TD5 Auto box

oldzed · Nov 16, 2009

Is this a good unit or a weakness on this vehicle. I was out in the disco Friday evening and came to a very steep incline, and 2 lights came on, one was the sports mode indicator and one the light to the left with 'M' on it.

I immediately returned home and it seem to be driving OK. Could this be just the oil level or is the box on the way out. The vehicle has done 105K. I believe the level / top up bung is on the front of the box, is this right and is it easy to get to for the purposes of doing this. I found a re-con box on Fleabay for £700 on anexchange basis, and as I tow a large Lunar this may be the best option. Any help would be much appreciated especially as the festive season is now upon us and this could stunt the celebrations somewhat.

naks · Nov 16, 2009

oldzed said:
and 2 lights came on, one was the sports mode indicator and one the light to the left with 'M' on it. I immediately returned home and it seem to be driving OK.

That ZF box is virtually indestructible, provided you use the right oil and treat it well.

Were you in log range and M mode when tackling this steep incline?

Get it checked out asap by a landy specialist to diagnose the issue. Probably the box was starting to overheat and you saved it by backing off.

thebiglad · Nov 16, 2009

oldzed said:
Is this a good unit or a weakness on this vehicle. I was out in the disco Friday evening and came to a very steep incline, and 2 lights came on, one was the sports mode indicator and one the light to the left with 'M' on it. I immediately returned home and it seem to be driving OK. Could this be just the oil level or is the box on the way out. The vehicle has done 105K. I believe the level / top up bung is on the front of the box, is this right and is it easy to get to for the purposes of doing this. I found a re-con box on Fleabay for £700 on anexchange basis, and as I tow a large Lunar this may be the best option. Any help would be much appreciated especially as the festive season is now upon us and this could stunt the celebrations somewhat.

Hi Oldzed, re your problem with the gearbox, I'm assuming you were on-tarmac and in hi-range when going up this hill?

These gearboxes are very strong and reliable so it's unlikely you will need to replace it, but here are a couple of things you might to check:

1. Gearbox oil level - commence with a cold engine and the vehicle parked on a level. Start the engine, cycle through each gearbox position allowing 3 secs in every one for the 'box to settle, then return to Park. Leave the engine running.

With a Torx head (T50 from memory) and driver, get underneath the car and locate the oil level plug on the forward face of the autobox. Carefully undo this and remove - there should now be a small trail of oil eminating from this hole. If there isn't, you need to top up the level with Dexron IID or III until the level starts to overflow.

2. The gearbox selector XYZ switch - this is beneath the selector lever and sometimes is faulty or badly positioned needing adjustment.

3. Electronic fault - Sometimes the lights come on due to insufficent electrical supply getting to the gearbox ECU, low voltage will trigger the lights. Check the condition of the main battery and charging circuit.

Hope that helps

Cheers and good luck

Dave

oldzed · Nov 16, 2009

I was in normal road mode 'D' and high and on tarmac, but seem to drive home OK. My garage drive is also quite steep and that now causes it to light both these lights. I am hoping once I check and top up the fluid, all will be good again especially as the TD5 is so much more quieter to drive than my 300tdi and I like the air suspension, definitely better than coils, well at least on my 300 anyway. Thanks for all your help guys, as usual invaluable. Tis crawler board and light time me thinks, weather permitting of course.

thebiglad · Nov 16, 2009

oldzed said:
I was in normal road mode 'D' and high and on tarmac, but seem to drive home OK. My garage drive is also quite steep and that now causes it to light both these lights. I am hoping once I check and top up the fluid, all will be good again especially as the TD5 is so much more quieter to drive than my 300tdi and I like the air suspension, definitely better than coils, well at least on my 300 anyway. Thanks for all your help guys, as usual invaluable. Tis crawler board and light time me thinks, weather permitting of course.

