I'M BACK!!! And a new project - target 50mpg

Hello Boys and Girls,

Missed you lot and the my old tub!

So not sure if you followed but at beginning of this year I finished series 3 with TVR engine conversion with I reconned had about 300BHP (before supercharger.... god only knows how much with).....

...Results where eemmmmmm interesting:

TVR Engine in a Series Land rover - YouTube


Anyway after running with it for a while, I decided that I was definatly going to die in it and sold it.

I'm sitting here missed the hours of skinned knuckles and effing and blinding so I been thinking I need a new project.

I have come to the comclusion that I want a S3 that will keep similar performance of original but will give me 50 mpg.

Now some are thinking that I'm pi33ed, but then again 300bhp in a S3 was a tall order....


Project is still in early days but have a few idea's (Seat ecotec diesel engine.....). I know the purists are going to hate me for this one, but figured if I'm going to live with it for a while why not....?

MX

Good luck with it, seems an interesting one to go for.

You're not considering a hybrid then?

That should be fun to watch. I can't see you acheiving it at motorway speeds with the Landy's cow's arse like aerodynamics but might be acheivable at ~40mph...interested to see what you come up with.

I bought some jag bits once from a guy who had fitted a jag xjs V12 engine into a s111 swb i think it was 300bhp 0 - 60 in under 4 secs

Interesting engine swap, look forward to the results.

Back when I had my series 3diesel I got about 32mpg, so 40 mpg can't be that hard surely, ( it was a pick up too, so probally the least aerodynamic shape of landys) but I wish you the best of luck!!! And I think some aerodynamic shape changing could be a way to get those extra mpg !

Keep the weight down and do not fit wide chunky tires.

pornstarmax said:

(Seat ecotec diesel engine.....). I know the purists are going to hate me for this one, but figured if I'm going to live with it for a while why not....?

MX

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Yup, why not? Could be really interesting and an eye-opener.

Series looks with more every day drive ability? Everyones a winner.

Good to have you back - why not go the full hog and put a Prius engine in it????

Because he will need new batteries every 5years would be a guess !!!!! Not a bad idea though

hows about yer go lecci like the prius but with a milkfloat motor and its batterys and the charger for them onboard running from a diesel generator from a temporary road traffic light system built into the rear tub of a 109 and boxed in

them genorators will run forever constant at 3000rpm on a tenner of diesel giving enough charge for well over 400 miles of motoring on the milkfloat motor and batterys

youll probably get cheapo road tax aswell as it will truely become a hybrid

the mad scientist has just had a brain fart

Sounds interesting.

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How about looking at getting the magical 50mpg a different way...

When a Land Rover is moving the main issue is the amount of air that needs to be moved out of the way by it. Meaning more power is used just to keep a steady speed. More power needed means more fuel wasted.

As a Landy makes a hole in the air, producing a high pressure area at the front. At the back the pressure is much lower, theoretically 'sucking' the land rover back. If you can reduce this difference in air pressure, less power is needed to move it so less energy is used which results in an improvement in MPG!!

What you need to look at, without changing the shape dramatically is trying to get the air to flow around the back. Similar to radiusing the trailing edge, (look at modern coaches or new HGV trailers for inspiriation).

Also, get the air to move as smooth as possible under the Landy. You could add chassis protection plates along the entire length, not just at certain parts and add a radius for the rear.

Another thing to think of is to get the air to move as smoothly through the engine bay as possible. This adds a lot of drag on any vehicle but is a necessary to keep the engine cool. If you can encourage the air to follow a path of least resistance. Cooling will improve and drag will be reduced. (How about looking at what Ford have done with the new Focus where the front grills are opened and closed when needed to increase economy).

Also, try adding an air dam (sometimes called front splitter) to limit the air giving the front axle a direct hit.

What you need to remember is air is lazy. It will only go where you want it if its guided there.

There are some ideas and can be tried pretty cheaply and simply, (plywood, hi-density foam, second hand servos or interior air mixer motors) and if they work, a better, permanent solution can be built). This will allow you to try and make the Landy as slippery as possible before trying to adapt the engine to fit and be able to see what exact benefits these will do with the original engine.

There are alot of other things that can be done to further improve a Landys efficiency but it depends on how much you want to compromise.

Greg

You can always make it slippery with a mix a fairy liquid and swafega but some good call from Greg I say !

I'd love that TVR engine in my P6. howja do it, and was it easy but expensive or hard but cheap or hard and expensive? Bugger economy I want power!

I'm liking the leccy/diesel hybrid plan. Will watch with great interest.

close to 40mpg is acheivable in an 88 with an old transit DI conversion, a lot is to do with driving style and tyre choice.

I managed 39mpg out of mine when the gearbox broke leaving me with nothing but 4th, (led to really smooth driving)

After fitting an efficient engine and tying a helium ballon to yer right foot, aero-tweaking a landrover is probably a good place to start. I'm sure you couldn't do much worse for wind resistance other than maybe attaching a load of parachutes...

Thing to remember with the genny/batteries thing is that those trafic light gennys may seem to not sup much but they are only really running a couple of 100W light bulbs. So say 0.2kW. Accelerating a land-rover, ignoring wind resistance from 0-40mph over 20 seconds. Your genny would need to supply 7.7kW so would be supping diesel at about 40 times the speed of the traffic lights or 41 if you had the headlights on!

It would be a lot more with drag taken into account or if you're going up hill...Also, thats assuming a weight of around 950kg which with 6 big storage batteries would probably be a bit hopeful!

Now to keep a landy going at 40mph is really anyone's guess but ignoring the sticky outty bits and assuming its a 2mx2m frontal area and the drag coefficient is about 0.5 we need rougly 6kW to just keep it going at 40mph!

If you could do energy harvesting (like Kers in F1) you'd save some but not that much...

Going easy on the gas can make a decent difference but not that much...

Mine already achieves 50mpg by cunningly breaking down 20 miles from home and needing a tow 30 miles to the garage

johnny curt 1 said:

hows about yer go lecci like the prius but with a milkfloat motor and its batterys and the charger for them onboard running from a diesel generator from a temporary road traffic light system built into the rear tub of a 109 and boxed in

them genorators will run forever constant at 3000rpm on a tenner of diesel giving enough charge for well over 400 miles of motoring on the milkfloat motor and batterys

youll probably get cheapo road tax aswell as it will truely become a hybrid

the mad scientist has just had a brain fart

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Isn't that what top gear did with geoff/ the hammerhead-i eagle thrust?