injector ultrasonic baths

Hippo said:

Good practice for when yer need to buy one to put yer disco in. I'm not cleaning injectors. Just curious about peeps using them in general and remembered you were looking at it.

According to several main dealer parts dept's the FL2 is the most reliable of cars LR made. Asked just before production/new sales stopped. This I guess would be based on parts requested for repair from public and their garage. It would be a good choice so you have at least one reliable car in your street.

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that's an idea, easier to get one large enough to put me old bucket disco in there, lol

the fl2 do look half decent and would never rule one out in the future

Nodge68 said:

LR did plenty of development work on the FL2. However it does use the Ford EUCD platform, so uses a good number of components with other EUCD platform vehicles. The Ford EUCD was similar to the Ford/Mazda designed C1 platform, with which it also shares components.
The FL2 isn't actually a Ford, but uses many components from EUCD platform vehicles, including engines, gearboxes, subframes, suspension, brakes and some electrical components too.

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Thing is LR have shared components and outsourced their supply for many years. The factory is busy to say the least. Trying to supply the whole lot would need a factory many times the size of what the have. There's a lot of bad press about ford and bmw but they did a lot of good for LR when you compare to the 80's and 90's problems rover/lr had.

Must cost massive amounts of capital to fund development so part sharing or tweaking something currently available brings the prices down, or sustains the profit. Ford are known for claiming everything for themselves with FoMoCo on parts. The FL2 diesel engine originated from Peugeot psa with code name dw12, although ford somehow got in on the act. Built in France. Looks like psa and ford worked together for a while on engines. Not sure if they still do. The LR puma engine supply contract for the tratter was due to end this year. They put in place agreements which have clauses to allow them to continue supplying even if ownership changes. This ensures production continues for the expected lifetime of the part, to ensure payback of development costs. It's interesting to see just how connected many car companies are. I would assume all none LR engines will disappear with the ingemium range coming out. The FL1 used engines and gear boxes from rover cars. So did the original Series 1 - used P3 car engine and gearbox. It makes sense if what's available and can do the job or be tweaked. Looking into the history of LR and rover, Austin etc, they've all done the same over the years. I get the feeling if they hadn't then motoring would have been more eggspensive, limiting it to thems who are financially well oft. The one thing both the FL1 and FL2 have is the spirit of Land Rover.

gstuart said:

that's an idea, easier to get one large enough to put me old bucket disco in there, lol

the fl2 do look half decent and would never rule one out in the future

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Putting aside me life long devotion to Freelandering... it's not uncommon for owners of larger LR vehicles to buy a Freelander when their finances or circumstances change. Something I was told by the dealerships over the years. Surprised at the time but seems to be true. RR to Disco or FL2. Disco to FL2. Brand loyalty is lower than I eggspected by the company car contract hire drivers as that's normally centred around cost and tax. Peeps who want to continue driving a LR badged vehicle had the FL2 as an option when it were on sale. Sadly the FL1 couldn't do this as well as the FL2 can as it didn't have the same luxury appeal as the FL2 and the larger models. That said the FL1 was aimed at the younger market and priced/spec'd to suit. With the introduction of the Discovery sport this will take over as the cheaper option for larger LR vehicle owners. If circumstances change they can always buy bigger next time.

GrumpyGel said:

Evoque switched from Haldex to GKN Driveline in 2014 evidently - probably to coincide with D Sport changes.

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Evoque and Discovery Sport is still available today with Haldex and is called 'Efficient Driveline'

The GKN driveline is an option on the high power variants and is called 'Active Driveline'

And to my knowledge that setup is not used on any current production Jaguars (2 or 4Wd) until E Pace goes into production

td4van said:

Evoque and Discovery Sport is still available today with Haldex and is called 'Efficient Driveline'

The GKN driveline is an option on the high power variants and is called 'Active Driveline'

And to my knowledge that setup is not used on any current production Jaguars (2 or 4Wd) until E Pace goes into production

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Checked on the LR website and the Efficient Driveline is Std on base TD4 while Active is Std on the higher (SD4?) and Petrols and an option on the TD4.

The reason I was saying about the Jaguars was that my brother was driving a 2WD Jaguar saloon (not the -PACE) with a very similar rear axle that could distribute power to specific wheels using clutches.

