Today's Problem..........Oil Pressure!

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BladeRob

Member
Posts
40
Location
Midlands
I went in to work yesterday to re-set the static diesel injection timing..

I dropped a major balls up and turned the engine over on the key with the spanner still on the bottom pulley. I heard a bang and stopped cranking immediately as I realised what I had done. There was no apparent damage, but it was enough of a hit to undo the bottom pulley bolt, which I tightened back up and thought all was OK. I think the spanner hit the PAS pipe.

I fired it up and started driving. The sun was very bright so I could not really see the dash but as soon as I turned onto the main road, I noticed the oil pressure light was flickering on and off.

I pulled over into a lay-by (about a couple of hundred yards) checked the oil level, which was OK so I phoned the AA to get it home. 5 hours later I got home - approx 10 miles (not happy).

I am not over familiar with the car as I have only had it a week and have left my RAVE disc at work.

About a month ago the car had a new turbo fitted, but I do not know the circumstances to what happened to the old one.

Could the spanner on the bottom pulley of damaged the pump? Any other ideas?
Thanks, Rob
 
Cannot see how oil pump could be damaged doing what you did. Oil pump is immediatly behind pulley but shielded by it so nothing could have hit it. Suggest you have a good look around for other damage before you knacker the engine if you have not done that already.
 
wammers said:
Cannot see how oil pump could be damaged doing what you did. Oil pump is immediatly behind pulley but shielded by it so nothing could have hit it. Suggest you have a good look around for other damage before you knacker the engine if you have not done that already.
Click to expand...

Thanks Wammers,

I am fairly sure it is not knackered. The light was flickering as opposed to being on.

Is the oil pump keyed onto the crank? (could it be slipping if I haven't tightened the bottom pulley up enough?)

I think I'll tee in a pressure gauge to the pressure switch and take it from there.
 
BladeRob said:
Thanks Wammers,

I am fairly sure it is not knackered. The light was flickering as opposed to being on.

Is the oil pump keyed onto the crank? (could it be slipping if I haven't tightened the bottom pulley up enough?)

I think I'll tee in a pressure gauge to the pressure switch and take it from there.
Click to expand...

Oil pump is driven by crank but not by a woodruff key. It is not possible to have damaged pump drive. Maybe the oil pressure relief valve is sticking not an unknow occurance. Is the oil clean or like tar?
 
wammers said:
Oil pump is driven by crank but not by a woodruff key. It is not possible to have damaged pump drive. Maybe the oil pressure relief valve is sticking not an unknow occurance. Is the oil clean or like tar?
Click to expand...

The oil is very black, but I doubt it is that old - I would hope when the new turbo was fitted, they would have used now oil.

Probably worth changing the oil a couple of times to eliminate any bits?

It seems strange that the oil light has never given me any concern until I did the balls up with the spanner on the crank. I suppose I was also working fairly close to the oil pressure sender when loosening / tightening the injection pump stabiliser bracket. Will check that it is not damaged and getting earthed somewhere.
 
BladeRob said:
The oil is very black, but I doubt it is that old - I would hope when the new turbo was fitted, they would have used now oil.

Probably worth changing the oil a couple of times to eliminate any bits?

It seems strange that the oil light has never given me any concern until I did the balls up with the spanner on the crank. I suppose I was also working fairly close to the oil pressure sender when loosening / tightening the injection pump stabiliser bracket. Will check that it is not damaged and getting earthed somewhere.
Click to expand...


No need to change oil when doing turbo. Yeah look for the obvious first, bad connection, dicky sender etc. But think you can rest assured that what you did will not have damaged the oil pump.
 
seanmull said:
when you were at the static timing did you disconnect or disturb any of the wiring behind the injector pump?
Click to expand...

I removed the large multi plug from the temp sender to get to the bolt behind the pump and also the plug that is held by the bracket which is close to the pump support bracket - not sure what this is but I would guess it goes to the alternator? Both of these were refitted once the pump was tightened up.

Not had chance to check anything today but will be on it tomorrow after work.

Does anyone know what the oil pressure should be?

Thanks, Rob
 
New oil and filter.............. no difference!

Got a new switch but cannot put it in as I need a deep 22mm socket which I don't have at home so that's tomorrow nights job.

