Land Rover field report (and rant)

Yesterday I added some figures regarding my main vehicles. And got to a saddening conclusion.

Land Rover: used on 6 full Safaris (2000+ km each, 30-40% of it off-road across the bush)

Total approx. 13,000 km from March 2010 (1986 built, unknown mileage on 200TDi bought used from the UK)

Total break-downs: 8 (I'm only counting faults that resulted in the immobilisation of the vehicle for immediate repair)

- Right front shock turret ripped off

- Gear selector broke

- Front end bushings went to tatters in the field

- Fuel pump died

- Left front shock turret ripped off

- Front radius arm bushings went to tatters in the field

- Coolant hose passing along valve cover popped out in the field (caught it immediately because of the steamy smell, but if it had been one of my drivers, the engine was toast)

- Pick-up bed broke in the field - the side walls are just resting on flimsy aluminium brackets pop-riveted under the flat bottom... And this is supposed to be a Mil-Specs vehicle! (Ex-MOD Rapier 127")




Landcruiser: used on 12 full Safaris, plus all sorts of professional trips to the bush

Total approx. 50,000 km from June 2008 (1997 model HZJ77, 160,000 km on the clock)

Total break-downs: Zero.




I still prefer the Landy for a bush ride, more comfortable in the rough, and better off-roader.

But it's a shame that the Solihull engineers never went around building a quality vehicle. They simply built a brilliant off-roader that is easy to fix, and made sure that you would need the "easy to fix" bit - and learn more about field repairs than you ever suspected there was to know about.

I also have a deep grudge against today's Land Rover Co because, although they built their brand image on a go-anywhere 4x4 that more or less conquered Africa and other places, they've completely forgotten their origins and today are not producing a single model that is bush-worthy.

When I mean bush-worthy, I mean a car that you can actually take to the African bush under African condition, and work with in the field when your livelyhood depends on it - not a shiny rig on which you can spend umpteenth thousands of pounds in order to prepare it for one expedition.

Maybe one day they'll realise that if they've been selling lots of 4x4 to city guys, it's because of the hardened bush-guy image in the background, and that if they lose that image people may start looking for other reasons to buy a car, like for example quality... And that would be bad news.

You can still get relatively uncomplicated new Landrovers but they will be to order and built by Special Vehicles

For a 1986 vehicle with unknown milage on the engine, I would say that's not half bad.

All of the things you mention should have been checked and replaced if necessary before you set out on your adventures -- shock turrets for example, would have been obviously corroded, I expect it was the studs on the turret ring that sheared. Bushes should have been replaced as a matter of course. Old/perished coolant hoses should have been replaced as a matter of course.

The only things on your list which I would count as breakdowns are the fuel pump and gear selector. Fuel pump (I take it you mean lift pump) is a common failure point on diesel Landies, and should have been carried as a spare anyway. Particularly as you bought your vehicle not knowing milage/history.

Agree with you about the 'bush worthiness', though. Wish LR had continued to produce 300 Tdi powered Landies, in small numbers for those who really need a basic reliable workhorse.

Heart of hearts, do you really treat these vehicles the same when on safari?

I mean, you've had two suspension components ripped off. How come?

The bushes are serviceable items, I assume these weren't newly (or even recently) fitted bushes when you set off.

Keep using the land cruiser for your safaris I say. When that fails on you, and you can't fix it anywhere near as easy or cheaply as the defender, I'm sure you'll change your mind.

12000 km in the rough in a 25 year old vehicle? And one that clearly hadn't been cared for too well (some of those breakdowns should have been prevented). Not bad I reckon.

I've had landys for summit like 8 years. I bought my current TD5 with the headgasket gone. I bought my 110 v8 defender with an overheating fault, I bought my previous 300tdi with a sloppy number 4 piston. I've never failed to get one of my landys home under its own steam. My oldest landy was a 1983 series 3 and the newest is my 1999 TD5. Granted I don't take my landy into the bush. They all spend/spent around 50% of their mileage either offroad or on snow/ice though. A lot of it is down to how you drive it.

ratty said:

I've had landys for summit like 8 years. I bought my current TD5 with the headgasket gone. I bought my 110 v8 defender with an overheating fault, I bought my previous 300tdi with a sloppy number 4 piston. I've never failed to get one of my landys home under its own steam. My oldest landy was a 1983 series 3 and the newest is my 1999 TD5. Granted I don't take my landy into the bush. They all spend/spent around 50% of their mileage either offroad or on snow/ice though. A lot of it is down to how you drive it.

