Glow plugs knackered?

Was tinkerin' today and noticed where the wire goes onto the glow plugs there was quite a bit of movement... ah take it they're knackered?
If so, then how does this affect the engine?

Cheers

a good 200/300 shouldn't really need the plugs to start - does it tighten up ?

Sean said:

a good 200/300 shouldn't really need the plugs to start - does it tighten up ?

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Ah never use mine to start Sean mate

Haven't really checked to see if they tighten or not yet. Ah'm sure ah read summit somewheres that they can affect the emissions or summit??

ermmmm nope - they are only ever in use for the first 20 seconds of each cold start

not having them working may well give rise to a little more black smoke on start up but that'll be gone in the first puff of smoke

diesels that NEED the plugs to start is usually an indication of less than ideal compression

Sean said:

ermmmm nope - they are only ever in use for the first 20 seconds of each cold start

not having them working may well give rise to a little more black smoke on start up but that'll be gone in the first puff of smoke

diesels that NEED the plugs to start is usually an indication of less than ideal compression

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Aye, got the smoke on start up... but then most folk do
Might sound a bit daft this, but would air get past them and do summit?

bustersbus said:

Aye, got the smoke on start up... but then most folk do
Might sound a bit daft this, but would air get past them and do summit?

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if air was getting past them you'd notice the connection being covered in soot - as is the case when an injector isn't sealed properly - and you'd hear a steady phuft phuft in time with the revs

Sean said:

if air was getting past them you'd notice the connection being covered in soot - as is the case when an injector isn't sealed properly - and you'd hear a steady phuft phuft in time with the revs

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Ah might just have tae go and have a look before it gets too dark.. cheers Sean

Evening Buster. The very tips of your glow plugs sit through the head of your engine when they're properly in place. So in effect, if you had no glow plugs installed, it'd be like having four holes drilled straight through your cylinder head allowing all the compression to escape. Try taking them out, it'll make a really loud popping sound when you turn the engine over and it wont start. They should be a tight fit, but don't over tighten them because the tips have been known to break off (due to excessive tension), which'll knacker your piston crowns and put nice big pits in your head!

A quick tip (just in case you didn't know), if you're scared that you've drawn water or any other incompressible material into your cylinders - Remove the glow plugs and then turn the engine over. Any water / debris will be blasted out through the glow plug hole at lightning speed!

-Pos

As SEAN says a diesel in good order should not need glows to start.
They'll make it much easier to start in the winter though. For what they cost I'd pull them and make sure they're working. If in doubt change them all and keep the old ones as spares.

Connect them one at a time across a good battery and watch to see if they glow red hot at the TIPS. If they glow further along the shaft and the tips are cold then they are on their way out. Needless to say hold them in a pair of pliers and not your pinkies when testing because it smells horrible and 'kin hurts otherwise.

You should be able to pick them up for about a tenner for four.

Landrover Defender 200Tdi Set of Glow Plugs on eBay (end time 25-Oct-09 13:27:26 GMT)

LAND ROVER 200 & 300TDI GLOW PLUGS DISCOVERY DEFENDER on eBay (end time 07-Oct-09 12:38:22 BST)

Later matey.

Shifty1962 said:

As SEAN says a diesel in good order should not need glows to start.

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What about a 300 running on biodeisel ???

Here is an example of somebody who knows not a lot.

5 x LAND ROVER DISCOVERY/DEFENDER TD5 GLOW PLUGS on eBay (end time 04-Oct-09 14:53:15 BST)

The TD5 only has 4 glowplugs even though its a 5 cylinder engine. The TD5 plugs cost half as much again as the Tdi series plugs though. Typical - guess which ones I need.

BTW my LR main stealer wants £22+vat PER PLUG and wont do me a discount for four. Says they are rock bottom prices as it is. He also tried to tell me that it is not a DIY job to change them because you need special tools. Went all quiet when I told him I'd changed the head and injectors, all outdoors, with my basic tools and not a specialist tool in sight other than a torque wrench.