The rear drive high power Jags use a electronic locking diff which isn't the same as the GKN option but closer in principle to the rear locking diff on a Discovery 3 for example where there's a traditional style diff with a multi plate clutch to lock power across the diff

The GKN active rear diff is a series of plates which allow wheel slip and can be locked and there is no traditional rear diff

Hippo said:

Putting aside me life long devotion to Freelandering... it's not uncommon for owners of larger LR vehicles to buy a Freelander when their finances or circumstances change. Something I was told by the dealerships over the years. Surprised at the time but seems to be true. RR to Disco or FL2. Disco to FL2. Brand loyalty is lower than I eggspected by the company car contract hire drivers as that's normally centred around cost and tax. Peeps who want to continue driving a LR badged vehicle had the FL2 as an option when it were on sale. Sadly the FL1 couldn't do this as well as the FL2 can as it didn't have the same luxury appeal as the FL2 and the larger models. That said the FL1 was aimed at the younger market and priced/spec'd to suit. With the introduction of the Discovery sport this will take over as the cheaper option for larger LR vehicle owners. If circumstances change they can always buy bigger next time.

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agree in what ur saying , if i decide at some stage i don't need the larger landy would indeed favour towards a FL2 , not keen on the sport models , shame they ended production of the FL2

see what u mean reading the FL2 interior , they really have upgraded it from the FL1 , very similar to mine and looks really nice

would really like to stay with the land rover badge as i have done for the last 30 x years , will have to see what's available for the future when the time comes for an upgrade

am currently very happy with the disco , time will tell, but would certainally never keep any vehicle if it became a money pit or wasn't req

think many of us are also waiting to see what the new fender will be like , next spring seems to be the current consensus for launch dates

gstuart said:

agree in what ur saying , if i decide at some stage i don't need the larger landy would indeed favour towards a FL2 , not keen on the sport models , shame they ended production of the FL2

see what u mean reading the FL2 interior , they really have upgraded it from the FL1 , very similar to mine and looks really nice

would really like to stay with the land rover badge as i have done for the last 30 x years , will have to see what's available for the future when the time comes for an upgrade

am currently very happy with the disco , time will tell, but would certainally never keep any vehicle if it became a money pit or wasn't req

think many of us are also waiting to see what the new fender will be like , next spring seems to be the current consensus for launch dates

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How very dare you. The FL2 is nothing like the Disco 3. It doesn't rust and the floor int made out of 2 sheets of ply. The FL2 was designed to be a mini range rover.

To be honest most people on ere don't need the vehicle they have. They want the vehicle they have. When you consider that and the emotional tie of wanting to own a LR, you realise year dun't need one. I don't. I choose to have one.

The new tratter will be out by the end of the current decade. It will have new fangled stuff but there will also be a reduced spec version for thems who fear electrics. There's always a lot of talk on the web and in mags. Been going on for years. It will happen. Yer'll have to be patient.

Hippo said:

How very dare you. The FL2 is nothing like the Disco 3. It doesn't rust and the floor int made out of 2 sheets of ply. The FL2 was designed to be a mini range rover.

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lol, not heard it described like that before.

Hippo said:

To be honest most people on ere don't need the vehicle they have. They want the vehicle they have. When you consider that and the emotional tie of wanting to own a LR, you realise year dun't need one. I don't.

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Very true.

Hippo said:

The new tratter will be out by the end of the current decade. It will have new fangled stuff but there will also be a reduced spec version for thems who fear electrics. There's always a lot of talk on the web and in mags. Been going on for years. It will happen. Yer'll have to be patient.

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Nah, I don't believe that. It'll have more leccy gizmos than you can poke a stick at, with a price tag to match. There won't be a cut down version niever. LR don't do utility vehicles any more - it'll just be a chunkier SUV.

Why is everyone so hung up on electronic stuff. It's actually pretty robust these days. Sure it does throw the odd wobbly, every now and then. But there are some stunningly good diagnostic doodads out there now. Using one of those, makes fault finding and fixing a real DIY possibility.

If you look at the current crop of LRs. You'll find more often than not, that it's a mechanical item that has failed, not an electronic item.

Nodge68 said:

Why is everyone so hung up on electronic stuff. It's actually pretty robust these days. Sure it does throw the odd wobbly, every now and then. But there are some stunningly good diagnostic doodads out there now. Using one of those, makes fault finding and fixing a real DIY possibility.

If you look at the current crop of LRs. You'll find more often than not, that it's a mechanical item that has failed, not an electronic item.

