P38 reliability '99-00 onwards.

Hi all,

Seriously considering a P38 2.5 diesel (V8 is a bit unrealistic as the car would be used daily). I think I can safely say, even on here, that P38s are not the most reliable cars on the road. I know the 2.5 diesel is a BMW engine, so Im guessing its relatively robust. One of the main issues with the P38 seems to be electrics. Ive heard it said that from either '99 or 2000 onwards, LR used different electrical components which improved reliability. Ill be spending £5-5.5k, so a 2000/2001 model is within reach.
Can anyone either give me some info on this, or point me in the direction of the right thread?

Cheers, Dave.

Hi dave,

I drive a 2000 DSE 2.5 and ive had LOADS OF PROBLEMS. have a look at a few of my posts. i dont think its any worse or better then a V8 as i own both but parts are readily available. but for £5k ish you should get something very tasty indeed. BTW i have 190000 miles on the clock so worth bearing in mind.

P38_Ireland said:

Hi dave,

I drive a 2000 DSE 2.5 and ive had LOADS OF PROBLEMS. have a look at a few of my posts. i dont think its any worse or better then a V8 as i own both but parts are readily available. but for £5k ish you should get something very tasty indeed. BTW i have 190000 miles on the clock so worth bearing in mind.

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In terms of being 'worse or better', Im really going for the diesel for the lower running costs rather than more reliability.
Reading through the RR forum on here is scary quite frankly, P38 reliability looks suspect to me (although Ive always loved them, and will no doubt end up with one).
Im trying to establish if buying a late model (say 2001) P38 means improved reliability over the mid-late 90s ones? I remember hearing that electric components were changed to Bosch or something around 2000, which solved afew problems. I understand the 2.5 diesel to be slightly more dependable than the V8s. Also, I know that the air suspension can go.
So, if I could source a 2001, 2.5 diesel P38 with its suspension done, surely Id have something that wont immediately explode? Right? Or is poor reliability just part-and-parcel of P38 ownership?

P38_Dave said:

In terms of being 'worse or better', Im really going for the diesel for the lower running costs rather than more reliability.
Reading through the RR forum on here is scary quite frankly, P38 reliability looks suspect to me (although Ive always loved them, and will no doubt end up with one).
Im trying to establish if buying a late model (say 2001) P38 means improved reliability over the mid-late 90s ones? I remember hearing that electric components were changed to Bosch or something around 2000, which solved afew problems. I understand the 2.5 diesel to be slightly more dependable than the V8s. Also, I know that the air suspension can go.
So, if I could source a 2001, 2.5 diesel P38 with its suspension done, surely Id have something that wont immediately explode? Right? Or is poor reliability just part-and-parcel of P38 ownership?

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i was the same as you, saw p38 and fell in love. i bought one blind as it came up for sale and new nothing about it. ive learned the hard way. but i will say if you dont mind getting your hands dirty and own an average tool box thats half the battle. there is almost no question on here i have not had answered by someone who has had that problem before.

seriously bite the bullet if it breaks you can always fix it if you get sick of it you can always sell it. it will be a love hate relationship but mostly love it think! lol

Its a case of not being afraid I run a 1998 4.6 hse which I have had for 7 yrs runs on gas so about 40 quid for 200 plus miles round town used daily as for electrics in 7 yrs no problems until this month when the fuse box needed replacing 150 quid I have replaced bushes track rods all sorts but it is wear and tear the great thing is that it can be fixed even the main computer that controls all non engine functions can be refurbed. The reality is it is a 10+ yr old vehicle and no matter what marque it was you would have the same issues the important thing is that you can get the bits and on here the help and assistance so if I was you look for best nick and highest spec all the rest can be fixed.
By the way I bought mine cheap with faults and then fixed them that way those bits were pristine. Good luck in your search

P38_Dave said:

Hi all,

Seriously considering a P38 2.5 diesel (V8 is a bit unrealistic as the car would be used daily). I think I can safely say, even on here, that P38s are not the most reliable cars on the road. I know the 2.5 diesel is a BMW engine, so Im guessing its relatively robust. One of the main issues with the P38 seems to be electrics. Ive heard it said that from either '99 or 2000 onwards, LR used different electrical components which improved reliability. Ill be spending £5-5.5k, so a 2000/2001 model is within reach.
Can anyone either give me some info on this, or point me in the direction of the right thread?

