warning light

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Shaun Reynolds

Shaun Reynolds

New Member
Posts
2
Location
Lewes East Sussex
Hi all i have a 1999 freelander 2lt Diesel. I have the engine management light come on red not amber. Also now when i drive there is a big lack of power anyone know what could be wrong please
 
check the coolant temperature sensor on the left hand front side of the engine block. pull the sensor off and try starting it,

could also be the MAF
 
Check the following - you will really need to have the diagnostic code read -
Crank position sensor - Needle lift sensor - Map sensor

Maf sensor should not put the mil light on an an L series., also cts (whilst it will put mil on ) will not cause the symptoms you are having.
Best of luck, a diagnostic check is the easiest.
;)
 
Yeh the LR specific code readers work on the pre MY01 L & K Series engines - but the 'generic' ODB2 ELM devices won't.

You have to be careful, some of the cheaper LR ones might not cover all functions and may even not support whole components.
 
GrumpyGel said:
Yeh the LR specific code readers work on the pre MY01 L & K Series engines - but the 'generic' ODB2 ELM devices won't.

You have to be careful, some of the cheaper LR ones might not cover all functions and may even not support whole components.
Click to expand...
Fully agreed, the iCarsoft whilst advertised does not function properly (on the L series) - iCarsoft advise NOT to use it on L series. the Lynx and Hawkeye do, and very well, the lynx being the better imo. The Data on the L series is actually excellent and covers every sensor and live data pid you could want on that engine. Also it does live actuator testing. A major bonus is the huge amount of data and actuator tests available for the wabco abs unit. The body ecu (CCU) is also fully available. (that is just the L series)
On the K series there is a higher range of data simply because the engine has more sensors. On later models such as the TD4 and V6 etc everything is covered inc gearbox etc - apart from some selected setup options in the CCU (common to both units). (Proxy alignment as it is known on the Fiat . Alfa Lancia range)
The big problem for most is that few 'garages' have access to the equipment needed. I suppose at LR main dealer rates the Lynx for example is reasonably cheap at 155 quid inc vat. It wouldn't take many trips to a LR dealer to total that !. It is also NOT vin locked - so if you order an FL1 license you get access to ALL FL1 types throughout production and also get full data recording in real time as it uses a laptop as well.
My Lynx has more than paid for itself in requests to use it from repair shops here. There are more freelanders here than you can shake a stick at, 95% are all L series (they don't rot here ;) ) and being L series they mainly just keep on running.
Joe
 
Last edited:
Joe_H said:
Fully agreed, the iCarsoft whilst advertised does not function properly - iCarsoft advise NOT to use it on L series. the Lynx and Hawkeye do, and very well, the lynx being the better imo. The Data on the L series is actually excellent and covers every sensor and live data pid you could want on that engine. Also it does live actuator testing. A major bonus is the huge amount of data and actuator tests available for the wabco abs unit. The body ecu (CCU) is also fully available. (that is just the L series)
On the K series there is a higher range of data simply because the engine has more sensors. On later models such as the TD4 and V6 etc everything is covered inc gearbox etc - apart from some selected setup options in the CCU (common to both units). (Proxy alignment as it is known on the Fiat . Alfa Lancia range)
The big problem for most is that few 'garages' have access to the equipment needed. I suppose at LR main dealer rates the Lynx for example is reasonably cheap at 155 quid inc vat. It wouldn't take many trips to a LR dealer to total that !. It is also NOT vin locked - so if you order an FL1 license you get access to ALL FL1 types throughout production and also get full data recording in real time as it uses a laptop as well.
My Lynx has more than paid for itself in requests to use it from repair shops here. There are more freelanders here than you can shake a stick at, 95% are all L series (they don't rot here ;) ) and being L series they mainly just keep on running.
Joe
Click to expand...
So, how much would we need to chip in for you to sniff the messages the Lynx is sending down the diag port and their responses :)

The cheapest I've seen it is over £200 plus VAT. Where did you get it for that price? I find it strange that Britpart don't show prices on their site.
 
GrumpyGel said:
So, how much would we need to chip in for you to sniff the messages the Lynx is sending down the diag port and their responses :)

The cheapest I've seen it is over £200 plus VAT. Where did you get it for that price? I find it strange that Britpart don't show prices on their site.
Click to expand...
LOL, and HUGE apologies, OOPS ! :oops: I just looked back at the invoice DOH ! - it was TWO hundred and 55 quid inc vat + postage to Portugal - £255 - NOT 155 !!!!! sowwwy...

This is where I got mine from - cheapest I could find -
Sam is great to deal with at Island 4 x4 !

Best price is £215.00 plus VAT
Delivery is £16.00 plus VAT
Total is £277.20
Regards
Sam Martin
www.island-4x4.co.uk

http://www.island-4x4.co.uk/lynx-diagnostic-single-vehicle-home-user-da6430-p-26565.html

I honestly do consider it worth every penny if you want to keep the vehicle.
Joe
 
Joe_H said:
LOL, and HUGE apologies, OOPS ! :oops: I just looked back at the invoice DOH ! - it was TWO hundred and 55 quid inc vat + postage to Portugal - £255 - NOT 155 !!!!! sowwwy...

This is where I got mine from - cheapest I could find -
Sam is great to deal with at Island 4 x4 !

Best price is £215.00 plus VAT
Delivery is £16.00 plus VAT
Total is £277.20
Regards
Sam Martin
www.island-4x4.co.uk

http://www.island-4x4.co.uk/lynx-diagnostic-single-vehicle-home-user-da6430-p-26565.html

I honestly do consider it worth every penny if you want to keep the vehicle.
Joe
Click to expand...
If you look at it another way, it was the same price as the vcu and bearings from Bell - almost to the penny ..... similar price to 4 reasonably cheap tyres and a hell of a lot cheaper than a clutch (fitted) - It is all a matter of relative costs I suppose.
The set of steel pipes that go over the gearbox on the L series (the huge bundle !) were nearly 200 quid... yikes...
 