Good luck Oldzed, don't forget to go through the gear selection process or you will end up with a face full of oil

oldzed · Nov 16, 2009

thebiglad said:
Good luck Oldzed, don't forget to go through the gear selection process or you will end up with a face full of oil

Ooooops, glad you re-iterated that point, erm lets see now, crawler board, light and divers helmet.:doh: I will definirely go through the routine with the gear selector, thanks again.

oldzed · Nov 17, 2009

An update - I got home from work all enthusiastic about my new found knowledge and quickly got changed and put the disco up on ramps. Luckily my drive slopes so this then made the disco level. I let the car warm up while I got myself organised with something to lie on and a good light, it then proceeded to rain thankfully just a quick shower and I was then able to run through the pre-check gearbox sequence as mentioned above. I did this a couple of times just to make sure and then dived underneath the locate the level bung. I was flabbergasted how low in the box it is, in fact I spent a good 15 minutes checking all over the box to confirm I was on the right bung. I then proceeded to undo it and as I got nrear the very end, a drip appeared. I was gob smacked, and then totally depressed. I could visualise a new gearbox now and the cost of fitting, just before Christmas. I started to think that perhaps I should lay the vehicle up and just carryon driving the 300tdi, which is not a problem really........but I so wanted to be driving the TD5. So at 5.40pm I took the disco down to my local garage, they are only small, a father and son affair, but I know them both so was hoping for a miracle as especially as the son was into mud plugging some years ago. They put it up on the ramp and then consulted their computer and came back with a readout which read 'water in the wiring harness to gearbox' and 'software update required to ECM'. They then proceeded to remove the connection to the switch on the side of the gearbox and clean it up including the swicth terminals. They said they could not help with the software update but could recommend a guy who would do it. They did ring him but by now it was 6.15 and of course there was no reply. They charged me £20 and I left to come home. Hang on, the lights are not flashing anymore, I drove some 30 miles and no lights flashing. It must have been down to moisture in the cable or connector which for a 4x4 is pants. They are supposed to be able to stand that sort of stuff. So tomorrow its heatshrink time and hopefully it will not happen again. Thanks again for your inputs.

thebiglad · Nov 17, 2009

oldzed said:
An update - I got home from work all enthusiastic about my new found knowledge and quickly got changed and put the disco up on ramps. Luckily my drive slopes so this then made the disco level. I let the car warm up while I got myself organised with something to lie on and a good light, it then proceeded to rain thankfully just a quick shower and I was then able to run through the pre-check gearbox sequence as mentioned above. I did this a couple of times just to make sure and then dived underneath the locate the level bung. I was flabbergasted how low in the box it is, in fact I spent a good 15 minutes checking all over the box to confirm I was on the right bung. I then proceeded to undo it and as I got nrear the very end, a drip appeared. I was gob smacked, and then totally depressed. I could visualise a new gearbox now and the cost of fitting, just before Christmas. I started to think that perhaps I should lay the vehicle up and just carryon driving the 300tdi, which is not a problem really........but I so wanted to be driving the TD5. So at 5.40pm I took the disco down to my local garage, they are only small, a father and son affair, but I know them both so was hoping for a miracle as especially as the son was into mud plugging some years ago. They put it up on the ramp and then consulted their computer and came back with a readout which read 'water in the wiring harness to gearbox' and 'software update required to ECM'. They then proceeded to remove the connection to the switch on the side of the gearbox and clean it up including the swicth terminals. They said they could not help with the software update but could recommend a guy who would do it. They did ring him but by now it was 6.15 and of course there was no reply. They charged me £20 and I left to come home. Hang on, the lights are not flashing anymore, I drove some 30 miles and no lights flashing. It must have been down to moisture in the cable or connector which for a 4x4 is pants. They are supposed to be able to stand that sort of stuff. So tomorrow its heatshrink time and hopefully it will happen again. Thanks again for your inputs.

Iirc the moisture comes from aircon drains that end just above this connector - marvelous, NOT !!!!!

