engine problem extraordinaire

soory posted first in the wrong place.

I have the 2 1/4 diesel engine fitted in my Land Rover. Normally it runs OK, a bit smoky when you first start it but runs fairly clean when it's warm.

Today I was driving along normally when suddenly there was a big old rattle, sounded like it came from the top end of the engine and thick white smoke from the exhaust and when I say thick I'm talking smoke grenade thick. So, I pulled over to find oil all over the top of the engine, looked like it had come from the breather. After a while I restarted and everything appeared fine, however, after a few miles the temperature got higher than normal, not over heating just to the top of the N. I continued home, parked on the drive, left it for a couple of hours, cleaned the oil from the top of the engine, went for another drive and everything seemed absolutely fine!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Took it to the garage and he tested and said the head gasket was fine, 99% sure.

So, anybody, any ideas?!!! and if it's fcuked how easy are these engines to rebuild, do I buy a new engine or do I slap a 200 tdi or transit engine in it?

I would quite like to keep the old girl as original as possible so generally speaking are the old diesels reliable or not?

white smoke is either steam or unburnt fuel so if your gaskets ok I'm guessing sticky valve which would give a nasty top-end rattle, loss of compression and lots of white smoke.

The old 2 1/4's are pretty tough, esp the later 5 bearing cranks, just sluggish

Doesn't explain the oil though stuck piston ring maybe and pressurising the crankcase

cheers blue beasty, your a star as usual. it did sound like the valves rattling lots. do you recken i should take it apart and unstick the valve or keep driving it. i wont hold any ill will if it goes bang.

Can't answer that for you really.......might be an intermittent thing that doesn't rear its head for ages but the best thing would be to find the problem. If its smokey on start-up you probably need new valve guides anyway

its not really likely to sticky valve

is that a fairly easy job or an engine out and rebuild the bugger kinda thing?

oh and is worth doing "it all" while i am at it?

and another thing, anyone rebuild these things, like rings, valve seals, ect. if so what would it cost?

yes do it for a living, check you have all rockers going up and down fully before anything else

I had a similar problem with oil blowing out the breather cap when I first bought my S3, the enginge was pretty bad and had been buggered around with. Anyway, I found the problem with the oil was, right below the breather cap is a bolt which holds the rocker assembly in place, which is also an oilway, it was missing!!, as in, not put back in !! It was firing oil straight up the cap!!

Is it possible you've something loose which has jammed a valve?

Just a wild guess, worth taking of the lid and having a peek.

mad git said:

I had a similar problem with oil blowing out the breather cap when I first bought my S3, the enginge was pretty bad and had been buggered around with. Anyway, I found the problem with the oil was, right below the breather cap is a bolt which holds the rocker assembly in place, which is also an oilway, it was missing!!, as in, not put back in !! It was firing oil straight up the cap!!

Is it possible you've something loose which has jammed a valve?

Just a wild guess, worth taking of the lid and having a peek.

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something loose like a missing rocker bolt that should be just below the oil breather?

i will have a look.

ok so now i am realy confused, took the rocker off and all looks good, so took it for another drive and. now it dont smoke, runs cooler, more power but sounds a bit tappety???????????????
big hammer i reckon.

push rods can punch through followers which can lead to increased crank case pressure if its exhaust valve not opening fully ,the slide that follower runs in can wear to the point follower can jam occasionally

jamesmartin said:

push rods can punch through followers which can lead to increased crank case pressure if its exhaust valve not opening fully ,the slide that follower runs in can wear to the point follower can jam occasionally

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if this was the case and you owned it would you :-

1. drive it till it went bang and then find another engine.
2. fit another engine.
3. rebuild the current engine.

you say you rebuild these things for a living, before i ask i know you cant tell exactly untill you look inside it. what would be the aproximate cost of a "good standard ,reliable" engine rebuild. landrover dropped off with you and picked up when complete. how long (also appox) would you need it for.

at the moment i am thinking of getting a 5 bearing any condition engine, rebuilding it myself to a good standard then doing an engine swap......... or paying someone to get the current engine to "as new" standard.

if anyone has any other thoughts let em rip but i quite like the "rural" feel of the 2.25d and dont need to get any place quickly so would like to keep the old girl as origional as possible. she is a toy rather than my only mode of transport so can do without her for a while if needed, though i will start getting withdrawel symptoms very quickly.

pull head off and repair depending on condition of rest of engine ,i do like the idea of rebuilding them rather than replacing as finding good one isnt easy

jamesmartin said:

pull head off and repair depending on condition of rest of engine ,i do like the idea of rebuilding them rather than replacing as finding good one isnt easy

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ok aprox cost of doing this?

£600ish in parts and rebore ,but 200 would be perhaps similar fited yourself

many thanks for all the help so far.

i had a good fiddle this weekend and adjusted the valve clearances, sealed the rocker with a new gasket and fitted a new breather cap.

no more oil leaks (from the top of the engine anyway) and the blue smoke has reduced when cold and engine runs clean when warm.

i still get (twice in 150 miles) a phut,phut,phut sound from the exhaust for about 10 seconds, followed by a rattle from the engine and blue smoke from the exhaust, this is not as bad as it was and lasts about 2 seconds, then all is well for another few days?
i have recently used injector cleaner in the fuel but am not knowledgable enough to know if this could cause it.
i am suspecting a sticky valve, theory being anything more serious would not be intermittant.
i did notice one of the rockers had a lot more play when wiggled side to side than the others (no5)

i have decided to keep using the landy and find another engine that i plan to rebuild myself to a good standard and when done do an engine swap, this is so i can still use the old girl and can rebiuld the engine when time and money allow, giving me the satisfaction of doing it myself.

i want to keep her origional so will be fitting the 2 1/4 diesel.

so my questions are.

1. will any old engine do if i am planning to completly rebuild it, any way.
2. would just rebuilding a head and replacing that be ok, or just false economy.
3. anything that i cant do in my garage that would require an engine specialist(other than a rebore)?

the basic engine are the same except for 3 and 5 bearing crank,i would rebore and fit new pistons and redo head etc new head on old engine isnt best fix, obviously replace other worn parts and you will have good engine for a long time to come, send block with new pistons for rebore insist it has at least 1 thou honed to size after boring for best finish ,send old cam a new bearings for them to fit , grease bores and wash block thoroughly upon return ,clean bores when ready with thinners or similar , head will need new guides (cheap )and seats cutting send new valves with head,the rest you can do your self gap rings ,fit rods etc ,the only other tricky bit is timing cam which needs to be spot on using dti (dial test indicator)it is vital to be exact otherwise engine will never run right