Cheers, Dave.

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I have a late 2000 DHSE, I can honestly say it has been more reliable than the nearly new Xtrail that preceded it. Find a good one that has not had a lot of owners, preferable with the last owner having kept it for a long time and you should be OK. I also have 2 mates with 2000/01 DHSE's who have also had little trouble. Budget for replacing the air suspension bags as soon as you get it to save yourself grief though as they will be at the end of their life. Other bits wear out like window regulators, drag links etc, but the parts are relatively cheap if you can do the work yourself.
Remember what you see on here are the people with problems, the good ones don't need the forum.

Much as above. The suspension (EAS) is not "fit & forget": airbags have a life of about 10yrs. Airpumps can fail (especially if over-worked because of leaks), but are repairable/replaceable. Just keep on top of it. (check-out www.rswsolutions if you haven`t already).
The BMW unit is pretty robust IF (like ALL engines) it`s been properly maintained.
Many P38s are being broken now, so many parts are available 2nd hand, but take care not to replace your worn out bit with some-one else`s worn-out bit!
Good cars, but very expensive when new and they ain`t never gonna be a "sensible economic choice". Go in with your eyes open, look around a good `un and good luck.

Just backing up DATATEK and GTLAND's comments. I bought a diesel P38 that had been bought from new by the father and then passed to his son. I've had great fun using this forum and replacing the bits that get most mentions on here BEFORE they let me down; ALL the fluids and filters, airbags, compressor (rebuild) etc. However even with all this preventative work I still had the dreaded suspension failure a couple of weeks ago so can I suggest that you factor in a few bob spent with Black Box as well.

Only thing I'd add to the comments above is maybe consider a V8 on LPG instead?

Personally, I feel a Range Rover should have a V8 under the bonnet, and with an LPG kit fitted I imagine the running costs would be similar to a diesel with better performance!

MikeV8SE said:

Only thing I'd add to the comments above is maybe consider a V8 on LPG instead?

Personally, I feel a Range Rover should have a V8 under the bonnet, and with an LPG kit fitted I imagine the running costs would be similar to a diesel with better performance!

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Yeah right, head gaskets X 2, slipped liners, coil packs, plug leads, then with gas you can't go through most tunnels in europe and there is no way even on LPG you will match the 30mpg of my diesel with a power box on the motorway

Thanks for the advice chaps. Forums are a double-edged sword- theyre good for knowing what to buy/ look out for, but also let you see all the potential probs before you splash out.
Ive always thought the V8s were less reliable than the diesel units. Im aware that the diesel is very slow, but Im looking for a comfy commuter not a sports car (got one for special occasions!).
Trouble is, I have zero mechanical knowledge, which may mean a Range isnt the most sensible choice...

P38_Dave said:

Thanks for the advice chaps. Forums are a double-edged sword- theyre good for knowing what to buy/ look out for, but also let you see all the potential probs before you splash out.
Ive always thought the V8s were less reliable than the diesel units. Im aware that the diesel is very slow, but Im looking for a comfy commuter not a sports car (got one for special occasions!).
Trouble is, I have zero mechanical knowledge, which may mean a Range isnt the most sensible choice...

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The diesel is slow as standard, but flies with a power box fitted.
If you don't want to get your hands dirty, go for a Shogun/Pajero

P38_Dave said:

Trouble is, I have zero mechanical knowledge, ...

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Lol! Sounds like me before I got mine. That changed though.

No don't get a P38 if you don't want to / can't get your hands greasy sometimes. Any car when it gets to 8 - 10 years old starts to have multiple bits fail. Its a bit of a labour of love to fix things and its frustrating because of course they don't go at the same time so psychologically it can seem never ending. However once you do get through that phase the cars are usually safe for another 4 or 5 years. This has been my experience with several vehicles including those I owned from new.

A few facts about the P38 (from my experience).

1. It won't explode (as you mentioned earlier). Things may keep going wrong but she'll always bring you home.

2.The EAS is a huge part of the RR experience. Otherwise you could buy a Defender. The EAS is not unreliable. However at this sort of age it will need to be renewed. It can be done for the price of a good coil conversion, will last as long and be much more comfortable.

3.The engine cooling system (both diesel and petrol) works well but does not have much tolerance. So if there is the slightest leak or a water pump that's turning slow or a radiator fan that doesn't get up to speed, it will overheat and that will kill the engine. If you keep the cooling circuit in shape you will have no problems.

