Need a man who knows 200 tdi engines backwards.

need someone who knows 200tdi engines backwards to help with a problem I have with mine.

Previously a good engine, puff of black on start up then nothing at all however you drove it, no black or blue smoke and used no oil or water. It has done 100k and had full service history being looked after properly by the previous owner.

One day it faded and lost power, would only tick over and would not rev.

Changed lift pump, filter, filter housing and injector pump, fitted new cambelt and fuel lines including leak off pipes, had injectors tested.

Engine will now tick over fine when cold but when revved pumps clouds of blue smoke out, heavier on overrun.
When warm will rev freely after an initial stutter with no smoke at all but when revs held steady will pump clouds of blue smoke out again.

No head gasket problems and compressions well up at 400 per cylinder.

Fuel returning ok but no leak off of diesel at No 4 injector, even swapped for No 1 injector which was leaking off ok but when put in at No 4 then no leak off.

Injector pump is a good one and timing is ok.

any ideas as I'm all out..........

Just a thought,did you check the woodruff key on the crank sprocket ?

eightinavee said:

Just a thought,did you check the woodruff key on the crank sprocket ?

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Twice

Have you checked oil not coming from turbo?

Also are compression readings instantly up or build up to figures quoted-if they build up suspect rings and bores

fanatic said:

Have you checked oil not coming from turbo?

Also are compression readings instantly up or build up to figures quoted-if they build up suspect rings and bores

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Compressions up after engine turned very little , about as much as to start it when warm.

Not turbo, no oil escaping and blowing like a good un.

The little rod from the wastegate actuator thing was bent but made no difference after sorting it out. Working ok as well when revved.

worth looking for blow by and crankcase pressurization-burning oil is one thing reduced power more of an issue

fanatic said:

worth looking for blow by and crankcase pressurization-burning oil is one thing reduced power more of an issue

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No pressure in rocker cover everything ok there and not burning oil as the blue smoke cleared for quite a while today and it couldn't be made to smoke at all until left for half an hour when it all started again.

If left ticking over it will stutter and miss fire until revs are built up then all ok.

No smoke if revved hard for a while, clear exhaust but smokes again if held on steady revs.



.

.Any one think it may be injectors.
I've had em checked but you never know, should they leak off diesel if you remove the leak off pipe ?

Just an idea as one of mine doesn't..........op2:

Im thinking valve stem oil seals. rocker cover of , nice bright torch, look through valve spring should just see if there ok. if not ok head off im afraid. And no wouldn`t afect compresion

uncle albert said:

Im thinking valve stem oil seals. rocker cover of , nice bright torch, look through valve spring should just see if there ok. if not ok head off im afraid. And no wouldn`t afect compresion

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Thing is it dont smell of oil and it would have to leak a lot of oil to make it misfire and smoke like it does.
Also this happened suddenly and I would think that stem seals would wear over time unless it had been over heated and it hasn't.

Thanks for the suggestion anyway

landowner said:

Thing is it dont smell of oil and it would have to leak a lot of oil to make it misfire and smoke like it does.
Also this happened suddenly and I would think that stem seals would wear over time unless it had been over heated and it hasn't.

Thanks for the suggestion anyway

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mine went after MOT cos they rev it quite hard, this seperated seal . fine going for test but next morning was like yours

uncle albert said:

mine went after MOT cos they rev it quite hard, this seperated seal . fine going for test but next morning was like yours

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Thing is ... if seals then why no smoke when revved hard and why does it struggle to build up revs after ticking over. It misfires as throttle applied and really struggles to build up revs then bursts into life as revs get higher. If you keep blipping the throttle hard then all smoke clears until non whatsoever. Stop engine and then it starts instantly with no smoke at all , it will idle all day with NO smoke whatsoever until you hit the throttle then its back to misfiring again and clouds of blue smoke.

I'll have a look tomorrow though as the rocker cover is loose as I was checking tappets when it wouldn't rev at all.

I'm hoping to get some injectors to try tomorrow as well.

it is sounding like an injector to me mind.

mathewpink said:

it is sounding like an injector to me mind.

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I'm leaning that way as well even though they have been tested. Why dosn't No 4 leak off fuel like the others?
Even if I swap injectors round No 4 doesn't leak off fuel??

landowner said:

I'm leaning that way as well even though they have been tested. Why dosn't No 4 leak off fuel like the others?
Even if I swap injectors round No 4 doesn't leak off fuel??

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Is it definately blue smoke and not grey? I had an injector go down on one of my old 6 cylinder mercedes trucks. All the symptoms were as you describe but the smoke was grey and not blue. Injector tests came up clear. After changing the entire fuel system (as you have done) the fault was still there. The workshop guys eventually conceeded defeat and took the head off. There was nothing amiss so they put it back together again. It was just the same. Turned out that it was a fooked injecter after all. A denzel engine usually gives off black smoke when it is overfuelling. IF it is massively overfuelling it will give blue/grey smoke off.

Has your engine ever been overheated or run low on oil?

What's the crank case pressure like? Is it breathing heavy?

unless someone has suggested it a rag and loosening off the high pressure injector feed one by one with engine running would shut down each injector and you could see if it changed.
Also the bosch ve pump and injector system-injectors are two stage from memory and could be giving a peculiar fault

ratty said:

Is it definately blue smoke and not grey? I had an injector go down on one of my old 6 cylinder mercedes trucks. All the symptoms were as you describe but the smoke was grey and not blue. Injector tests came up clear. After changing the entire fuel system (as you have done) the fault was still there. The workshop guys eventually conceeded defeat and took the head off. There was nothing amiss so they put it back together again. It was just the same. Turned out that it was a fooked injecter after all.

Has your engine ever been overheated or run low on oil?

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Never overheated as far as I know and wasn't using oil, I too suspect an injector even though they have been tested, I'm going to try some good injectors tomorrow and if that dont work then the lad I bought it off isn't telling me something.
The smoke is definitely blue and lots of it, more on over run than when given the boot.
It has used some oil from when we put the engine in about 3k ago I think but Tom used to give it some stick, it's not blowing it out anywhere and the compressions are great so dont think it's mechanical. Hope not any way..

Was the replacement injector pump tested before fitting ?

Had something similar on my 200Tdi, car lost power, would not revv properly, smokey, no power. Everything else seemed to be fine. Turned out to be a blocked Intercooler...

Regards
Ngigi

eightinavee said:

Was the replacement injector pump tested before fitting ?

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Was said by the seller to be off a good running engine, it has been re timed and seems to be pumping at good pressure but apart from that I'm trusting that it's a good one

ngigiwaithaka said:

Had something similar on my 200Tdi, car lost power, would not revv properly, smokey, no power. Everything else seemed to be fine. Turned out to be a blocked Intercooler...


Regards
Ngigi

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If only......had the intercooler/turbo disconnected and still the same unfortunately . hello btw:welcome2: