To buy or not to buy??

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Karlos28

Karlos28

Well-Known Member
Posts
1,894
Location
Derbyshire
Hi all, popped back into this forum after several years of being away from the green oval!

Basically I used to have a 110 and loved it, but due to circumstances had to sell up. I am now in a position where I want a rugged, rough, work horse for lugging my mountain bike about as well as tip runs DIY stuff and all that caper...

So the Freelander (1) has come up on the radar after a few autotrader searches.. basically want to spend as little as possible up to 3k..

Anyway, I am perfectly capable and happy to do any work myself, however.... I'm not too happy about the whole VCU/IRD business and could do with some clarification.. this issue only effects the FL1? If the vcu isn't hot after a short mainly straight drive, it 'should' be ok? Should I just budget to replace it anyway? (At least it's an easy job!) If all seems well on a test drive, should these issues put me off buying one? Or do I forget the idea and get an xc70??

I know this is a well covered topic and as of this morning I knew nothing about it all, so have done some research, I just can't get a scale of how delicate this drivetrain is, or if it's just a sign of their age and Chuck a new VCU in and I'm laughing for the next 70k miles...?

TIA!

Karl
 
Hi Karl,

For £3K you should get a good F1, so worth being choosey. Not sure what F2s start at in the UK, lot more than that here, but if you could get one, maintenance runs the risk of costing a lot more than an F1.

When F1s have problems with their transmission, the prop shafts are removed by owners because its a cheap way of getting mobile again - so the first check is that it still has props! If you want to save a bit and get one without props and reinstate 4WD, there are a couple of threads running about it at the moment, but with the price of F1s being so low now, you probably can't expect to build yourself a bargain (depending on what's wrong and the seller will always say it was to save fuel or a noisey bearing) - but you would know what its transmission is like.

https://www.landyzone.co.uk/land-rover/second-hand-prop-shaft.338509/
.
https://www.landyzone.co.uk/land-rover/2004-freelander-td4-3dr.338669/

Looking at motors with props, first thing to check is if the tyres all match - make and model - if they don't its likely damage may have been done to the transmission - depending on size differences, which corner they are on and how much its been driven like that. If they do match - you don't know if they've not matched previously! So you need to try and get a handle on the condition of the VCU and IRD.

You can check the VCU with a 1 wheel up test, info on the link below. Its likely, as you say, to be needing replacement, so budgeting for a recon from a reputable supplier (there are dodgy ones) is a good idea. It's a bit difficult to do a 1WUT on a test drive, so often the only indicator is to reverse on full lock, the VCU will apply a braking effect (because front and rear axles want to turn at different speeds - the VCU is there to stop that over a 'limit') - its just a case of how much. TBH experienced Freelander drivers can have difficulty telling what's right and wrong - but if you feel a definite braking effect, then the VCU is well past its sell-by-date.

The IRD is even more difficult to test - you can check the prop flange and drivers side driveshaft for any lateral movement, but failing that, its examining the oil - if its grey metallicy colour - then that's the bearings ground down and suspended in it - the IRD is well on its way to being dead. However, they may have changed the oil! You can remove the rear pinion and check condition of the crown and pinion gears. These though are checks you can only really do once you've got the car.

So the only things you can realistically do is check for matching tyres and braking effect on full reverse lock. The temperature of the VCU isn't a good test - eg if its cold then that would imply its not slipping and well on the way to being 'siezed'.

Good luck. They are good reliable little trucks. They're pretty rugged and parts are plentiful and reasonably priced. They don't have a huge amount of boot space for tip runs and you're definitely looking to get a spare wheel or tow bar bike carrier - I have a tow bar one that angles out to get past the spare wheel.

https://www.landyzone.co.uk/land-rover/tests-new-freelander-owners-should-do-on-their-car.312863/
 
Go for it! I've had 6 of em. It will go wrong guaranteed, but they're cheap to fix. Great to drive and if you're not into rock crawling surprisingly good off road. I've had my current one for 2 years and have done over 80k of hard miles in it. Starting to cost a bit but it's done 176k!! Can't think of anything as cheap for my needs.
 
For 3k you're in Disco 2 territory and they don't have a **** drive train..

Yes they rust but a good one can be had if you look..

And they can tow..

;)
 
Henry_b said:
For 3k you're in Disco 2 territory and they don't have a **** drive train..
Click to expand...

But they drive **** compared to the FL1. The FL1 can be driven like a car. A D2 is a lumbering slow barge that is most at home off the highway, where it's prehistoric suspension copes best.;)
 
Haha Cheers for the responses guys!