Also ordered a gauge so that I can check out the actual pressure but it will be a few days in the post.

What pressure would you expect it to be (if it is OK!)

Thanks, Rob
 
BladeRob said:
New oil and filter.............. no difference!

Got a new switch but cannot put it in as I need a deep 22mm socket which I don't have at home so that's tomorrow nights job.

Also ordered a gauge so that I can check out the actual pressure but it will be a few days in the post.

What pressure would you expect it to be (if it is OK!)

Thanks, Rob
Click to expand...

Around 29-30psi at idle 55psi max relief valve open.
 
flickering light sounds like bad connection to me.
I don't think this'd be universally popular advice, but if it was me, I'd start it up and have someone wiggle the connector while I watch the dash.
 
jonbill said:
flickering light sounds like bad connection to me.
I don't think this'd be universally popular advice, but if it was me, I'd start it up and have someone wiggle the connector while I watch the dash.
Click to expand...

Already tried that.

The problem is if the plug is disconnected, the light goes out so this wouldn't work unless it is getting earthed somewhere down the line. The wire quickly goes into a bigger loom which I suppose could be being earthed somewhere down the line. The short section to the plug is not touching anything to get an earth from.
 
I seem to remember reading on the Beemer site about oil pumps slipping on the crank. If you whacked the retaining nut and undid it, maybe it has not locked up properly.
 
Datatek said:
I seem to remember reading on the Beemer site about oil pumps slipping on the crank. If you whacked the retaining nut and undid it, maybe it has not locked up properly.
Click to expand...

I have been scouring tinternet to find how the pump gets it drive but had no luck finding the answer.
I did wonder if the drive to the pump is from the clamping force from the bottom pulley. This would make sense as I could not torque it up anywhere near the specification.

I know there is a special tool to react against when tightening the bottom pulley, would it be worth locking the engine with the timing pin to get some more torque onto the bolt? (Or is this a big no no?)
 
BladeRob said:
Thanks for that.

The woodruff key in the 1st picture looks as if it is for the bottom pulley.

I cant quite understand the other pictures - is the bush in picture 6 what actually drives the pump rotor? It looks as if the bush may slip over the crank and get pinched between the crank and the bottom pulley?

Maybe wishful thinking!
Click to expand...

Yes the bush drives the pump not the woodruff key.
If you look at the torque setting for pulley retaining bolt it is angle tightened in three stages from an initial torque loading of 74 lb feet. That means it is BLOODY tight. Maybe if you torqued it up properly that may cure your problem. 74lb feet then angle 60 degrees then a further 60 degrees then a further 30 degrees. That is tight. Not having it tight enough will be allowing drive ring to slip.
 
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BladeRob said:
I have been scouring tinternet to find how the pump gets it drive but had no luck finding the answer.
I did wonder if the drive to the pump is from the clamping force from the bottom pulley. This would make sense as I could not torque it up anywhere near the specification.

I know there is a special tool to react against when tightening the bottom pulley, would it be worth locking the engine with the timing pin to get some more torque onto the bolt? (Or is this a big no no?)
Click to expand...
A very big NO NO:eek:
 
BladeRob said:
I have been scouring tinternet to find how the pump gets it drive but had no luck finding the answer.
I did wonder if the drive to the pump is from the clamping force from the bottom pulley. This would make sense as I could not torque it up anywhere near the specification.

I know there is a special tool to react against when tightening the bottom pulley, would it be worth locking the engine with the timing pin to get some more torque onto the bolt? (Or is this a big no no?)
Click to expand...

The pump is driven by the sleave that slips over the crank and sits on a chamfer on crankshaft. It is then nipped between the crank timing sprocket and the vibration damper hub by tightening of the retaining bolt. In your first post you said you had retightened the bolt, i stupidly thought you had torqued it correctly, obviously you did not. There is a special tool for holding crank against rotation whilst tightening the bolt. It is not difficult to make an alternative. Holding with the TDC pin would be a last resort not recommended and could lead to tears. I have done this in the past, but not on this motor, only on motors with a slightly more substantial lock pin.

PS IF you are going to be doing a lot you may find getting a Sealey VSE5538 set an advantage. Around £80.00 and free post on net if you look around.
 
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