Catalytic converter missing

Ok, so my "bargain" 3.6 tdv8 2010 has just had some bad news, whilst getting some ball joints replaced the mechanic noticed welding on the cats, on closer inspection it seems the insides of the catalytic converters have been removed and welded back up.
It this an MOT fail or are the cats separate to the dpf?

I thought tampering with any part of the emission control system was now an MOT failure, "if" it's spotted by the tester. The tester won't remove under shields to inspect the cats.

He took them off to inspect inside them

During an MOT test tho, they cannot remove anything. You see plenty of advisorieas about for undertrays/sillcovers fitted etc

Kev12 said:

During an MOT test tho, they cannot remove anything. You see plenty of advisorieas about for undertrays/sillcovers fitted etc

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He noticed that both cats had been crudely cut open, bent back and badly welded back together so due to new rules with the mot he had to investigate. He said had it been done properly then nobody would have noticed.
It's all logged online now so even if I go elsewhere they have that information and I'm guessing they will pick up on it as well?

Pickle jar said:

He noticed that both cats had been crudely cut open, bent back and badly welded back together so due to new rules with the mot he had to investigate. He said had it been done properly then nobody would have noticed.
It's all logged online now so even if I go elsewhere they have that information and I'm guessing they will pick up on it as well?

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Doesnt sound right to me, I thought he could fail it if it looked tampered with, but still not remove anything

Kev12 said:

Doesnt sound right to me, I thought he could fail it if it looked tampered with, but still not remove anything

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Yes he called when he noticed it, he said he couldn't pass it without looking first so I gave the go ahead. He said it could have been done properly by removing the cat and just smashing the inside out with a big screwdriver and nobody would have been any of the wiser. It's passed the mot no problems other than this. Anyone got an exhaust for sale???

I once had an early petrol freelander which failed on emissions.
On checking, the complete inside honeycomb filter arrangement had gone, I assumed it had disintegrated and blown out the exhaust. New cat's aren't that expensive nowadays

You said that the car was in for a ball joint job - was it also there for an MoT?

boguing said:

You said that the car was in for a ball joint job - was it also there for an MoT?

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Yeah it only went in for the ball joints but we decided to do an MOT whilst it was in. It's due in two weeks anyway.

Pickle jar said:

Yeah it only went in for the ball joints but we decided to do an MOT whilst it was in.

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As the MOT tester has spotted it, then you've no alternative but to replace it.

"8.2.2.1. Exhaust emission control equipment
You only need to check components that are visible and identifiable, such as diesel oxidation catalysts, diesel particulate filters, exhaust gas recirculation valves and selective catalytic reduction valves.

If a diesel particulate filter has clearly been cut open and rewelded, you should reject it unless the vehicle presenter can show evidence that there was a valid reason to cut it open, such as for filter cleaning.

Defect Category
(a) Emission control equipment fitted by the manufacturer missing, obviously modified or obviously defective Major
(b) An induction or exhaust leak that could affect emissions levels Major
(c) Evidence that the diesel particulate filter has been tampered with Major"
https://www.gov.uk/guidance/mot-ins...-commercial-vehicles/8-nuisance#section-8-2-2

He shouldn't have removed them during the conduct of the test & just failed on (a).
But you OK'd them to have a look & if the insides were still present & it passed the emissions test likely would have given you a pass.
Sound like a reasonable garage!

There are people out there who find they have a cat problem so send them oft to be emptied for free then returned. The content is prescious metals and other stuff. Its a scam. If they're empty you will need new cats.

Hippo said:

There are people out there who find they have a cat problem so send them oft to be emptied for free then returned. The content is prescious metals and other stuff. Its a scam. If they're empty you will need new cats.

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There's not much precious metal in a cat, a few tenths of a gram.
It's possible to remove the guts of a cat on a diesel, as cat function isn't tested at the MOT. However they shouldn't be tampered with, and will fail the MOT if the tester sees them to be.

I must be confused with the back box. Think my v6 had platinum in it.

There's a rise in cat theft from hybrid cars according to the police warnings.

The precious metals market is very variable. The 3 main elements used are Platinum, Palladium and Rhodium. The values of these can vary significantly and even though there are only very small amounts used per catalyst the market prices for the metals makes it economical for nefarious individuals to go to the efforts they go to steal cats from vehicles.