Well I have to discount the disco as I can't fit it round my drive (fairly narrow dirt track and tight turning spot at the top) I'd really love a td5 flavour one too..

They don't seem to rust too much from what I have read/seen? As I say my only concern is the drive train, but should that put me off if I can test it as much as poss before hand?
 
Nodge68 said:
But they drive **** compared to the FL1. The FL1 can be driven like a car. A D2 is a lumbering slow barge that is most at home off the highway, where it's prehistoric suspension copes best.;)
Click to expand...

But a D2 does everything ;)

If ya wanted a reliable small 4x4 that drives like a normal car buy a Honda crv, not a freelander with its cheesy drivetrain ;)
 
GrumpyGel said:
Hi Karl,

For £3K you should get a good F1, so worth being choosey. Not sure what F2s start at in the UK, lot more than that here, but if you could get one, maintenance runs the risk of costing a lot more than an F1.

When F1s have problems with their transmission, the prop shafts are removed by owners because its a cheap way of getting mobile again - so the first check is that it still has props! If you want to save a bit and get one without props and reinstate 4WD, there are a couple of threads running about it at the moment, but with the price of F1s being so low now, you probably can't expect to build yourself a bargain (depending on what's wrong and the seller will always say it was to save fuel or a noisey bearing) - but you would know what its transmission is like.

https://www.landyzone.co.uk/land-rover/second-hand-prop-shaft.338509/
.
https://www.landyzone.co.uk/land-rover/2004-freelander-td4-3dr.338669/

Looking at motors with props, first thing to check is if the tyres all match - make and model - if they don't its likely damage may have been done to the transmission - depending on size differences, which corner they are on and how much its been driven like that. If they do match - you don't know if they've not matched previously! So you need to try and get a handle on the condition of the VCU and IRD.

You can check the VCU with a 1 wheel up test, info on the link below. Its likely, as you say, to be needing replacement, so budgeting for a recon from a reputable supplier (there are dodgy ones) is a good idea. It's a bit difficult to do a 1WUT on a test drive, so often the only indicator is to reverse on full lock, the VCU will apply a braking effect (because front and rear axles want to turn at different speeds - the VCU is there to stop that over a 'limit') - its just a case of how much. TBH experienced Freelander drivers can have difficulty telling what's right and wrong - but if you feel a definite braking effect, then the VCU is well past its sell-by-date.

The IRD is even more difficult to test - you can check the prop flange and drivers side driveshaft for any lateral movement, but failing that, its examining the oil - if its grey metallicy colour - then that's the bearings ground down and suspended in it - the IRD is well on its way to being dead. However, they may have changed the oil! You can remove the rear pinion and check condition of the crown and pinion gears. These though are checks you can only really do once you've got the car.

So the only things you can realistically do is check for matching tyres and braking effect on full reverse lock. The temperature of the VCU isn't a good test - eg if its cold then that would imply its not slipping and well on the way to being 'siezed'.

Good luck. They are good reliable little trucks. They're pretty rugged and parts are plentiful and reasonably priced. They don't have a huge amount of boot space for tip runs and you're definitely looking to get a spare wheel or tow bar bike carrier - I have a tow bar one that angles out to get past the spare wheel.

https://www.landyzone.co.uk/land-rover/tests-new-freelander-owners-should-do-on-their-car.312863/
Click to expand...

Cheers for the info! Id say I'm more than happy to change a vcu.. but it looks like a IRD is well over a grand, whoch means I may as well get an £800 spares/repairs one! I have seen a few 2wd ones advertised (one is round the corner!) But I guessed the IRD will already be well gone in it?

Also, me getting in and out of my drive requires a fair bit of full lock reversing, is this likely to kill and VCU I fit in the future?
 
Henry_b said:
But a D2 does everything
Click to expand...
Except they don't all have locking centre diffs, which effectively makes them 1 wheel drive. My Freelander V6 has had to pull a centre lock less D2 out of a small patch of mud on 2 occasions. The Freelander didn't even notice the mud was slippery, but the D2 just span a wheel in a hopeless fashion. My V6 Freelander then had to pull the hopeless D2 out of the mud, much to the embarrassment of its driver.
Henry_b said:
If ya wanted a reliable small 4x4 that drives like a normal car buy a Honda crv, not a freelander with its cheesy drivetrain
Click to expand...
It's not as bad as people make out. If the tyres are odd, then yes the transmission takes a hammering, but that's down to the owner not bothering to read the ****ing handbook. There's loads of Freelanders on the road with 150K miles plus, which have had correct tyre maintenance, and not a hint of transmission trouble. They also don't rust away like the D2, except for the fuel tank cradle, which is easy changed.
The Freelander is also better off road than the CRV, and is better to drive on the road. It's also British, something that the Honda can never claim.
 
