Houston, we have a problem...oil in water :(

v8250 · Jul 13, 2019

Having had the old girl for a couple of weeks thought I'd start an engine bay tidy up + last Sunday en route to Heathrow the engine oil light started to flicker intermittently at idle [during the week ordered new timing chain kit +service kit + new oil sender + new oil pump + gaskets]. Today, started with air breather as sensed the engine was very lightly smoking after the Heathrow run + noticed a slight judder/overrun on ignition off. The air breather was full of emulsion, same with the breather line to air intake...but no emulsion at rocker cover oil filler cap + thought it a good idea to check turbo up and down pipes...both had a wet coating of oil, though the turbo is very clean.

What's the general census of opinion...before I deinstall the head?

Here are two pics...showing emulsification...#1 gunge on finger from radiator top hose, #2 upper cooler hose

Rgds
Andrew

jamesmartin · Jul 13, 2019

it could be oil cooler in rad or the head gasket,though emulsion isnt common with tdi heads gaskets but it certainly can be, last thing id buy with low oil pressure is a pump id look a switch first then bearings

dieseldog69 · Jul 13, 2019

Quite common to find emulsified sludge around rocker breathers on engines that barely get warm as there is always moisture in there but it burns off during working temps.

I would agree with James, on shells being past their best but I would also air on the side of caution and probably just rebuild the bottom end as the parts are cheap enough and then you have a base line to work from with future issues.

Not a terrible job and by the seems of it, if you knows how to change a timing chain the rest of it should be childs play

v8250 · Jul 13, 2019

Thanks James, thanks dieseldog69, I'll drain oil and whip off sump and rebuild bottom end in situ...oh the joys of lr ownership...another day spent on back

+ I'm trying to find out more about oil in cooler side of radiator...is there a tech note on the forum?

jamesmartin · Jul 13, 2019

v8250 said:
Thanks James, thanks dieseldog69, I'll drain oil and whip off sump and rebuild bottom end in situ...oh the joys of lr ownership...another day spent on back + I'm trying to find out more about oil in cooler side of radiator...is there a tech note on the forum?

id check its not just a failing switch first,you could pressure test the cooler if you could blank one outlet and rig a tester to the other but ,if i was getting oil in the water id do head gasket first easy job and if not done in a long while getting due in any case

v8250 · Jul 13, 2019

Thank you James...you've echoed my thoughts. Have changed hg's on a vast array of cars over the years but this will be my first LR. I find it fascinating how every car/vehicle has its own foibles and tell-tale signs. I'm tempted to exchange the head for a freshly rebuilt one as I'm very short of time and like to sleep at night...knowing I won't have to remove the head again anytime soon. Off now to look at Turner head prices...

jamesmartin · Jul 13, 2019

v8250 said:
Thank you James...you've echoed my thoughts. Have changed hg's on a vast array of cars over the years but this will be my first LR. I find it fascinating how every car/vehicle has its own foibles and tell-tale signs. I'm tempted to exchange the head for a freshly rebuilt one as I'm very short of time and like to sleep at night...knowing I won't have to remove the head again anytime soon. Off now to look at Turner head prices...

tdis are bloody good engines worth looking at yours, with high milers if i was to fit one for someone wanting peace of mind i look at crank bearings do head gasket and cam belt ,pistons and bores etc are usually very good immediate start as most do show compression etc is good

lynall · Jul 14, 2019

Once you have tried switch I would have the engine side plates off (drivers side x 2) and take a peek at the cam bushes with a boroscope before tearing down the bottom end.

jamesmartin · Jul 14, 2019

lynall said:
Once you have tried switch I would have the engine side plates off (drivers side x 2) and take a peek at the cam bushes with a boroscope before tearing down the bottom end.

i doubt that would help ,an issue with cam bushes would be evident just removing the side plates ,but with a 30 year old engine crank brgs is an obvious

lynall · Jul 14, 2019

jamesmartin said:
i doubt that would help ,an issue with cam bushes would be evident just removing the side plates ,but with a 30 year old engine crank brgs is an obvious

I was more thinking its quite an easy/clean job before going into the bottom end and getting dripped on

v8250 · Jul 14, 2019

Morning All, thanks for all your overnight thoughts. My plan of action is as follows:

change oil pressure switch
sump off and re-shell big ends...
...whilst there change oil pump and drive
reverse flush & degrease cooling system [it's going to need it]
refill fluids
fire up the old girl and take for a good run...
...if new oil in water off with her head!

