Head bolt re-torque

Hey guys,

Total ballache, my heater matrix is still getting locked up every so often, especially when I drive the car hard. There is simply nowhere in the cooling system where air can be getting it (mine is EWP, not normal for those who haven't been following.) I'm also using a small amount of coolant - so I'm led to the suspicion that a little eggsauce gas is still leaking into the coolant - the head was done 3k ago by me and DD and we did a thorough job. However even at the time we thought the head bolts went in too easily with the "current" MGRF settings.

I don't know if the HG can have gone again as it's been like this from fooking day one. Either the head needs to be clamped down tighter, or the entire lump is fooked with a warped block or summat . It's not a huge deal to bleed it of once or twice a week and top up every two weeks or so (only loses and inch or so in the tank) but it is a pain in the balls and it makes me want to drive the car like a bone china bus. It's getting in my tits like.

So, can I re-torque the head bolts and if so how? At this point I'm wondering if it's easier to swap the lump. I've worked bloody hard on this car, as y'all know, and this continuing problem is not endearing it to me. I don't want to fall out of love with my Hippo, can someone help ?

Will.

kermit would say obviously you could just give all bolts a tweak ,most lr engines lose coolant but heater going cold is an issue,the best time to fit an mls gasket is before failure,how can head bolts go in to easily ?its hard to know whether its your modified circulation or failed gasket etc

Hiya, I've always personally been taught to renew the cyl head bolts as some stretch, however I'm not sure this is the case on the freelander engine

How much you loosing per week, is there any sign within the engine oil filler cap

Please don't think I'm interfering etc

Gary

May I ask could it have warped the head in any way

If the bolts went easy would that mean there stretched already

Is the torque wrench you used faulty

Gary

jamesmartin said:

kermit would say obviously you could just give all bolts a tweak ,most lr engines lose coolant but heater going cold is an issue,the best time to fit an mls gasket is before failure,how can head bolts go in to easily ?its hard to know whether its your modified circulation or failed gasket etc

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I know that the engine has had at least one major overheat and HGF in the hands of the last owner. There was a MLS in it when it went for the second time but it was extremely poorly installed. Unlikely to be caused by the modified circuit, coolant loss and gas leak are linked I think.

gstuart said:

Hiya, I've always personally been taught to renew the cyl head bolts as some stretch, however I'm not sure this is the case on the freelander engine

How much you loosing per week, is there any sign within the engine oil filler cap

Please don't think I'm interfering etc

Gary

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No worries Gary, I'm like a hawk with faults on this car now and know the engine very well. This is basically minor HGF I think, but the gasket is probably not sitting right rather than being buggered. The head was skimmed when we did the last HG job, it hadn't been before.

However I worry that the engine has had too many problems and may be beyond repair - the liners weren't all that proud when we checked them. Borderline acceptable I'd say.

May well be time for a new lump . Or more likely a new car - there's only so much I'm going to throw at this.

how do you mean poorly installed ?as ive said before there are no guarrentees with over heated ali head ,but its that or other you need to find out

jamesmartin said:

how do you mean poorly installed ?as ive said before there are no guarrentees with over heated ali head ,but its that or other you need to find out

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The job was sloppy, bathroom sealant used to seal the rocker cover and other general signs of not giving a ****. God knows whether they even tightened the head bolts at all properly.

When we did it we put in new dowels, new bolts, the good MLS and shim and a new timing belt and (vaneless) water pump. But the bolts were very easy to tighten to the "correct" settings with the torque wrench and then the angular tightenning. It didn't feel quite right but we thought they must be right.

didn't you use new bolts?

Freelaner said:

didn't you use new bolts?

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Yes mate we did as good a job as it is humanly possible to do. Either the MGRF settings are bunch of crap or my engine is a no hoper.

new rail as well?

Freelaner said:

new rail as well?

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2003 spec so came with it as standard I believe .

WLJayne said:

2003 spec so came with it as standard I believe .

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what I was getting at was the threads in your rail may have been fubared by the previous hg replacement, in which case it could let go.

Freelaner said:

what I was getting at was the threads in your rail may have been fubared by the previous hg replacement, in which case it could let go.

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Possible, perhaps it's worth giving them a quarter turn tweak each? Could see how that goes and if it lets go again then we'll know. Worst that can happen is that it goes to scrap. You can pick up non HGF R75 lumps for not much on ebay these days.

Though the call of the TDi and a Mig Welder is a siren song to me these days ....

WLJayne said:

The job was sloppy, bathroom sealant used to seal the rocker cover and other general signs of not giving a ****. God knows whether they even tightened the head bolts at all properly.

When we did it we put in new dowels, new bolts, the good MLS and shim and a new timing belt and (vaneless) water pump. But the bolts were very easy to tighten to the "correct" settings with the torque wrench and then the angular tightenning. It didn't feel quite right but we thought they must be right.

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new one often dont ,they dont feel like std bolts ,you cant stop a head moving ,you can justy ensure clamping pressure is ok and like mls it doesnt matter as with old gasket were when sealent was disturbed your buggered,contolling cooling wont stop movement just stop it been sudden and likey to disturb sealant

WLJayne said:

Possible, perhaps it's worth giving them a quarter turn tweak each? Could see how that goes and if it lets go again then we'll know. Worst that can happen is that it goes to scrap. You can pick up non HGF R75 lumps for not much on ebay these days.

Though the call of the TDi and a Mig Welder is a siren song to me these days ....

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if mine ever does it again it will be repaired and sold

jamesmartin said:

new one often dont ,they dont feel like std bolts ,you cant stop a head moving ,you can justy ensure clamping pressure is ok and like mls it doesnt matter as with old gasket were when sealent was disturbed your buggered,contolling cooling wont stop movement just stop it been sudden and likey to disturb sealant

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But surely I shouldn't be asked to live with constant air locks and unreasonably quick coolant drop? I don't think clamping pressure is what it should be. This is bleddy annoying.

Freelaner said:

if mine ever does it again it will be repaired and sold

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Entertainng thougts along similar lines but will gut the EWP and replace with standard hoses. Glad I kept my **** tyres now, the BFG's are still worth quite a bit second hand.

I can't believe I'm thinking this. There must be a solution!!!!

WLJayne said:

Entertainng thougts along similar lines but will gut the EWP and replace with standard hoses. Glad I kept my **** tyres now, the BFG's are still worth quite a bit second hand.

I can't believe I'm thinking this. There must be a solution!!!!

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mine works perfectly well with the uprated bits and bobs but i still check it everyday

WLJayne said:

But surely I shouldn't be asked to live with constant air locks and unreasonably quick coolant drop? I don't think clamping pressure is what it should be. This is bleddy annoying.

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increase it ,what have you got to lose ,no you shouldnt but its all engineering ,you just dont know which part isnt right ewp , head,liners,bolts ,block,poor gasket ,poor rad cap etc

WLJayne said:

Entertainng thougts along similar lines but will gut the EWP and replace with standard hoses. Glad I kept my **** tyres now, the BFG's are still worth quite a bit second hand.

I can't believe I'm thinking this. There must be a solution!!!!

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why not ?