Tim.C said:

What about a 300 running on biodeisel ???

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Dont use the stuff myself and have never owned a Tdi engine so I have no idea whether it will start without glow plugs. Too much fannying about for my liking all that bio stuff, chemicals, and tank heaters etc.
My TD5 starts with the glows disconnected and I'm using filtered used hydraulic and engine oil. Not tried it in the cold weather yet though.

Shifty1962 said:

Dont use the stuff myself and have never owned a Tdi engine so I have no idea whether it will start without glow plugs. Too much fannying about for my liking all that bio stuff, chemicals, and tank heaters etc.

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Too much fannying about ????????

I just drove in, filled up, and paid 89ppl

My disco is taking a lot longer to start since I filled t with bio. Changed front fuel filter - no change.

Not got to the sedimenter yet.......

Tim.C said:

What about a 300 running on biodeisel ???

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if by biodisel you mean the pre-processed stuff you buy in garages - yes

if you mean filtered WVO or neat SVO from Tesco - also yes

more than enough info on here already about doing it

Sean said:

if by biodisel you mean the pre-processed stuff you buy in garages - yes

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OK do you mean yes it will need the glow plugs and won't start properly if they're knackered?


If so that would explain why it happened when I switched from doozel to bio - only previously had a problem when really cold - ie snowing.

Tim.C said:

Too much fannying about ????????

I just drove in, filled up, and paid 89ppl

.......

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Granted if you are not making it yourself but 89ppl is way too expensive for a tight old bastard like me.

Cost me about 10ppl after I've thinned and filtered the FREE used oil.
Most of the cost is the unleaded petrol I use to thin the oil.
A 20 litre jerry converts to about 200 litres of usable fuel.
I use 5% in the hydraulic oil and roughly 10% in the engine oil.
My engine dont seem to notice the difference and it sailed through its MOT on the stuff. I might have to increase the % for the cold weather though so it might get up as high as 20ppl.

Tim.C said:

OK do you mean yes it will need the glow plugs and won't start properly if they're knackered?


If so that would explain why it happened when I switched from doozel to bio - only previously had a problem when really cold - ie snowing.

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if it's snowing the actual outside temp wont be overly cold but if your finding the engine is harder to start then first think about the plugs then think about getting a compression test done

a 200/300 with plenty of compression will start without plugs on SVO and a dash on thinners even at minus 5 - it'll be a bit lumpy for the first 30 seconds

I've run 80 percent SVO and 20 percent dino fuel when the outside temps have been down to minus 12 - and how often does it get like that in this country ?

Shifty1962 said:

As SEAN says a diesel in good order should not need glows to start.

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A 200TDi, 300TDi, TD5 & Puma maybe yes But not a series diesel, a 12J or a 19J!!! They're absolute t w a t s to start without any prior heating, regardless of how good a condition they're in. It's a totally different fueling concept

-Pos

pos said:

A 200TDi, 300TDi, TD5 & Puma maybe yes But not a series diesel, a 12J or a 19J!!! They're absolute t w a t s to start without any prior heating, regardless of how good a condition they're in. It's a totally different fueling concept

-Pos

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i disagree I've done many many miles on SVO in a 19J (TD) 90 and that started on the button each and every time - poor starting is mostly down to compression, plugs just help by reducing the amount of compression needed before the fuel goes bang

pos said:

A 200TDi, 300TDi, TD5 & Puma maybe yes But not a series diesel, a 12J or a 19J!!! They're absolute t w a t s to start without any prior heating, regardless of how good a condition they're in. It's a totally different fueling concept

-Pos

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Good point - well made. Not so sure about the Puma engines either as it has optical sensors in the fuel line to look for contaminated fuel. If it cant see through the fuel the ECU wont let it crank let alone start. Completely rules out used engine oil unless you can bypass the optical sensor.