Last edited:
Karlos28 said:
I'm more than happy to change a vcu.. but it looks like a IRD is well over a grand, whoch means I may as well get an £800 spares/repairs one!
Click to expand...
It's better to test drive a complete Freelander, rather than one that's had the propshafts removed. As there's no way to tell the IRD is serviceable, until the propshafts are refitted, or the unit is stripped down.
Karlos28 said:
I have seen a few 2wd ones advertised (one is round the corner!)
Click to expand...
I'd avoid those, unless you want a project.
Karlos28 said:
But I guessed the IRD will already be well gone in it?
Click to expand...
Just because it's had the propshafts removed, doesn't mean for definite that the IRD has failed. But it's more likely then a Freelander that's still got it's propshafts fitted.
Karlos28 said:
Also, me getting in and out of my drive requires a fair bit of full lock reversing, is this likely to kill and VCU I fit in the future?
Click to expand...

It won't make any difference. Driving with odd or incorrectly inflated tyres is what damages the VCU, not manoeuvring the vehicle.
 
+1 on the D2 being the worst ever Land Rover 4WD. Sure its going to drive 4 wheels when you've got good traction - which is great for sports cars - but when the terrain gets slippery, you're only guaranteed drive to 1 wheel - pants!

To offset that LR installed the same Traction Control already installed in Freelander - except Freelander will lock the transmission, so mechanically you are guaranteed drive to 2 wheels. Freelander does the mechanical locking automatically without any electronic or driver assistance - its a great system. The electronic Traction Control bits are nowhere near as good as a mechanical lock - they are inefficient, and while they look great on a 'staged' axle twister, don't work very well in real world and turn themselves off.
 
Karlos28 said:
Also, me getting in and out of my drive requires a fair bit of full lock reversing, is this likely to kill and VCU I fit in the future?
Click to expand...
See Nodge's advice above. What damages the VCU and other bits in the transmission is rate of slip and how long for. Maneuvering on your drive is all low speed (low slip rate) and for short duration.

That is the theory, however, I do have my concerns about it.
 
Henry_b said:
But a D2 does everything
Click to expand...
True
Rust , brake down and cost a fortune to run:p
Also the Freelander is good in a crash as my son found out last night:( a merc went to the front left hand side of him .The merc needs a new wing and headlight I am going to nip out iab to see if I can find my sons fog light surround not a mark on his car;)True it dose have its problems but show me a 12 year old car the dose not
 
Henry_b said:
But a D2 does everything ;)

If ya wanted a reliable small 4x4 that drives like a normal car buy a Honda crv, not a freelander with its cheesy drivetrain ;)
Click to expand...
When yer ses cheese I assume yer refering to the VCU? The Freelander int the only vehicle to have a VCU which you as a P38 sufferer would know. I guess yer come in ere to chuck muck about to take yer mind oft hair suspension problems, engines over eating, electrics with a mind of their own... It's no wonder a good P38 is priced at the same amount as a bad Freelander. Yer mum will be along soon...
 
urena said:
wrong I bought my lightweight for £2.800 its mint just have to shop around and prepare to travel.
got mine off Anglian 4-4 fb keep looking.
Click to expand...
Challenge eggscepted.

Start a new fred int Freelander section and list all of these wonderful condition vehicles at cheap prices int good condition fer £3k. Advertised price int what the new owner will pay so be warned we'll be haggling the price down if it's too high. We need links to advertised price and lots of recent pic's. Please remember it's the Freelander section and therefore we dun't do rust. Pic's of rust will need a preceding warning.
 
Hippo said:
When yer ses cheese I assume yer refering to the VCU? The Freelander int the only vehicle to have a VCU which you as a P38 sufferer would know. I guess yer come in ere to chuck muck about to take yer mind oft hair suspension problems, engines over eating, electrics with a mind of their own... It's no wonder a good P38 is priced at the same amount as a bad Freelander. Yer mum will be along soon...
Click to expand...
If I were to go back to a "big" Land Rover, it would be a late classic or a P38 because they have the viscously controlled center diff. Dunno why they didn't put it in Discovery and then dropped all locking in D2 - madness.
 
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