Ipod connection

MrGorsky said:

Martyn,

I've been looking at the wiring diagram for the HK "high line trim level 3" stereo that you have.

Being posh, it has 4 door mounted amplifiers that supply power to the door speakers, plus the other bass bin thing in the boot.

Taking the wire colours from the schematic, it should be pretty easy to splice in an ipod connection that would bypass the head unit entirely.

I may look in to this more once I've sorted out the other little things I want to neaten up first.

Click to expand...

Unfortunately, that won't work... The amps require a balanced input with matched impedance (70 ohms). If you connect anything with an unbalanced output (iPod headphone jack, line-out, or any head unit RCA line-out) you will introduce massive amounts of noise into the system and all you will get is a very loud buzzing noise that can't be cured with a ground loop isolator (because it's not a ground loop, it's interference). Plus... 'splicing' anything in whilst leaving the original HU connected up would screw the pooch completely.

You would need to bypass the iPod's internal headphone amp by using the pre-out pins on the dock connector, then feed that to a suitable MOSFET pre-amp that gives balanced output at 70 ohms... Then split that output into 5, with recovery amplification, and suitable low-pass filtering on the sub input channel.

Yes, I know, it's complicated!!! Trust me, I've done a great deal of research on this!

Only 2 ways of getting iPod input into this system are:

1. Replace HU with iPod-compatible one, and suitable attenuating harness adaptor (tried, tested, gives great results)

2. Modify your existing harness to splice aux input into CD changer. Theoretically possible, buy as yet an unknown (unless anyone knows of somebody who's done it?). I'd like to experiment with this one further... If anyone has a set-up they wouldn't mind me fiddling with???

It MAY even be possible to build some kind of harness adaptor that will give you an AUX input and the ability to switch between that and the CD changer signal... Hmmm...

I'm gonna look into that... Give me a little while to think and research. It will be ALOT easier to do on Alpine systems than Clarion ones, since the CD changer to HU cabling and plugs on Clarion units are bespoke... But then again, those with Clarion units have the option of having an AUX input added by the manufacturer.

Let me see what I can come up with... I may need to hash something together and send it to an owner with an Alpine system who's willing to be my guinea pig... Any volunteers??

I managed to find an inline kit for my HK setup that sits between the CD and Headunit and provides two phono inputs and a switching unit to allow me to select between either the CD or either of the phono inputs. I'll see if I can dig out the details on it.


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Clarky's idea looks like the way forward.

I have the older Clarion system on mine, but looking about on the web I have found a pinout diagram for the Clarion CD changer Range Rover PU-2050A. (I'm not sure if this is my part number btw).

Anyhoo, if it is, surely it's just a case of interrupting pins 5 and 6 (L-R) with a switch and then connecting up the ipod through a dock cable. Then you could use the switch to select either CD input or ipod input.

Is there a test you can do to check the pins for the presence of audio signal?

There was a post on rangerovers.net where a guy had done this to his Disco, and he didn't have to have a cd playing to make it work, just selected to an empty disc.

I have a unit from Grom in mine, full ipod control plus steering wheel control. it also has a 3.5mm input as well, works inplace of the cd changer. If you make=up playlists it will treat these as 'cd' tracks too. I have a classic 160gb that is hidden away so you don't have to have it on show, charges it too.

john-sussex said:

I have a unit from Grom in mine, full ipod control plus steering wheel control. it also has a 3.5mm input as well, works inplace of the cd changer. If you make=up playlists it will treat these as 'cd' tracks too. I have a classic 160gb that is hidden away so you don't have to have it on show, charges it too.

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Sounds interesting. Got any more information?

This looks like it might be the one. For later units though. Did they change to ALpine head units in 1999?

Rover LandRover 99-05 USB Bluetooth iPod car interface adapter

MrGorsky said:

This looks like it might be the one. For later units though. Did they change to ALpine head units in 1999?

Rover LandRover 99-05 USB Bluetooth iPod car interface adapter

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Yes, Alpine after 1999. not sure why they specify 2005 though. P38 was long gone by then.

That sounds a rather over the top solution. Clarky's solution would probably be a better bet allowing you use a new head unit containing all these features - except for the steering wheel controls.

kooky_guy said:

That sounds a rather over the top solution.

