EAS- problems

Range0815 · Jan 29, 2011

Hello,
i rebuild the compressor and the valveblock with new o ring, diaphragma...
i think the non "return valves" are not okay, because the front of my range is dancing.
Is it possible to buy only new non return valves?
The dealer, who sold me the o- rings inform me, that i have to recalibrate the highlevelsensors.
How can i recalibrate the highlevelsensors?
Thanks for Information!

Regards
Range0815

JohnP38 · Jan 29, 2011

Range0815 said:
Hello,qqqqqq
i rebuild the compressor and the valveblock with new o ring, diaphragma...
i think the non "return valves" are not okay, because the front of my range is dancing.
Is it possible to buy only new non return valves?
The dealer, who sold me the o- rings inform me, that i have to recalibrate the highlevelsensors.
How can i recalibrate the highlevelsensors?
Thanks for Information!

I dont think it is possible to buy new non return valves.
I presume he means Height sensors.if you havent replaced any of the sensors and the EAS operated normally before you rebuilt the valve block,then they should not need to be calibrated.
if youn wish to do so ,then download the free EAS software from Storey wilson(rsw solutions)..

Regardsqq
Range0815

qqqqqq

wammers · Jan 29, 2011

JohnP38 said:
qqqqqq

The three NRVs control directional air flow within the valve block. They are not the cause of the suspension dancing.

Range0815 · Jan 29, 2011

wammers said:
The three NRVs control directional air flow within the valve block. They are not the cause of the suspension dancing.

Hello,
i know, that one NRV is there, where the air goes to the airdryer.
What is the reason for the dancing?

Ridesafe · Jan 29, 2011

moosic too lowd?

Hat, coat, ....door!!!

wammers · Jan 29, 2011

Range0815 said:
Hello,
i know, that one NRV is there, where the air goes to the airdryer.
What is the reason for the dancing?

If you stripped your valve block and only found one NRV you have a problem. There should be three all next to each other two one way
one the other. Like this.

SLY-SY · Jan 29, 2011

WOW it's almost been a few years since I saw that.

Nice pic WAMMERS.

Poor quality battery can be 1 of many reasons why the P38 will 'dance'. Driver pack can be an issue.

JohnP38 · Jan 29, 2011

wammers said:
The three NRVs control directional air flow within the valve block. They are not the cause of the suspension dancing.

The NRV,s I believe may cause dancing.When the RR is dancing,leave engine running (vehicle stationary) and open the drivers door.If the dancing dosent stop it is likely a NRV leaking back.

eightinavee · Jan 29, 2011

Leaking air springs or knackered height sensors will also make them dance.

rewmer · Jan 29, 2011

The NRV in the picture looks OK. They can develop a ridge on the cone part that can prevent them from seating properly.

wammers · Jan 29, 2011

JohnP38 said:
The NRV,s I believe may cause dancing.When the RR is dancing,leave engine running (vehicle stationary) and open the drivers door.If the dancing dosent stop it is likely a NRV leaking back.

How does an back leaking NRV make the car dance if all the corner valves the exhaust valve and the inlet valve are shut. It has to be something cycling the valve block. An incorrect sensor reading is favourite i would think. Were the sensor is telling the ECU it is too high then too low and the ECU can't decide which.

JohnP38 · Jan 29, 2011

wammers said:
How does an back leaking NRV make the car dance if all the corner valves the exhaust valve and the inlet valve are shut. It has to be something cycling the valve block. An incorrect sensor reading is favourite i would think. Were the sensor is telling the ECU it is too high then too low and the ECU can't decide which.

A sensor can certainly cause similar symptoms.
AFAIR NRV,s can cause "dancing symptoms* when the compressor runs and air is fed to the reservoir it can also find a path via leaking NRV to the front airbags.This causes the front to dance.
This happened to mine a couple of years ago and i cured it by cleaning up the NRV,s and reinstalling them..

wammers · Jan 30, 2011

JohnP38 said:
A sensor can certainly cause similar symptoms.
AFAIR NRV,s can cause "dancing symptoms* when the compressor runs and air is fed to the reservoir it can also find a path via leaking NRV to the front airbags.This causes the front to dance.
This happened to mine a couple of years ago and i cured it by cleaning up the NRV,s and reinstalling them..

Sorry that is not possible.

JohnP38 · Jan 30, 2011

wammers said:
Sorry that is not possible unless there are several valves also leaking.