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aint you got anything betterer to do this morning
mornin ya fat face fukka

buckshot said:

aint you got anything betterer to do this morning
mornin ya fat face fukka

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Morning Slobber chops.

It's the calm before the storm.

It's been pretty quiet for the last couple of days so I've been doing other things between breakdowns. I'm just waiting for it to hit 9am so that rush hour is out of the way and then I gotta go to our depot in Bristol to fit a tyre to my truck cos it's getting a bit low and I don't rekon it'll make it through the weekend.

After that I gotta go back to my depot and remove and then start stripping an engine from one of our Iveco trucks.

Why aren't you out slaving yer guts out anyway?

i did 38,000kms a few years back in a landy that i built for the chassis up, to mongolia and teh middle east and all we had go was a snapped speedo cable, and that was in a 1994 200tdi, i think its all how the vehicle is looked after and the driving style, ia m sure we would have had a few more brake down if either me of the wife had a fat right foot if you know what i mean, treat it like you love it and not like you have stolen it!

Thank you.

drive it like you stole it then fix it like ya love it..

I make that bloody good going and 90% preventable

And for an '86 model going on safaris, why didn't you give them a sympathetic rebuild of hoses, bushes, brake lines etc anyway

The rapier was a vehicle 11 yrs older , and had been used by military, as previously posted above, 90% looked like poor maintenance.
I used to do recovery as part of my business, in the outback , what did I use ? 130 DC HCPU 300tdi , and had to fetch in plenty of L/crsrs , as well as other makes. did over 250000k , 1 clutch, 1 fuel pump, 2 sets of shocks, and all the bushes once. + normal consumables eg brake pads hoses belts filters. Never let me down in the bush , and it was often in floods, and 45C+ but it was serviced properly , and thats the big secret , plus driving sympathetically . JMHE

Thanks for all the kind advice regarding preventive maintenance, and light-footedness on the pedal... I'll take note.

But the car was rebuilt and thoroughly checked (including the bloody bushings, who self-destructed in no time as soon as they started going bad), it's a low-mileage chassis despite the age, and the maintenance and drivers are the same for all my cars.

We're not talking religion and faith here. The fact is that my LC has never stopped on the road, but both my Landies have (and the previous ones, and my Rangies...). Colleague of mine who runs three Landies has the same issue: they're constantly under the spanner, while his Hi-Lux just drives and drives.

Of course we operate in really crappy conditions... Nevertheless, if Land Rover went from nearly 100% of the 4x4 market in Africa to nearly 0%, there is a reason. And it's no use blaming the driver, Solihull should ask themselves "What did we miss?"...

All 'm saying is that a Land Rover, as far as I'm concerned (and most everyone that I know who uses 4x4s professionally), is a much better offroader and ride in the bush than any other factory vehicle, but that it's sorrily lacking in the quality department.

There were several reasons landrover lost market share, these started with the series models, the one that had the biggest impact was the lack of availability, which let the other manufacturers in as customers had to buy something. They also cut right back on overseas dealers which resulted in poor support. Another factor was toyotas always had bigger engines, therefore more powerful . landrover due to lack of investment by the various owners wer never able to offer the big discounts that toyota did to get the market share with the ngo's eg UN . The lack of suitable vehicles at various times further lost customers to other makes, In Aus the Landrover clubs had to allow toyota, etc owners in to survive as they were losing members as they had to go newer more comfortable vehicles than the series, and they could not afford Range Rover. There was a big change when discovery arrived , as many went straight back to land rover.
As for ride I can accept that , as i personally experienced the reaction to taking several 4wd owners and their wives etc in my 110 csw across some very bad terrain to get to some caves in a cliff in OZ , they were cruiser and hilux owners, it was the wives who said " isnt the ride so soft" . The defender had only just arrived in OZ . The landcruiser was just going over to coils , and had real problems with stability, roll overs in the bush . This was fixed by susp changes (stiffer springs affecting ride comfort) and lowering (less susp travel) . Land cruiser always had better aircon . I wont go into other probs with landcruiser, but its not such a rosy world as many owners make out .

Its a shame to hear you have lost your faith in Landys a little, I believe that most older models were designed with agricultural use in mind with vehicles being able to cope with harsh terrain but only covering limited mileage, I myself have never been over-landing but if I were to go I would thoroughly prep it, replacing/upgrading most of the parts you have listed as a matter of course.

To cut a long story short. ... I'll give you £20 for it :amen:

PickUp90 said:

To cut a long story short. ... I'll give you £20 for it :amen:

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I'll see your £20.00 and raise you two pork pies and a jar of pickle.