Maf not needed on 10p engine

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Turboman said:
Old diesels didn't have that either! :)
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thks, reason i asked was i read an article a while back , where depending on year where a maf was fitted the maf either controlled the egrs and had nothing to do with fueling then other years it did

i must have read the article wrong
 
gstuart said:
thks, reason i asked was i read an article a while back , where depending on year where a maf was fitted the maf either controlled the egrs and had nothing to do with fueling then other years it did

i must have read the article wrong
Click to expand...

Old diesels didn't have EGR so no MAF was needed. MAF sensors are only fitted to diesels with EGR for the reasons explained earlier.
 
wammers said:
No it works in exactly the same way. But later circuits are more integrated.
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thks, think there’s always the confusing factor , ie on my td4 it was always said if u unplug the maf sensor it can change the way the engine runs, therefore and always assumed it controlled the amount of fuel

ie with a maf unplugged in how it makes the mpg worse

think that was where i got confused, which i may add doesn’t take a lot

as always appreciate the reply
 
bankz5152 said:
@sierrafery
From my own experience I have my MAF unlugged as when I hit the top end my '04 110 starts to kangaroo a little, cuts fuel and looses power. Unplugged MAF no issues, just goes and goes...
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I'm sure that if you'd save a live data log you'll see that when it starts kangarooing the air flow reading exceeds 680 kg/hr and the ECU cuts fuelling for turbocharger overspeed protection cos at that sucction the turbo spins very fast... can be bad MAF or a boost leak somewhere, MAF only Genuine LR is reliable, not OEM VDO nor others... IMHO in the MAF area RAVE is wrong(not the only case) and so are those who dont understand how an electronic engine management with addaptive strategy works and they are confusing an electronically managed EUI turbocharged engine with electronic throttle inputs with some old tractor diesel engine throttled with a cable, i'm not gonna do this again with mr. Wammers nor with other mechanical specialists, the subject was ultra debated: https://www.landyzone.co.uk/land-rover/td5-maf.315630/ , even more here https://www.landyzone.co.uk/land-rover/egr-removal-improvements.289849/

for the OP: IMO despite of what those specialist tuners are saying if you want your td5 engine to run at 100% capacity you need a well working MAF connected, it's effect is not so noticeable on 10P like on 15+P but with it unplugged the ECU goes to default on ALL Td5s , believe me or not
 
sierrafery said:
I'm sure that if you'd save a live data log you'll see that when it starts kangarooing the air flow reading exceeds 680 kg/hr and the ECU cuts fuelling for turbocharger overspeed protection cos at that sucction the turbo spins very fast... can be bad MAF or a boost leak somewhere, MAF only Genuine LR is reliable, not OEM VDO nor others... IMHO in the MAF area RAVE is wrong(not the only case) and so are those who dont understand how an electronic engine management with addaptive strategy works and they are confusing an electronically managed EUI turbocharged engine with electronic throttle inputs with some old tractor diesel engine throttled with a cable, i'm not gonna do this again with mr. Wammers nor with other mechanical specialists, the subject was ultra debated: https://www.landyzone.co.uk/land-rover/td5-maf.315630/ , even more here https://www.landyzone.co.uk/land-rover/egr-removal-improvements.289849/

for the OP: IMO despite of what those specialist tuners are saying if you want your td5 engine to run at 100% capacity you need a well working MAF connected, it's effect is not so noticeable on 10P like on 15+P but with it unplugged the ECU goes to default on ALL Td5s , believe me or not
Click to expand...

Yes later versions of EU emissions standards 3-4 and 5 do use air flow to restrict or allow certain functions. But the engine is NOT fuelled subject to airflow.
 
neilly said:
And down the rabbit hole we go again........:rolleyes::rolleyes:
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No we dont
icon_silent.gif
 
bankz5152 said:
My Nanocom has been playing up and not been able to record live data! Even went back to BBS who found no faults and they managed to record data but for some reason I cant...
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did they use the same SD card like you do?...explain what's happening when you can't record does it reject the command or what?
 
bankz5152 said:
What we need is to find the original team from LR to settle this haha
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they would not know, no diesel mechanical engineer or other engine specialist would... we need to find the original electronists team from Lucas who built and programmed the ECU cos they know how they made the addaptive strategy as the data from the MAF sensor and the Engine Speed in RPM from the crank sensor are used to determine the air mass in milligrams within each cylinder on each intake stroke (mg/stroke) cos that's how the Td5 ECU is built and that's what it does, being a microprocessor not some artifficial intelligence it doesn't care how the diesel engine works while it calculates these things together with the IQ(injected quantity) then it gives the command to the injectors to release fuel into the cylinders based on those calculations, the electronic throttle inputs, MAP/IAT, FT, ECT..... that dumb ECU uses the MAF readings in it's calculations after the folowing formula: air mass = (MAF x 33333) / (RPM x 5) and the amount of fuel injected by the ECU depends on a combination of the air mass within the cylinder and the speed of the engine if the MAF fails to send signal the the ECU switches the calculation and uses MAP/IAT and then the air mass = (MAP x Cylinder Volume in cc x Molar Mass air (g/mole)) / (IAT(K) x R)..
in this formula the Lucas Td5 ECU uses the following values:
  • MAP = kPa x 100 (or milliBar x 10)
  • IAT = Kelvin x 10
  • Cyl Volume = 498
  • n(air) = 28980
  • R = 8314
that's how the ECU is built to work that's a fact as about how the diesel engine works i dont care as long as i'm speaking only about the ECU here not about the engine,

what will a remap do? will modify some data in the ECU(fuel map) as to optimise the fuelling or increase power, so if i go into the ECU and modify some figures the wrong way that ECU will send too much or too less fuel into the engine depends on how it was programmed cos the ECU doesnt give a sh*t about how the diesel engine was built to work by mr Rudolf, the ECU will do what it was programmed to do then the engine will run better or worst :cool: ... i'll not contest anything about how the engine works cos i'm speaking only about electronics here that's why i bolded the ECU so many times :)

that's it, i'm in the night shift and i have to keep myself adrenalised somehow cos it's a lack of air traffic untill the morning :D
 
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