Tapping noise from top of engine

Well I got the Rocker Box off again - much easier when you have done it before - on initial inspection all seems fine in there but will do some more checks now the cover is off - I have enclosed pictures 1-11

Please note on pic 5 & 6 when removing the clip from the injector drain off pipe - USE A SMALL MAGNET, these things tend to ping everywhere, also there is a bolt at the rear rocker box cover where you have to losen the fuel line in order to get the socket over the long no 10 - other than that bobs your uncle

Fantastic, will be so helpful in the future

daft question, wonder if it’s important for the left camshaft headers to be in sequence m back left looks like number 2, then next one number 5

Haven’t got much knowledge ref hydraulic followers , assume u can check there clearance

keep the pics coming if that’s ok please and will be very interesting to see what the outcome is

u have the LZ forum looking over ur shoulder with interest , lol

Also seeing the pics I’ve noticed that the egr has been blanked, sorry to say it will fail it’s mot , what a lot of us do is refit the egr pipes but put a blank between the engine block and egr pipe

just wished to give u a heads up, also have u cleaned ur map sensor, it’s in the throttle body

also when ur ready , new copper seals for ur injectors , the freelander 2 are the same seals and cheaper

hope u didn’t mind me mentioning it

Hi she has only just gone through its MOT about 2 weeks ago - with the EGR blanked, and it passed ( after the Hand Brake module was replaced ) - yes the Map was cleaned - it looks like I am going to have to take the Cams out to get to the Rocker Arms & Tappets - this will be fun lol

hotmrw said:

Hi she has only just gone through its MOT about 2 weeks ago - with the EGR blanked, and it passed ( after the Hand Brake module was replaced ) - yes the Map was cleaned - it looks like I am going to have to take the Cams out to get to the Rocker Arms & Tappets - this will be fun lol

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well that’s a great result then, looks like different mot stations are ignoring it , still, never mind it went through

if u need part numbers or info plse shout and will try and find it for u , normally a dab hand finding part numbers

Hi each and all - I have a video update RE: the tapping, I could be wrong but this doesn't look right to me - the chain tensioner drops ( metal on metal ) on about the fourth revoloution of turning the Crankshaft - have alook and see what you think, this could be a potential cause of my tap tap tapping - the more RPM - the faster the chain tensioner is tapping down and it is metal on metal as there is a metal base on my tensioner - that hits the tensioner casing which is also metal.

Having just listened to the engine noise. Sounds horrible. It sounds like it's spun a bearing.

Nodge68 said:

Having just listened to the engine noise. Sounds horrible. It sounds like it's spun a bearing.

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hi mate

hope all is well

do think the check valve inside the tensioner is letting by allowing it to do that , when u press down I assume oil isn’t suppose to come back out on these , either way tensioner looks knackered

do u think, ref the crank , wondering if the noise is just that failed tensioner

always find it very interesting

hotmrw said:

Hi each and all - I have a video update RE: the tapping, I could be wrong but this doesn't look right to me - the chain tensioner drops ( metal on metal ) on about the fourth revoloution of turning the Crankshaft - have alook and see what you think, this could be a potential cause of my tap tap tapping - the more RPM - the faster the chain tensioner is tapping down and it is metal on metal as there is a metal base on my tensioner - that hits the tensioner casing which is also metal.

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hiya

Nice video mm thks for sharing

ref the tappet noise , can u get an oil can and try and get some oil inside the tensioner then try again to see if it drops

Wonder if the small check valve inside is sticking open then closed , so as it gets to the top pressure point, check valve opens then as ur turn the cam it closes again

just a thought

gstuart said:

hi mate

hope all is well

do think the check valve inside the tensioner is letting by allowing it to do that , when u press down I assume oil isn’t suppose to come back out on these , either way tensioner looks knackered

do u think, ref the crank , wondering if the noise is just that failed tensioner

always find it very interesting

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Hi Gary. All is well thanks, well except the Jatco gearbox, but that's another story.

Normally the timing chains will make a subtle tick, tick, tick on starting, just before the oil pressure takes up the slack in the tensioner. However this noise is much louder and slower than a timing chain slapping would be. It really does sound like a spun rod bearing to me. I hope not for the OP's sake, but it's a possibility.

Nodge68 said:

Hi Gary. All is well thanks, well except the Jatco gearbox, but that's another story.