I can agree to disagree over this.This is well documented on RR.net and is also promoted by one of the suppliers of EAS spares on that site.
There are also numerous posts there refering to this issue.
it is where I picked up on this while I was still living in SA.It cured my front end from moving up/down.
I have not studied the EAS pnuematic diagram recently,but will do so when I have the time.(prehaps not obvious from diagram?)
I have every respect for your extensive knowledge of the EAS system,but no one knows everything.
What I do know is that front dancing has been cured by stopping NRV,s from leaking on a number of P38,s.There is of course other causes as well .( driver board,height sensor)

wammers · Jan 30, 2011

JohnP38 said:
I can agree to disagree over this.This is well documented on RR.net and is also promoted by one of the suppliers of EAS spares on that site.
There are also numerous posts there refering to this issue.
it is where I picked up on this while I was still living in SA.It cured my front end from moving up/down.
I have not studied the EAS pnuematic diagram recently,but will do so when I have the time.(prehaps not obvious from diagram?)
I have every respect for your extensive knowledge of the EAS system,but no one knows everything.
What I do know is that front dancing has been cured by stopping NRV,s from leaking on a number of P38,s.There is of course other causes as well .( driver board,height sensor)

Sorry but it is not possible. With compressor running as you say, the EAS can only go UP it CANNOT go down. Which it would need to do to cause dancing. No exhausting of air is possible when compressor is running because the reverse flow back through drier contains high pressure air. To get the front end dancing both front corner valves would need to be open and the inlet and exhaust valves would need to be cycling. One would ask how air finds it's way into front bags as you say and not the rear ones as all are fed from the same gallery. NRV 1 controls one thing only, it locks high pressure air in the tank. If that fails there can be no tank pressure. Failure of this valve cannot cause dancing. NRV 2 in front of the inlet valve controls directional flow into pressure gallery via inlet valve. It's purpose is to prevent air back flowing into tank (if tank is empty) from partially pressurised bags when inlet valves and bag valves open to raise suspension. Failure of this valve cannot cause dancing. NRV 3 seals exhaust valve from high pressue air when pump is running and also controls flow of exhausted air back through drier to blow any water contamination out to atmosphere. Failure of this valve and a leaking exhaust valve would cause high pressure air to be admitted to main gallery. IF any of the corner valves were open it would cause the suspension to rise, but it cannot fall because there is no exhaust path. As this is closed when compressor is running by diaphragm solenoid valve applying pressure to lower diaphragm forcing it against exhaust outlet allowing pressurising of tank.Therefore failure of this valve cannot cause dancing. I suggest you study the schematic diagram on page 7 of Rave EAS.

wammers · Jan 30, 2011

IN GEAR HEIGHT REQUEST

When the transmission is moved out of Park, the system will request Standard ride height.
The ride height lamp will flash during this process. The compressor operation will be stopped
if the vehicle exceeds 1 mph to allow the front axle to level. The leveling operation opens
both front corner valves for only three seconds to allow pressures to equalize between the
front air springs. This will be repeated every time the vehicle speed drops to zero. In stopand-

go traffic a lot of extra valve activity may be heard

From EAS service bulletins. Dancing explained.

Datatek · Jan 30, 2011

wammers said:
IN GEAR HEIGHT REQUEST

When the transmission is moved out of Park, the system will request Standard ride height.
The ride height lamp will flash during this process. The compressor operation will be stopped
if the vehicle exceeds 1 mph to allow the front axle to level. The leveling operation opens
both front corner valves for only three seconds to allow pressures to equalize between the
front air springs. This will be repeated every time the vehicle speed drops to zero. In stopand-

go traffic a lot of extra valve activity may be heard

From EAS service bulletins. Dancing explained.

Now that is an interesting and useful piece of information

Range0815 · Jan 30, 2011

Hello,
thanks to all for the very interesting informations.
Especially to wammers and JohnP38!
When i open the driverdoor the dancing will stop.
So, i hope, the NR'V are okay.

Before i change all o- rings in the valveblock and repair the compressor the Range was dancing. I don't notice that as an failure.

The next days i start to recalibrate the height sensors.
I hope i do no mistake by this process.

Do i need sutch parts for the recalibraten?

What is very important by this work?

Regards
Range0815

sandyt · Jan 30, 2011

wammers said:
IN GEAR HEIGHT REQUEST
When the transmission is moved out of Park, the system will request Standard ride height.
The ride height lamp will flash during this process. The compressor operation will be stopped
if the vehicle exceeds 1 mph to allow the front axle to level. The leveling operation opens
both front corner valves for only three seconds to allow pressures to equalize between the
front air springs. This will be repeated every time the vehicle speed drops to zero. In stopand-
go traffic a lot of extra valve activity may be heard

From EAS service bulletins. Dancing explained.

Interesting thanks for that explains a lot

wammers · Jan 30, 2011

Range0815 said:
Hello,
thanks to all for the very interesting informations.
Especially to wammers and JohnP38!
When i open the driverdoor the dancing will stop.
So, i hope, the NR'V are okay.

Before i change all o- rings in the valveblock and repair the compressor the Range was dancing. I don't notice that as an failure.

The next days i start to recalibrate the height sensors.
I hope i do no mistake by this process.

Do i need sutch parts for the recalibraten?

What is very important by this work?

Regards
Range0815

Tools not really needed but make life a lot easier that's for sure.

EAS- problems

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