P38A p38 Rang Rover 2.5td Torque Converter Lock-up

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If the gear box oil has not been changed, I suggest you do it and look to see if the oil is blackened. Oil should be changed every 25K. Add some Lucas Transmission fix.
 
Thanks kindly for your reply Datatek, I was going to hunt though what oils, filters ect to use. ill avoid asking what oil as I know that's something that causes great argument and people to be shot :)
 
fiatpandaman said:
Thanks kindly for your reply Datatek, I was going to hunt though what oils, filters ect to use. ill avoid asking what oil as I know that's something that causes great argument and people to be shot :)
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Gearbox is ATF Dexron 3, 9.7 litres needed plus a filter and gasket. Fill until oil runs out of filler hole (If no dipstick), start engine, run through the gears slowly with the gear lever and then with the engine running continue to fill until oil runs out. Job done. Put the transmission fix in first.
 
Is that 9.7 litres the figure from completely empty - as in new torque converter etc?
If you're just changing fluid & filter then I suggest you check the level then drain & measure how much you get out. This will give you an accurate guide as to how much you need to put in. Quite a bit of fluid remains in the tc as it can't be drained.
There's an article here. Some discussion about dipstick or level plug for the refill level but just look at what's on your car & proceed accordingly.
https://www.landyzone.co.uk/land-rover/p38-auto-gearbox-filter-change.136345/

ETA Use a new rubber gasket. They can harden over time & then leak. Use genuine. I did one some years ago & used a 'quality aftermarket' item which was a little undersized & needed a bit of pulling about. Replaced earlier this year with one that came in a ZF logo'd bag & it fitted perfectly.
 
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Ratae said:
Is that 9.7 litres the figure from completely empty - as in new torque converter etc?
If you're just changing fluid & filter then I suggest you check the level then drain & measure how much you get out. This will give you an accurate guide as to how much you need to put in. Quite a bit of fluid remains in the tc as it can't be drained.
There's an article here. Some discussion about dipstick or level plug for the refill level but just look at what's on your car & proceed accordingly.
https://www.landyzone.co.uk/land-rover/p38-auto-gearbox-filter-change.136345/

ETA Use a new rubber gasket. They can harden over time & then leak. Use genuine. I did one some years ago & used a 'quality aftermarket' item which was a little undersized & needed a bit of pulling about. Replaced earlier this year with one that came in a ZF logo'd bag & it fitted perfectly.
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The 9.7 litres is from RAVE and an approximation. The amount that comes out is not relevant as it may have been under or over filled. Follow the correct filling procedure I gave in post #23 and the right amount of fluid will be in the box.
 
Datatek said:
The 9.7 litres is from RAVE and an approximation. The amount that comes out is not relevant as it may have been under or over filled. Follow the correct filling procedure I gave in post #23 and the right amount of fluid will be in the box.
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The maximum you will get out is around five litres. The torque converter and oil cooler cannot be drained.
 
Datatek said:
As you say 5 litres or thereabouts for a re-fill. Memory failure again on my part.
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No probs Keith. I always say drain and refill, add some Lucas. Run for a couple of weeks then drain again change filter top up again with Lucas. Should be ok then. But if the fluid is very black damage has already occurred so it's a gamble, but if it works it's a lot cheaper than a new box.
 
Fluid is red and correct, no burnt smell, going to do the change anyway as there are other things I need to attend to so may as well get it all out of the way in one go. I should get away with 5ltr then. Anything I should be doing different as its got a dipstick on the box
 
wammers said:
No probs Keith. I always say drain and refill, add some Lucas. Run for a couple of weeks then drain again change filter top up again with Lucas. Should be ok then. But if the fluid is very black damage has already occurred so it's a gamble, but if it works it's a lot cheaper than a new box.
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Lucas has kept my box running for a few years now after problems with sticky solenoids. I am about to acquire an HP24 from a 4.6, so a gearbox swap is in the offing. The changes on my rescue project P38 illustrate just how lumpy mine is getting again.
 
fiatpandaman said:
Fluid is red and correct, no burnt smell, going to do the change anyway as there are other things I need to attend to so may as well get it all out of the way in one go. I should get away with 5ltr then. Anything I should be doing different as its got a dipstick on the box
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Fill to level on the dipstick, start engine, run thorough the gears, keep filling until the correct level is reached. Do not over fill.
 
fiatpandaman said:
Fluid is red and correct, no burnt smell, going to do the change anyway as there are other things I need to attend to so may as well get it all out of the way in one go. I should get away with 5ltr then. Anything I should be doing different as its got a dipstick on the box
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This from Ashcroft's website & is for the dipstick tube:
Oil Fill
Always use a good quality oil, preferably a Dextron III or similar. Put the transfer case in neutral and fill. Start the engine, the oil level will drop immediately, top back up straight away. Move the shifter lever up and down through the gears slowly whilst checking the oil level and topping up as required. Once the level has stabilised, put the transfer case in gear and the unit should now be picking up drive, this is indicated by the engine revs dropping when put in Drive.
https://www.ashcroft-transmissions.co.uk/automatic-gearboxes/zf4hp22eh.html

I do my Classic - ZF 4HP22 - that way. Fill via the dipstick tube. I use one of the 500ml bottles with the plastic tube on the end which fits into the top of the tube & initially fill until it appears on the bottom of the dipstick before starting the engine.
Keep checking with the dipstick - it can be a bit of a pain during the check when idling phase & have a piece of rag to wipe as it comes out as drips will end up on the exhaust.
If you've checked the level before draining & measured the quantity that comes out then you have a reasonable idea of roughly how much you'll need to put in which will help to avoid overfilling as Datatek says

ETA It mentions in the LZ link I posted earlier that the joint between the tube & the sump can be a PITA. That's also been my experience. It's two conical shapes clamped together by the nut on the tube. I was getting a bit twitchy as I was tightening more & more but still had a very very slight weep. In the end I used a little smear of hylomar between the two faces & that stopped it.
 
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Ratae said:
This from Ashcroft's website & is for the dipstick tube:
Oil Fill
Always use a good quality oil, preferably a Dextron III or similar. Put the transfer case in neutral and fill. Start the engine, the oil level will drop immediately, top back up straight away. Move the shifter lever up and down through the gears slowly whilst checking the oil level and topping up as required. Once the level has stabilised, put the transfer case in gear and the unit should now be picking up drive, this is indicated by the engine revs dropping when put in Drive.
https://www.ashcroft-transmissions.co.uk/automatic-gearboxes/zf4hp22eh.html

I do my Classic - ZF 4HP22 - that way. Fill via the dipstick tube. I use one of the 500ml bottles with the plastic tube on the end which fits into the top of the tube & initially fill until it appears on the bottom of the dipstick before starting the engine.
Keep checking with the dipstick - it can be a bit of a pain during the check when idling phase & have a piece of rag to wipe as it comes out as drips will end up on the exhaust.
If you've checked the level before draining & measured the quantity that comes out then you have a reasonable idea of roughly how much you'll need to put in which will help to avoid overfilling as Datatek says

ETA It mentions in the LZ link I posted earlier that the joint between the tube & the sump can be a PITA. That's also been my experience. It's two conical shapes clamped together by the nut on the tube. I was getting a bit twitchy as I was tightening more & more but still had a very very slight weep. In the end I used a little smear of hylomar between the two faces & that stopped it.
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I think that maybe referencing a complete fill from empty for a new box and torque converter. Normal method to refill after draining for oil change with dipstick equipped boxes would be. Refill with slightly less than four litres of fluid. Start engine and move through gears slowly several times. Place in park. With engine running fill until fluid reaches top level mark on dipstick. Fluid level should always be checked with gearbox cold with engine running after moving through gears and placing in park. Note: Fluid level will ALWAYS be above max mark if dipped without engine running even when cold. Or when fluid is hot with engine running or not.
 
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Just been & looked at my dipstick which has stamped on it:
CHECK WHEN COLD IDLING IN NEUTRAL DANGER DO NOT OVERFILL

Although Rave for post 99 says:
Refill 7. Refill gearbox to bottom of filler/level plug hole with correct grade of fluid. 8. Ensure gear lever in the ’P’ position, start engine and move selector lever through all gear positions and back to ’P’ position. 9. With the engine idling, continue filling gearbox until a small thread of fluid runs from filler/level orifice. 10. Refit filler/level plug using a new sealing washer and tighten to 30 Nm (22 lbf.ft). 11. Lower vehicle.
http://www.landroverweb.com/Pdf-files/Manuals/Workshop-Manual-P38-Range-Rover.pdf
 
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Chock the wheels - with proper chocks not lumps of rock/bricks.
Spent quite a bit of time under mine earlier this year with the gear & transfer boxes off. I chock two wheels with a chock in front of and behind each wheel.
 
Ratae said:
Just been & looked at my dipstick which has stamped on it:
CHECK WHEN COLD IDLING IN NEUTRAL DANGER DO NOT OVERFILL

Although Rave for post 99 says:
Refill 7. Refill gearbox to bottom of filler/level plug hole with correct grade of fluid. 8. Ensure gear lever in the ’P’ position, start engine and move selector lever through all gear positions and back to ’P’ position. 9. With the engine idling, continue filling gearbox until a small thread of fluid runs from filler/level orifice. 10. Refit filler/level plug using a new sealing washer and tighten to 30 Nm (22 lbf.ft). 11. Lower vehicle.
http://www.landroverweb.com/Pdf-files/Manuals/Workshop-Manual-P38-Range-Rover.pdf
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wammers said:
Park or neutral it doesn't matter. But if i were changing the fluid on a post 99 i would much rather it was in park when i crawled under it. What do you think.
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As said - Pre 99 Check in N - Post 99 Check in P (for obvious reasons)
 
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