CharlesY · Nov 17, 2009

Despite all that good news, be SURE there is plenty of fluid in the gearbox.
Better by far a pint too much, than too little.

If it didn't overflow the plughole good style whjen you checked it, fling in a litre of fluid.
That should do it.

The low oil problem is HEAT build-up. You need plenty of fluid to allow the gearbox to share the heat out amongst lots of oil.

CharlesY

oldzed · Nov 18, 2009

CharlesY said:
Despite all that good news, be SURE there is plenty of fluid in the gearbox.
Better by far a pint too much, than too little.

If it didn't overflow the plughole good style whjen you checked it, fling in a litre of fluid.
That should do it.

The low oil problem is HEAT build-up. You need plenty of fluid to allow the gearbox to share the heat out amongst lots of oil.

CharlesY

Thanks Charles. By coincidence when I checked my 300 tdi after I first aquired it, the gearbox oil was well up the stick way past the lines on the dipstick, and despite checking it several times and getting the same result, I assumed I was doing something wrong. It drives superbly even when towing a large caravan and obviously the extra oil is keeping it cool. Great advice so more to do. Last night I ended up driving about 50 miles in total and everything was fine, this morning driving into work.........two flashing lights again

. I guess it has to be something to do with either the wiring or the switch in the box, and of course the aircon drain. Hopefully all easy to remedy.

Jer05 · Nov 18, 2009

Have you got it fixed now? If so can you supply an update?

I have just come home from doing a friend a favour and picking his son up to take him to football practice. On the way up the very steep drive my previously faultless box entered the same state as yours. i.e. flashing lights (M & S) and limp home mode. I was also in high ratio 'D', not sport mode. My car like yours 2000 reg and 110k miles.

I have just secured some work but in Cornwall (150 mile trip from home) so as you say this is not a great run up to Christmas. Thanks to all the members posting their views. I have a great checklist for tomorrow. I am also glad to hear the box is usualy bullet proof. That is what I had heard before I chose an Auto.

I will start with the loom because the only other sympton that preceded this fault was that I went to start the car the other day and it 'clicked' as if low voltage/flat battery. I then locked and unlocked the car to ensure the immobiliser was off etc and it started fine. I had this happen x 2 over the last week. Given the battery then has plenty of 'oomph' it sounds like a wiring connection/earth leakage?

Good luck with yours!

Jeremy

oldzed · Nov 19, 2009

Jer05 said:
Have you got it fixed now? If so can you supply an update?

I have just come home from doing a friend a favour and picking his son up to take him to football practice. On the way up the very steep drive my previously faultless box entered the same state as yours. i.e. flashing lights (M & S) and limp home mode. I was also in high ratio 'D', not sport mode. My car like yours 2000 reg and 110k miles.

I have just secured some work but in Cornwall (150 mile trip from home) so as you say this is not a great run up to Christmas. Thanks to all the members posting their views. I have a great checklist for tomorrow. I am also glad to hear the box is usualy bullet proof. That is what I had heard before I chose an Auto.

I will start with the loom because the only other sympton that preceded this fault was that I went to start the car the other day and it 'clicked' as if low voltage/flat battery. I then locked and unlocked the car to ensure the immobiliser was off etc and it started fine. I had this happen x 2 over the last week. Given the battery then has plenty of 'oomph' it sounds like a wiring connection/earth leakage?

Good luck with yours!

Jeremy

I am now convinced that it is the gear selector position switch (known as the XYZ switch) on the side of the gearbox. I did ring round last night including Paddocks but it now looks like its a call to the Main Stealers and £130 ish whipped from my bank account. They are a self fit option, not easy and without the 'special line up' tool, a bit more fiddley. Its recommended to remove the exhaust front pipe but once again it can be done with it in place. If I can get the part today or tomorrow, then it will get fitted over the weekend. I will update when done. As a matter of interest, what has happened to Craddock the other 4x4 specialist, I could not get their website to work last night, are they no longer around ?

TD5 Auto box

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