4.The diesel engine is underpowered. Which means to get away from traffic lights before they go back to red again you need a chip tune and so on. They also have hot starting problems and leaks around the injectors etc. These are known faults. V8s don't have this. The known fault in the V8 is the infamous cracked block / slipped liner etc but that has to do with overheating which I covered before. Don't overheat the engine and you'll never have a problem.

5.Your newer P38 will have the alarm and remote key issue resolved. On older cars that were built before WiFi became so common, there is an issue of the alarm system being kept constantly awake from stray WiFi signals resulting in overnight battery drain.

6. If you bear in mind that the Range Rover was a high-end luxury vehicle then you'll understand that it had the state of the art electronics of its day. Part of that is the BECM, an electronic brain that's supposed to control and manage everything. Its quaintly cumbersome and old fashioned by today's electronics but was red hot when it came out. The BECM can sometimes hiccup. If you keep the rest of the car in shape and epecially if you keep the battery healthy its less likely to happen but it still will happen. When it does, there are good folk on here who will talk you through the various options.

7. Being a luxury car, LR presumed that having affluent owners the P38 would be maintained regardless of cost. Well maintained it is still (IMO) one of the most comfortable, poised and elegant rides on the road. And maintenance is much cheaper today than when it was new because its one of the last cars that can still be mostly owner maintained or if you prefer not to, there are plenty of knowledgeable independents. Under these conditions it is also a rugged go anywhere vehicle. But its no Series III in the kalahari that can be repaired by bush mechanics with some elephant dung and a bit of twine!

Mine is a 97 deisel auto with 147K on it (lots of high milers out there so must do something right), runs great (touch wood) you do get the odd electrical gremlins-ABS light, SRS light, elect window switch pack, but it tows my 23 foot boat with ease and tbh its fine on power. Its great in the snowy conditions but as for previous post about pajero's watch out for cylinder head, go on POCUK and see, I am a fully paid up member of the Pajero cracked head and blown turbo club. By the way mine is on coils, not hard job to do and contarary to what some think its rides fine and has no stability problems.
Cheers
Davie

:welcome2: HI DAVE, i am a newish member and read and digest all the comments good or bad , you will always get good advice from the same regular people i. e . datatek . wammers . j the range .the irish rover. bob lydon .etc etc to name just a few but there is many others . i think like me the named ones are all retired or got time on their hands ????? but are very very handy to get your answers ,,,,,, praise indeed where praise is due !!! anyway the point of my rambling is , i aquired a 2000 4.6 v8 vogue rr approx 4 mths ago . its only had 2 owners one being my son in law so that helped , its a petrol with a multipoint LPG system and apart from being immaculate inside n out i have all the history paperwork . its only done 83k from new . and yes i have had four or five probs with it and nearly all of them frustrating without the knowledge i learned off this site and it gets easier , i previously have had 3 different 2.8 lwb imported pajeros all diesel and over 15yrs had no probs with them having them serviced regularly and maintained .. wich is exactly what im doin with the vogue and will continue to do so , im totally mad about mine and love the drive and the comfort best car ive ever had and over past 42 yrs have had new and sec / hand some tasty motors but the R/R tops them all .Do your reasearch and allways get them checked over and im sure you will be well satisfied if you can find one , i personally would go for v8 petrol with lpg conversion already done min age late 99 with thor engine .happy happy hunting and NO mines not for sale good luck whatever your decision ...mozz:nospamhere:

it appears due to the lack of response ,that a good one is like hen's teeth (rare) !!!!!!!! so i consider meself very very lucky indeed ..

hi, i take it youv'e not made your mind up yet, i would have thought you would have got more response on this thread cos im sure that they must be a lot of top v8s about ?????.cheers mozz

i have a 1995 2.5 diesel manual,it has done 122,000 miles it has demanded maintenance,hurt my pocket a few times,i repair it myself,apart from the clutch which i had replaced.
it is reliable,had 13 owners,but i would not be without it,it has a presence few vehicles i have driven has,there is just something about it,i would not want to part with it. mine had been through the trade hence the high owners,but i am glad i found it,and i am slowly bringing back up to how it should be.
one of the few cars,that if it can it will limp you home,not many vehicles that can do that.