TD5 rough running

I dunno ... but I smacked the fan off mine this afternoon, and the engine was MUCH quieter without it even sitting ticking over,

Going to rig up a leccy fan soon.

Old one in the back with all the other junk.

I wonder if he's got an manifold leak at a gasket or somewhere.

CharlesY

CharlesY said:

I dunno ... but I smacked the fan off mine this afternoon, and the engine was MUCH quieter without it even sitting ticking over,

Going to rig up a leccy fan soon.

Old one in the back with all the other junk.

I wonder if he's got an manifold leak at a gasket or somewhere.

CharlesY

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good plan, have you driven it yet, i took the fan off my 300 and it feels better to drive and warms up alot quicker. The lecky one almost never kicks in on it's thermal switch and i got an override in the cab for swimming.

CharlesY said:

I wonder if he's got an manifold leak at a gasket or somewhere.

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you may well be right, the manifold is very very rigid and apparently is prone to developing tiny cracks - these can cause all manner of noises, a well known mod is to machine out the webbing on the manifold casting as this allows a little more flexibility

Did check the manifold studs and they all present but will have a closer look for cracks. Did also wonder about the exhaust but i'd of thought the flex coupling should stop and vibrations there

Going to try and make a device to attach to my drill to test the pas pump, alt, and pullys for play/noise as it definatly sounds better with the belt off, just still bl00dy vibrates!

I had viabrtions between 2000 - 2700 mine was an auto not long after the torque converter snapped yea torque conver not the the flex plate! but you could clearly see it had been broken in one place for a long time then i guess the viabrations caused it to totally kill its self check the pic closely ont the flex plate you can see where the torque converter had been ruubing when broken also i peice of broken TC still bolten on their. The viabration was bugging me for ages i changed the front prop check so so many things then bang and a big grinding noise! im manual now and all is good. Dan.

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distd5co said:

I had viabrtions between 2000 - 2700 mine was an auto not long after the torque converter snapped yea torque conver not the the flex plate! but you could clearly see it had been broken in one place for a long time then i guess the viabrations caused it to totally kill its self check the pic closely ont the flex plate you can see where the torque converter had been ruubing when broken also i peice of broken TC still bolten on their. The viabration was bugging me for ages i changed the front prop check so so many things then bang and a big grinding noise! im manual now and all is good. Dan.

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Holy Smoke!

What a bummer! First time I heard of that!

CharlesY

Right!, i've had a good look at the crank pully. the section where the aux belt sits can be moved backwards and forwards (to and from the engine) by hand approx 2-5mm. is this normal play? also i've noticed a diesel leak around the fuel filter which appears to be comming down the pipes rather than the filter itself leaking. Would air in the fuel lines cause the engine to run rough/tappy?

my thoughts are now going towards the fuel pump. started the pump off the key tonight and could hear a bubbling noise comming from the fuel filter and the pump went through two stages of priming (second stage made the pump run faster & pump sounds quiet loud). on second try on priming pump it went straight to fast running. wondering if the pump is on it's way out/leak in fuel lines/High pressure side of pump has failed?

jsbholden said:

Right!, i've had a good look at the crank pully. the section where the aux belt sits can be moved backwards and forwards (to and from the engine) by hand approx 2-5mm. is this normal play?

I very much doubt it!
The pulley is in several parts, bolted together.

There's a central pulley bolt - this MUST be TIGHT! It isn't as big a bolt as many engines use. Make sure yours is TIGHT! RAVE says it should be 455 Nm / 336 ft-lbs torque, which is colossal. That needs a six foot scaffolding pole. I somehow find it hard to think this bolt has come loose!

Rave ....
6. Fit new crankshaft pulley bolt and tighten to
455 Nm (336 lbf.ft), using a torque multiplier.

There are three smaller bolts around that which hold on the TV Damper disc. I think TV means torsional vibration damper. These bolts too must be pretty tight so this damper doesn't flap around and VIBRATE .... . They should be 80 Nm / 60 ft-lbs torque, still plenty tight.

Pray that these are loose! If so ....


also i've noticed a diesel leak around the fuel filter which appears to be comming down the pipes rather than the filter itself leaking. Would air in the fuel lines cause the engine to run rough/tappy?

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Oh dear. be prepared to discover (as I did not long ago) that one of the plastic fuel pipes at the tank (there are four) has rubbed-through and is leaking. It was just my luck that my leaky pipe was the 4 bar 60psi high pressure feed. The fuel was FLYING out!