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I agree, it'd be over $150.00, and won't work on mu Clarion unit!

Providing I can locate the Left and Right signal wires from the CD changer, I think I could make something for less than £20, including train fare to Maplin.

A project for the summer I think. If I can get it to work, I'll make it my first "how to"

re alpine hu in P38, i have an interface box, with connecters to the hu,
and cable from interface to i pod, i have steering wheel controls,
and it also changes tracks, it cost £112.00, IT WORKS,
i spent so much time trying to get this system to work with adaptors/hu's
not a lot will work due to impedance's,
if you want info/tel no message me, i'll get back to you, S.

ps, it also charges the i pod/ i phone.

RANGE ROVER MK2 1998-2002 MP3 iPod iPhone AUX IN Interface Adaptor CTVLRX002 | eBay

This is the nearest thing I can find. Seems the one i have might not be about anymore

I have experience with the Grom units, they do them for BMWs too, as many of them are fitted with complicated high-end audio systems. In my opinion, they are clumsy and overpriced. Also, controlling the iPod through your existing setup is very slow, compared to a modern iPod-compatible HU.

For less money, and alot less hassle, you can have an aftermarket HU that gives you all the features you want, and believe me when I tell you... A MUCH improved sound quality over the original... Plus the option of expanding your system later on if you wish with standard RCA amp outputs. The only fly in the ointment is the loss of steering wheel controls... These CAN be regained, but not cheaply. You need 2 'magic boxes' - one that reads the resistive ladder that the steering wheel controls operate and converts it into a logic signal, then another compatible with your head unit. For the expense, and hassle of having even more boxes and wiring behind the dash, I felt the steering wheel controls were a small sacrifice to pay and I really don't miss them.

I'm in the process of making up one of my leads for a Clarion system right now... I'll take pics along the way and put together a 'how-to' for those that want to do it themselves.

MrGorsky, to check for an audio signal, probe those pins (if you can) with a voltmeter set to AC. You should see a small but constantly varying AC voltage, something in the region of 0.5-2v. I reckon we could come up with something for considerably less than £20, but it would involve cutting and modifying existing wiring - I'm guessing that a 'piggyback' socket, lead and plug to modify for the Clarion HU's CD changer input would be prohibitively expensive, if obtainable at all. For Alpines, the CD changer input is on the 20-pin mini-ISO - I haven't yet come across 20-pin mini-ISO extension harnesses that could be used for a 'plug n play' solution, but I'll have a look.

Have a play and see what you come up with, and I'll do the same, and let's see what we can muster between us!

What we REALLY need to know are input impedances along that line, so it can be matched to an iPod. I'm going to try probing the clarion unit I've got here, and the CD changer, and see what I come up with. I'll also probe my iPod's output, to see what's what.

MrGorsky said:

I agree, it'd be over $150.00, and won't work on mu Clarion unit!

Providing I can locate the Left and Right signal wires from the CD changer, I think I could make something for less than £20, including train fare to Maplin.

A project for the summer I think. If I can get it to work, I'll make it my first "how to"

Click to expand...

Seems like the guys over at RangeRovers.net already did this on a Clarion unit - ipodadapter

They did it by opening up the HU itself to make the connection, thus negating the need to cut into the (expensive!) CD changer lead.

Still trying to figure out how to do this on the Alpine units. I've found the relevant parts of the wiring diagram in RAVE - all the CD changer stuff is on the C3 (blue) portion of the mini-ISO connector, but I can't find a detailed pinout for it. It only shows which pins carry which wire colours, and not what those wires actually do. I KNOW that the C1 connector pinouts are NOT ISO standard, as the sub outputs come from pins 1 & 4...

The standard mini-ISO pinouts have L & R signals on pins 19 & 20 (green & Purple respectively)... however, they also have the audio gnd on pin 18, and in RAVE pin 18 has no connection. I suspect that pins 13/16 and 14/17 may be the ones carrying the audio signals, and pin 15 is the audio / shielding gnd. The way the RAVE diagrams are drawn suggests that 13/16 and 14/17 run in pairs with extra shielding around them connected to pin 15... which means its a balanced signal... that in itself may present problems being connected to an unbalanced input.