Normally the timing chains will make a subtle tick, tick, tick on starting, just before the oil pressure takes up the slack in the tensioner. However this noise is much louder and slower than a timing chain slapping would be. It really does sound like a spun rod bearing to me. I hope not for the OP's sake, but it's a possibility.

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Hi mate

good to hear all is well, also had fun with my old jatco , got there in the end , lol

must admit when I first heard this I thought the hydraulic followers where knackered by having the knock noise and not the rattle k it don’t think that tensioner helps

mines has a rattle for 1-2 seconds on start up goes, think they all had that , but op doesn’t indeed sound so different

Daft question, can u ever check clearance on hydraulic tappets with the engine not running plse,

Know what u mean and agree think we are all hoping it’s not spun shells ,

thks again as always for ur replies , always like to learn

gstuart said:

Wonder if the small check valve inside is sticking open then closed , so as it gets to the top pressure point, check valve opens then as ur turn the cam it closes again

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The dropping of the slipper head is in time with the valve springs pulling on the chain, as the follower goes over the cam lobe. When the engine is running, there's 60 Psi of oil pressure holding that slipper head up, holding the chain in correct tension.

Hope that explains what's going on there.

gstuart said:

mines has a rattle for 1-2 seconds on start up goes, think they all had that , but op doesn’t indeed sound so different

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That's normal, and all the timing chain slap you'll hear. The chain is too short and under too much control to make much noise .

gstuart said:

Daft question, can u ever check clearance on hydraulic tappets with the engine not running plse

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Not without removing them. However they almost never fail, unless they wear on the lobe contact surface, which doesn't happen on the TDV6 if oil changes have been done on time.

Nodge68 said:

The dropping of the slipper head is in time with the valve springs pulling on the chain, as the follower goes over the cam lobe. When the engine is running, there's 60 Psi of oil pressure holding that slipper head up, holding the chain in correct tension.

Hope that explains what's going on there.

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gotcha, u know I actually get that , has like a small hole underneath the tensioner and as the cam turns oil is pushed inside the tensioner and therefore holding the chain up

also op mentions about a small amount oil coming out of the tensioner so I assume the Check valve inside is letting by , so with the engine running if the check valve keeps letting by Chain will rattle because oil pressure intermittently drops as the oil escapes , pressure drops then check valve reseals

thks as always mate for ur patience m think u know I like to learn how things work

I may be wrong - but myself and a mechanic freind have had the stethoscope on the engine bottom end and it sounds solid - but never say never - I will replace the chain tensioner - if that cures my tick all well and good - if not I will drop the sump and take a look - I personally dont think it is the bottom end - the noise is clearly the top, back, drivers side - and oil pressure is above normal - however I have been wrong a few times before lol.

hotmrw said:

I may be wrong - but myself and a mechanic freind have had the stethoscope on the engine bottom end and it sounds solid - but never say never - I will replace the chain tensioner - if that cures my tick all well and good - if not I will drop the sump and take a look - I personally dont think it is the bottom end - the noise is clearly the top, back, drivers side - and oil pressure is above normal - however I have been wrong a few times before lol.

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hiya

must admit the first time I heard it I feel like it’s the tappets , indeed I also get a lot of things wrong , lol

at least you’ve taken ur time and found that tensioner , have actually been searching for hours but can’t find the fault anywhere else

wouldn’t hurt to ask on the D3 forum in case someone else has experienced it

thks for keeping it updated

Hi each and all - I think I have an important update - I decided to turn the engine over with the rocker box removed to see if I could see any problems in there - firstly I noticed that the Tensioner does indeed tension up correctly once the oil pressure pumps it up just like Nodge68 stated - but the most interetsing thing I observed was that the cam lobe at the back ( where it tapps from ) is getting no oil - all the other cam lobes are - please take a look at the Video and Pic and let me know your thoughts - cheers, Darren.

OP - I know it’s been 2.5 years but did you get a solution to this?

Looking at the state of the cam the main bearing shell's have probably turned and resulted in a snapped crank so it's scrap.

Hi all. Interested as well as to if the OP managed to get to the bottom of this.

I've got a ticking from the rear of the engine on the driver's side (UK) when warm. You can hear it at idle and noise gets faster with revs. Drives fine. No issues with smoke power etc. Not sure my noise is exactly like this. Sounds like a ticking exhaust but can't find anything externally.

Anyways sorry for rambling.

Jamie