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after u kindly recommended the iid diagnostic reader i have to admit it's a superb bit of kit

Late 80's early 90's the bottom of car doors started to show rust after 3 years. The sills stoned chips and rusted too easily. Peeps were scared of power steering and abs. Yer had to pay more for it. Traction control was on the horizon on eggspensive cars only. All fitted as standard nowadays and we don't consider it a problem. I think electronics has made cars more reliable. It cleaned up emissions and gave us more power.

Hippo said:

How very dare you. The FL2 is nothing like the Disco 3. It doesn't rust and the floor int made out of 2 sheets of ply. The FL2 was designed to be a mini range rover.

To be honest most people on ere don't need the vehicle they have. They want the vehicle they have. When you consider that and the emotional tie of wanting to own a LR, you realise year dun't need one. I don't. I choose to have one.

The new tratter will be out by the end of the current decade. It will have new fangled stuff but there will also be a reduced spec version for thems who fear electrics. There's always a lot of talk on the web and in mags. Been going on for years. It will happen. Yer'll have to be patient.

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so that's why it's heavy with all the plywood , lol ,

may i ask what was ur first landy and what made u buy one plse

am indeed looking forward to the new fender, alas won't ever be able to afford one

Hippo said:

Late 80's early 90's the bottom of car doors started to show rust after 3 years. The sills stoned chips and rusted too easily. Peeps were scared of power steering and abs. Yer had to pay more for it. Traction control was on the horizon on eggspensive cars only. All fitted as standard nowadays and we don't consider it a problem. I think electronics has made cars more reliable. It cleaned up emissions and gave us more power.

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motors have certainally improved, only got to look at some of the old cars british leyland made

gstuart said:

so that's why it's heavy with all the plywood , lol ,

may i ask what was ur first landy and what made u buy one plse

am indeed looking forward to the new fender, alas won't ever be able to afford one

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Prices of the new tratter will come down over time as they age. they will do a version with clever stuff on it as well as a reduce spec for tratterers.

I bought a fl2 last year and it has been a revelation, quiet, comfortable and a pleasure to drive, exelent for long trips, not a bit like my Defender.
Heard of problems with rear diff and haldex units but I sometimes wonder when you get a few failures then the urban myths take over, and soon all of them are suspect.
Volvo also use the same transmition on some vehicles, makes sense to use a system which has all the development done already.

raywin said:

I bought a fl2 last year and it has been a revelation, quiet, comfortable and a pleasure to drive, exelent for long trips, not a bit like my Defender.
Heard of problems with rear diff and haldex units but I sometimes wonder when you get a few failures then the urban myths take over, and soon all of them are suspect.
Volvo also use the same transmition on some vehicles, makes sense to use a system which has all the development done already.

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The haldex failure rate (and rear diff) was higher than the average part, but as you say, myths make peeps think they fail more often than they do. A lot of sweeping statements online confirming they will all fail. The one thing that stands out is the cost of failed parts.

The filter blocks in the haldex pump over time. Yer have to take it all apart to clean inside to get rid of the old oil and suspect sludge build-up. Best to change the filter anorl. Lots of info ont web on how to do it as well as you tube video's. Peeps have started changing the oil and filter every 40k miles to be safe. Some change the oil more often.

gstuart said:

after u kindly recommended the iid diagnostic reader i have to admit it's a superb bit of kit

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The IID can do things that LR dealer's can't do, like customise the CCFs.

Hippo said:

The haldex failure rate (and rear diff) was higher than the average part, but as you say, myths make peeps think they fail more often than they do. A lot of sweeping statements online confirming they will all fail. The one thing that stands out is the cost of failed parts.

The filter blocks in the haldex pump over time. Yer have to take it all apart to clean inside to get rid of the old oil and suspect sludge build-up. Best to change the filter anorl. Lots of info ont web on how to do it as well as you tube video's. Peeps have started changing the oil and filter every 40k miles to be safe. Some change the oil more often.

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The Haldex in the Audi TT 225 and earlier Quattro A3/A4 had a 24K miles fluid change specified. Those Haldex units lasted well over 100K miles without giving trouble. Like an auto gearbox. Fluid changes help prolong the working life.

Nodge68 said:

The Haldex in the Audi TT 225 and earlier Quattro A3/A4 had a 24K miles fluid change specified. Those Haldex units lasted well over 100K miles without giving trouble. Like an auto gearbox. Fluid changes help prolong the working life.

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Interesting. LR don't mention the haldex on the service list... but then again they list the auto oil every 10 years. Freel2 owners change it more frequent at 50k miles. Service sheets below

https://www.landyzone.co.uk/land-rover/service-plan-offered-by-main-dealer.157987/#post-1554802