Have a good Sunday all
Andrew

lynall · Jul 14, 2019

v8250 said:
Morning All, thanks for all your overnight thoughts. My plan of action is as follows:

change oil pressure switch

sump off and re-shell big ends...

...whilst there change oil pump and drive

reverse flush & degrease cooling system [it's going to need it]

refill fluids

fire up the old girl and take for a good run...

...if new oil in water off with her head!

Have a good Sunday all
Andrew

I think you are nuts not taking the head off whilst the bottom end is down, as its then a doddle to pop the pistons out and check rings and bore.

steve2286w · Jul 14, 2019

http://www.glencoyne.co.uk/tdipage2.htm

This shows a few of the tdi faults, I have taken my 200 tdi engine down see thread in this section
If you’re checking big ends do mains as well , found white metal was going on both and an engine that far I checked bores , you can dismantle oil pump and replace parts if worn , on my series 3 engine I changed the spring and piston which were worn when I had oil light come on with new switch I also added a pressure gauge which gives reassurance, I’d sooner check and refurb and keep original LR part than put a cheap new pump in.
What’s the engine oil like is that got water in
You can’t change bearings just with sump off the ladder frame needs to come of too

v8250 · Jul 14, 2019

Lynell, Steve, thank you for the good notes. I'm inclined to go for a complete engine rebuild and just get the job done for the next 200k miles. My dilemma now is to whom to send the engine as I simply don't have the time...and logically want Lucy back on the road as quickly as possible. I've looked at TurnerEng and realise it's a £5k job which is not what I want to spend. Q? who else can build my engine for a lower cost with a known good engine reputation? Can you recommend anyone? I'm based in Berkshire but am happy to crate and deliver nationwide.

steve2286w · Jul 14, 2019

http://www.southernengines.co.uk/machine_services.html

I can understand that , these look well established but not heard of them before , be wary of the company that picks your car up and you never see it again , it’s on the forum somewhere perhaps general ,
I’m sure more peeps from south will know more local to you , at the minute all you know is some oil in the water so that could be a cheap fix you could book it in garage for pressure test , compression test etc to help pinpoint what’s the problem

v8250 · Jul 14, 2019

Thanks Steve, I'm tempted to buy an off the shelf head from Turner and get block rebuilt elsewhere as have local engine build workshop based in Newbury, then bolt back together. Whilst block's away I can clean up engine bay and ancillaries.

steve2286w · Jul 14, 2019

If you look on turners website there’s a good article under information header on 200tdi strip down and build

steve2286w · Jul 15, 2019

And other stuff

lynall · Jul 15, 2019

steve2286w said:
http://www.southernengines.co.uk/machine_services.html

I can understand that , these look well established but not heard of them before , be wary of the company that picks your car up and you never see it again , it’s on the forum somewhere perhaps general ,
I’m sure more peeps from south will know more local to you , at the minute all you know is some oil in the water so that could be a cheap fix you could book it in garage for pressure test , compression test etc to help pinpoint what’s the problem

Be very wary of some of those engine companies as they have a bad rep on the D3 forum, Ive also come across their name on other car forums, none of the comments were good!

Think theres a guy on ebay who does rebuilt short 200 blocks, about 1200/1500 quid Iirc?

lynall · Jul 15, 2019

I think its this guy as his name rings a bell, https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/LAND-ROV...845141?hash=item3d8d131d15:g:Jc4AAOSwRiNc-Y2-

Houston, we have a problem...oil in water :(

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