Joe_H said:
Interestingly enough I have just ordered -
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/111947493902?_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK:MEBIDX:IT
For the Arduino - perhaps one at each end ------ o_O
What is K line speed ? 2 - 10 K baud ? - Latency might be an issue - and the need to build a lynx to arduino interface but - :D - . :eek:
Click to expand...
I've been reading up on this big-time over the last couple of weeks - but I'm coming from a 0 Knowledge starting point. I've run TTY/SSH software so know the basics of Baud Rate, data/parity/stop bits etc - but don't really know how they are implemented on the wire!

However, reading various docs and looking at sample code, I have determined that the Engine and ABS ECUs use ISO 14230-4 (Keyword Protocol 2000) which is an extension of ISO 9141-2. The Engine ECU need a comms initialisation (of 1 or 3 bytes forget which) which is performed at 5 Baud (yes 5!) and then once initialised the messaging runs at 10.4k Baud. I have read what bits are used 7/0/1 IIRC - but could be different. I believe the emission rated messages conform to ISO standards and PIDs - but not 100% sure.

I haven't found hardly anything out about the Wabco Hydraulic-ABS (HABS Type D) diagnostics which is in Freelander - but I did find one of their documents which let it slip that it is ISO 14230-4 (Keyword Protocol 2000). How its initialised and what message coding is used they keep very close to their chest as they sell their own diag software "Toolbox" (which does all the DTC display/clearing, real time data, bleeding etc). Freelander's ECU is 446 044 070 0 H-ABS.

The Wabco docs often quote Freelander's 446 044 070 0 ECU, for example in this doc...

http://www.meritorwabco.com/MeritorWABCO_document/mm39.pdf

They don't though reference the Traction Control or HDC functions. That document shows the Pin assignments for the ECU and I've compared it to Rave. They do equate, but the Pins relating to TC & HDC (eg Pin 13 in Rave is the TC lamp) just say "Not Used" in the Wabco docs.
 
Nodge68 said:
For the record. The I car soft I930 doesn't see the L series DCU.
Click to expand...
I've seen stuff from iCarsoft where they say they support the L Series in Freelander, and other stuff where they don't.

The ECUs are pretty standard in the LR/Rover/Bosch world - so I'm suprised they don't support it. What I think they may be doing is checking the ECU part number to make sure that its the right one that they expect to be talking to - and obviously that will be coded into their software. However, there are (at least) 2 different ECUs used for L Series in Freelander (Joe's is different to mine) - so I wouldn't mind betting that's where the problem lies. If you happen to have the ECU they have coded into their software, then it'll work - otherwise it'll just come back and say it can't connect.

I would put good money on the only differences in the ECUs is the part number, if they ignored it, the diags would work on both/all of them.
 
GrumpyGel said:
I've been reading up on this big-time over the last couple of weeks - but I'm coming from a 0 Knowledge starting point. I've run TTY/SSH software so know the basics of Baud Rate, data/parity/stop bits etc - but don't really know how they are implemented on the wire!

However, reading various docs and looking at sample code, I have determined that the Engine and ABS ECUs use ISO 14230-4 (Keyword Protocol 2000) which is an extension of ISO 9141-2. The Engine ECU need a comms initialisation (of 1 or 3 bytes forget which) which is performed at 5 Baud (yes 5!) and then once initialised the messaging runs at 10.4k Baud. I have read what bits are used 7/0/1 IIRC - but could be different. I believe the emission rated messages conform to ISO standards and PIDs - but not 100% sure.

I haven't found hardly anything out about the Wabco Hydraulic-ABS (HABS Type D) diagnostics which is in Freelander - but I did find one of their documents which let it slip that it is ISO 14230-4 (Keyword Protocol 2000). How its initialised and what message coding is used they keep very close to their chest as they sell their own diag software "Toolbox" (which does all the DTC display/clearing, real time data, bleeding etc). Freelander's ECU is 446 044 070 0 H-ABS.

The Wabco docs often quote Freelander's 446 044 070 0 ECU, for example in this doc...

http://www.meritorwabco.com/MeritorWABCO_document/mm39.pdf

They don't though reference the Traction Control or HDC functions. That document shows the Pin assignments for the ECU and I've compared it to Rave. They do equate, but the Pins relating to TC & HDC (eg Pin 13 in Rave is the TC lamp) just say "Not Used" in the Wabco docs.
Click to expand...

Hello Grumpy :)
You 'should' be able to initiate and read the actual 'protocol' with the ELM327 - Note, I am not saying communicate completely with the DCU etc - but the elm 327 has the appropriate protocol interfaces built in and ready to go.

take a look at this - I have only glanced at it but it seems logical. It basically uses a terminal emulator to speak to the elm327 which speaks "ISO 14230-4 (Keyword Protocol 2000) which is an extension of ISO 9141-2"
AFAIK, the problem is not with the elm327 with the earlier vehicles, it is simply the interpretation of the data and the code exchange that landrover use.

take a peak, I might have a play at some point when I have finished the TD4 controller project... If I can find my standard obd tool I will try before.
Oh, btw, if you want to use hyperterminal on win 8.1, just copy the files over from win 7 - works great - you need the exe and the DLL.
I like HT, nice and easy to use.. :)
Check out the basic protocol set up, all the initialisation is done for you - protocl 4 b baud init 10.4 k go.
https://theksmith.com/software/hack-vehicle-bus-cheap-easy-part-1/

enjoy - let the elm do all the hard work for you.

Also, apologies to OP for OT - GG - drop me a line if you want to talk more on this. -
Joe :)
 
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