C3 Connector (blue one) looks like this:



Any voulnteers yet with an Alpine system to do some probing for me? Need to set a multimeter to low ac voltage, and see which pairs of wires have a low but constantly varying ac voltage across them whilst playing a CD. Need to probe 13/16, 14/17 and 19/20. Also probe 15 to confirm its the audio ground - probing between that and the HU casing should show short circuit if I'm right.

If I get this nailed, I'll be able to come up with an adaptor lead for those who want to keep their original system, but have ipod input. For Clarion systems, though, it would be a DIY job only as you'd need to open up the HU!

When I use my cassette adapter, I can't hear any difference between the mp3 or a CD. It works way better than any transmitter I've tried. Get one of those head cleaner dodads and try that.

West Slope Rover said:

When I use my cassette adapter, I can't hear any difference between the mp3 or a CD. It works way better than any transmitter I've tried. Get one of those head cleaner dodads and try that.

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Whilst this may be the solution of least resistance, it doesn't provide me any chance to remove sections of my car, and get my soldering iron out!

Clarky130 said:

I'm in the process of making up one of my leads for a Clarion system right now... I'll take pics along the way and put together a 'how-to' for those that want to do it themselves.

MrGorsky, to check for an audio signal, probe those pins (if you can) with a voltmeter set to AC. You should see a small but constantly varying AC voltage, something in the region of 0.5-2v.

Click to expand...

It would appear that the Clarion unit runs on the C-Bus system. At least that was the protocol that Clarion were using when the P38 was being made.

If ours are C-Bus then....

Pin 6 = Signal Ground
Pin7 = CD L Ch Input
Pin 8 - CD R Ch Input.

There is a picture of the C-Bus pinouts here...

Search Results clarion » Mictronics

I found this from a Saab forum earlier, a guy has done a similar mod, and I'm just copying and pasting.....

"We are only concerned with pins 5,6,7,8 and 9.

This is what i did.

I bought a small box, a male 13 pin DIN connector (has 3 rows of 4 pins and 1 at the bottom as the 4th row,) some 6 core cable (you only need 5 core) an rca input mount (for left and right) and a switch. (I also bought a cable gland to stop any unwanted tugging on the cabel pulling out the solder joints)

Simply connect the switch across pins 5 and 9. (Upon closing the switch while the unit is running, it will automatically enter slave mode thinking a CD changer magazine has just become active, and therefore accept audio inputs from the CBUS socket instead)

Next connect your RIGHT auido RCA to PIN 8.

Connect your LEFT audio RCA to PIN 7

Connect GND of both RCA sockets together, and then solder this wire to PIN 6.

Seal up your box and plug in. Plug in your ipod, turn the ignition and flick the switch, the unit will enter (accs) mode on the screen, and you'll hear your music loud and crystal clear thru your factory setup."



Could be a good place to start. Especially if switching pin 5 and 9 causes the HU to switch to accessory mode and just amplify whatever is coming down pins 7 and 8. The only other thing I'd like to have would be a way of connecting up to the power and dropping the voltage to 5.5v so you can charge the ipod too.

Never had any problem with mine, fast, easy to use and does a very good job. controls the ipod without issue.

a question......... i get a volume increase at around 40 mph, then decrease of
volume below 40 mph, enlightenment anyone????

It says in my manual that there is speed dependent volume to compensate for road noise although never noticed this while driving - how smart is that! It doesnt say anything about overiding this feature though.

Hello,

I had serious problems trying to change the music head unit for a modern cd player.
After 5 trips to halfords they contacted a car audio specialist...result the head unit cant be changed.
What you can do is fit a box that fits to the back of the original unit and a usb lead plugs in, you tune channel on your radio and plug in...hey presto, sounds from your iphone or ipod.
Price was aroung £70.


Mike.

THE BUDDAH said:

Hello,

I had serious problems trying to change the music head unit for a modern cd player.
After 5 trips to halfords they contacted a car audio specialist...result the head unit cant be changed.
What you can do is fit a box that fits to the back of the original unit and a usb lead plugs in, you tune channel on your radio and plug in...hey presto, sounds from your iphone or ipod.
Price was aroung £70.


Mike.

Click to expand...

Have you not read the previous 4 pages?