said:
Erm....no.

The MAM doesn't change. Max Authorised Mass assumes fully laden whether talking about vehicle or trailer.
Click to expand...

Aah okay didn’t realise that

300bhp/ton said:
The stumbling block is the combined MAM figure of the tow vehicle and trailer. This can’t exceed 3500kg. If the MAM of the 90 is 2550kg, then the max MAM trailer you could tow is 950kg.

If you got a Sankey replated to that amount and didn’t overload it. Then yes you’d be fine. But the payload of the trailer would be significantly reduced.

It’s stupid legislation and ill thought out. As it means better, safer tow vehicles can’t be used to tow the same weight trailer.
Click to expand...

A sankey replated would be pointless imo would hardly be able to carry anything. I would be better off either doing my trailer test or getting a trailer that weighs less than an empty sankey, for practical purposes.
 
A trailer test would be easy. You have their motor & trailer which are easy to manoeuvre.
Enquire. It's amazing what you will tow when your allowed.
 
300bhp/ton said:
Costs a lot of money. I’m also maybe a tad too old to be taking tests. And unlikely something to be accomplished by Thursday evening.
Click to expand...

I think it is about £100 if you supply your own vehicle. I am always on at my daughter to do it, she is 34. Well worth it, even if you don't want to tow yourself. As I have often said to her, what if she was a passenger with someone towing a trailer or caravan, and the driver was taken ill/

Might be tricky to get one by Thursday, though. Can't you get a friend with a licence to tow it for you?
 
Turboman said:
I think it is about £100 if you supply your own vehicle. I am always on at my daughter to do it, she is 34. Well worth it, even if you don't want to tow yourself. As I have often said to her, what if she was a passenger with someone towing a trailer or caravan, and the driver was taken ill/

Might be tricky to get one by Thursday, though. Can't you get a friend with a licence to tow it for you?
Click to expand...
The basic test is £120-140 I think, but tbh I'd probably hire a vehicle and trailer. They are really funny about having the "right" trailer. It has to be an exact size, shape and weight. Not just any trailer.

They are also funny about the tow vehicle and won't even let you take the test if you don't have additional towing mirrors fitting, a friend got turned away and sent home. Despite being in a 90, which has mirrors more than big enough to see down the sides of the test trailer. But maybe it is our local test station that is very specific.

My brother and cousin have taken their trailer tests in recent years. It costs about £400 for the hire of a vehicle, trailer and lesson before, as a 1 day intensive. And the silly thing is, it's a complete gamble on if you will pass. Whether founded or not, our local test station has a reputation of failing people for no real reason. As essentially they can always find something to fail you on. My cousin got minus marks (the max allowed and still pass) for not using the cruise control on the tow vehicle, despite the fact he didn't even know it had cruise and had only driven it for the first time 2 hours prior.

My brother was also told by the instructor not to use low range when reversing the trailer, that is an instant fail.

I don't really need to be taught how to tow, for years (I'm 38 BTW) I've been driving tractors with 10 tonne of corn behind them. But being shown how to try and pass the test is probably worthwhile.

And despite that, I've never really had an actual 'need' to tow, although sometimes it would be useful.

As for the Sankey, if it's legal tow as is, why not? Seems silly not too and no need to find another to tow it.

On this note, it makes a complete mockery of the trailer test anyway. As right now I and others can legally tow any 750kg trailer and with a bit of thought such as my opening post, can tow just under 1400kg. That's a kit car on a suitable trailer or maybe even a small caravan. The trailer test doesn't test or teach any differences between a lighter trailer and a heavier one, they take the view that you can't tow at all without it. Which is rather silly.

And of course, no additional licence is required to drive and tow these.



 
300bhp/ton said:
The basic test is £120-140 I think, but tbh I'd probably hire a vehicle and trailer. They are really funny about having the "right" trailer. It has to be an exact size, shape and weight. Not just any trailer.

They are also funny about the tow vehicle and won't even let you take the test if you don't have additional towing mirrors fitting, a friend got turned away and sent home. Despite being in a 90, which has mirrors more than big enough to see down the sides of the test trailer. But maybe it is our local test station that is very specific.

My brother and cousin have taken their trailer tests in recent years. It costs about £400 for the hire of a vehicle, trailer and lesson before, as a 1 day intensive. And the silly thing is, it's a complete gamble on if you will pass. Whether founded or not, our local test station has a reputation of failing people for no real reason. As essentially they can always find something to fail you on. My cousin got minus marks (the max allowed and still pass) for not using the cruise control on the tow vehicle, despite the fact he didn't even know it had cruise and had only driven it for the first time 2 hours prior.

My brother was also told by the instructor not to use low range when reversing the trailer, that is an instant fail.

I don't really need to be taught how to tow, for years (I'm 38 BTW) I've been driving tractors with 10 tonne of corn behind them. But being shown how to try and pass the test is probably worthwhile.

And despite that, I've never really had an actual 'need' to tow, although sometimes it would be useful.

As for the Sankey, if it's legal tow as is, why not? Seems silly not too and no need to find another to tow it.

On this note, it makes a complete mockery of the trailer test anyway. As right now I and others can legally tow any 750kg trailer and with a bit of thought such as my opening post, can tow just under 1400kg. That's a kit car on a suitable trailer or maybe even a small caravan. The trailer test doesn't test or teach any differences between a lighter trailer and a heavier one, they take the view that you can't tow at all without it. Which is rather silly.

And of course, no additional licence is required to drive and tow these.



Click to expand...

I suspect you are right about it being the local test station that has decided to interpret the rules in that way. The testing station in Camborne, where I used to live, passed several people known to me in their own vehicles, with their own trailers.

I doubt if you would have any problems with the test, I learnt to tow exactly the same way, with tractors and trailers. Gives a good grasp of reversing and manouevring the rig. The reason tractors don't require testing is that the speeds are fairly low, so trailer swing rarely becomes an option.

As to why not just tow the Sankey, my own angle on it would be that Sankeys are a very old design, and actually rather a horrible tow compared to a modern twin axle trailer.
 
Turboman said:
I suspect you are right about it being the local test station that has decided to interpret the rules in that way. The testing station in Camborne, where I used to live, passed several people known to me in their own vehicles, with their own trailers.

I doubt if you would have any problems with the test, I learnt to tow exactly the same way, with tractors and trailers. Gives a good grasp of reversing and manouevring the rig. The reason tractors don't require testing is that the speeds are fairly low, so trailer swing rarely becomes an option.

As to why not just tow the Sankey, my own angle on it would be that Sankeys are a very old design, and actually rather a horrible tow compared to a modern twin axle trailer.
Click to expand...

Look the part behind a defender though
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

styleruk
Another A frame towing question
Replies
9
Views
1K
MrF
M
v8250
Sankey Penman Trailers...what differences?
Replies
2
Views
3K
v8250
v8250
v8250
174 cars for sale...with Land Rover content. London
Replies
0
Views
932
v8250
v8250
benpalmer
Camping Trailer Defender Sankey Hybrid
2
Replies
28
Views
3K
twizzle
twizzle
Sunray-I40
Sankey Expedition/Overland Trailer + Maggiolina Roof Tent
Replies
1
Views
3K
kevstar
kevstar
Back
Top