Dropped the tank, cut out half an inch of leaky pipe, shoved the ends into a 8mm push-fit connecter, and Bob's yer flip. Oh yes, and I made damn sure there won't be no more pipes getting rubbed through on my Disco.

I believe there was a recall for this. Someone can confirm.

Good luck!

CharlesY

Cheers CharlesY! had a good look round and cant see any other leaks around the tank or chassis but the pump is making some funny noises. the pump doesnt look to hard to replace but i think it may be a garage job to change the crank pulley!

jsbholden said:

Cheers CharlesY! had a good look round and cant see any other leaks around the tank or chassis but the pump is making some funny noises. the pump doesnt look to hard to replace but i think it may be a garage job to change the crank pulley!

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Sure, but you can easily check the three bolts that hold on the TV damper disc.

Just imagine if they are loose and causing the bother!

I'm still worried about the free play in the pulley you mentioned. Can you describe it more fully? What moves? The whole pulley should be ONE SOLID PIECE to feel. No part of it should be able to move in relation to the other parts.

CharlesY

The large solid part which sits closest to the rad is fine, no play. the inner part with the groves for the aux belt can be moved. Feels like the rubber has gone soft

jsbholden said:

The large solid part which sits closest to the rad is fine, no play. the inner part with the groves for the aux belt can be moved. Feels like the rubber has gone soft

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Cripes ... I don't think that sounds right.

The large solid part is the torsional vibration damper.

I just went out and lifted the bonnet of my Disco TD5.
Took off the top fan cover.
Using a sharp wood chisel (LR special tool 876234556B) I tried prising the inner belt driver away backwards. Using more force than I was happy about, I could manage nearly half a millimeter of movement.

How much did you say you have? Is your one perhaps goosed?

Start saving up for a new crankshaft pulley ...

CharlesY

will have another look tonight, measure it and take photos

been and had a closer look. my first est of 2-5mm was a bit out but i can move easily by hand the groved section back and forth 1mm. i can also rotate it approx 1mm either way without the TV part moving at all. Just had a look on RAVE and it shows the groved section being the one that is bolted to the crank:screaming_bug_eye_f

jsbholden said:

been and had a closer look. my first est of 2-5mm was a bit out but i can move easily by hand the groved section back and forth 1mm. i can also rotate it approx 1mm either way without the TV part moving at all. Just had a look on RAVE and it shows the groved section being the one that is bolted to the crank:screaming_bug_eye_f

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Yes indeed, but I think it is made up of several pieces all bonded together with rubbery stuff like engine mountings.

I THINK there is the inner hub piece with the pulley bolt through it, then a rubbery bonded goo ring round that, then the grooved pulley bonded onto the rubbery goo ring, and then the damper ring bolted to the hub inside the grooved pulley. I suspect the outer ring is NOT bolted TO the grooved pulley, but is bolted THROUGH it. If that is so, perhaps the wobbling of the outer ring is making the three bolts knock on the pulley and cause the buzzing and vibration? This might happen five times per revolution of the engine, or ten - who knows?

Looks like you may have a rubbery softening syndrome here.

If it was mine I would Tippex the bits, then take out the three bolts and remove the Damper ring. Replace the three bolts, with packing washers if need be, if you think they are necessary.

Go for a drive. The ring off won't cause any bother even in a decent run. It might in 100,000 miles running without it. It is there in theory to reduce the risk of fatigue failure of the crankshaft. The rubbery goo lets outer ring of the pulley soak up (damp out) the rotational pulses of the front end of the crankshaft.

Only thing I can suggest right now, and if it was mine I would try it, not least because it's so easy to do it.

CharlesY

How do i lock the engine to undo the bolts (it's an auto)

jsbholden said:

How do i lock the engine to undo the bolts (it's an auto)

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Use a socket on the crankshaft pulley bolt.

That is (or SHOULD BE!!!) so Goddam tight you can use it while undoing the little ones.

In many old automatics they put a hole in the bell-housing you could poke a big screwdriver though to jam the starter ring gear.

CharlesY

CharlesY,

Dont know off the top of your head what size the crank bolt is? (At work and about to go out past local Halfords!)

jsbholden said:

CharlesY,

Dont know off the top of your head what size the crank bolt is? (At work and about to go out past local Halfords!)

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Measured mine then used a 24mm AF socket to check.

24mm it is.

But you may not need to counter hold the pulley to undo the three wee bolts. The engine may be stiff enough to resist turning.

CharlesY