Expedition Roofracks - Steel or Ally...Welded or Bolted????

Im about to buy a roofrack for my 90 prior to overlanding.

Short List of Racks so far:
Patriot - Aluminium, bolted construction
Hannibal - Aluminium, welded construction
G4 Style - Steel, welded construction

Question is which are best? As I see it the aluminium racks are
lighter and therefore allow more "luggage weight". BUT aluminium
welds don't flex and will fatigue / crack before a steel one will.
Also aluminum wont rust. That sort of leaves the Patriot out in
front, but do bolts work / vibrate loose?

Perhaps theyre all as good as each other??? Or perhaps a bottle of
loctite and an allen key inside the vehicle makes the Patriot "best"??

Any thoughts please...

Jon

Jon came up with the following;:
> Im about to buy a roofrack for my 90 prior to overlanding.
>
> Short List of Racks so far:
> Patriot - Aluminium, bolted construction
> Hannibal - Aluminium, welded construction
> G4 Style - Steel, welded construction
>
> Question is which are best? As I see it the aluminium racks are
> lighter and therefore allow more "luggage weight". BUT aluminium
> welds don't flex and will fatigue / crack before a steel one will.
> Also aluminum wont rust. That sort of leaves the Patriot out in
> front, but do bolts work / vibrate loose?
>
> Perhaps theyre all as good as each other???

If a welded one does 'go' then you need it welding to fix it. If a bolt
shears you just need a new bolt. IMHO roofracks need a certain amount of
'give', they withstand pretty strange forces and loads sometimes.

> Or perhaps a bottle of
> loctite and an allen key inside the vehicle makes the Patriot "best"??

I'd agree with that ... plus a supply of extra bolts and nyloc nuts.

I've seen a short Patriot on a friends Discovery and they look and feel the
business, sturdy, well-constructed and seemingly able to withstand beig
forced through bushes and trees/shrubberies with no apparent ill-effects.
Mind, I've also seen some pretty stringly constructed welded racks too
....

I guess ypym,ytyc ...


--
Paul ...
(8(|) Homer Rules ..... Doh !!!

On Fri, 30 Jun 2006 12:09:57 +0100, "Paul - xxx"
<[email protected]> wrote:

>Jon came up with the following;:
>> Im about to buy a roofrack for my 90 prior to overlanding.
>>
>> Short List of Racks so far:
>> Patriot - Aluminium, bolted construction
>> Hannibal - Aluminium, welded construction
>> G4 Style - Steel, welded construction
>>
>> Question is which are best? As I see it the aluminium racks are
>> lighter and therefore allow more "luggage weight". BUT aluminium
>> welds don't flex and will fatigue / crack before a steel one will.
>> Also aluminum wont rust. That sort of leaves the Patriot out in
>> front, but do bolts work / vibrate loose?
>>
>> Perhaps theyre all as good as each other???
>
>If a welded one does 'go' then you need it welding to fix it. If a bolt
>shears you just need a new bolt. IMHO roofracks need a certain amount of
>'give', they withstand pretty strange forces and loads sometimes.
>
>> Or perhaps a bottle of
>> loctite and an allen key inside the vehicle makes the Patriot "best"??
>
>I'd agree with that ... plus a supply of extra bolts and nyloc nuts.
>
>I've seen a short Patriot on a friends Discovery and they look and feel the
>business, sturdy, well-constructed and seemingly able to withstand beig
>forced through bushes and trees/shrubberies with no apparent ill-effects.
> Mind, I've also seen some pretty stringly constructed welded racks too
>...
>
>I guess ypym,ytyc ...

Paul,
Thanks. Youve pretty much confirmed what I thought.

Always good to get other opinions though...

Thanks
Jon

I think the Hanibal is a South african Affiar, and I am sure that they
are well loaded up here and usually used on very rough roads.

I have not heard of any of these packing up here and I doubt you will
use them harder than they are used here. I would avoid steel ones like
the plague as they are overweight and prone to rust.

Regards
Stephen

On Fri, 30 Jun 2006 12:40:15 +0100, Jon <[email protected]> wrote:

>On Fri, 30 Jun 2006 12:09:57 +0100, "Paul - xxx"
><[email protected]> wrote:
>
>>Jon came up with the following;:
>>> Im about to buy a roofrack for my 90 prior to overlanding.
>>>
>>> Short List of Racks so far:
>>> Patriot - Aluminium, bolted construction
>>> Hannibal - Aluminium, welded construction
>>> G4 Style - Steel, welded construction
>>>
>>> Question is which are best? As I see it the aluminium racks are
>>> lighter and therefore allow more "luggage weight". BUT aluminium
>>> welds don't flex and will fatigue / crack before a steel one will.
>>> Also aluminum wont rust. That sort of leaves the Patriot out in
>>> front, but do bolts work / vibrate loose?
>>>
>>> Perhaps theyre all as good as each other???
>>
>>If a welded one does 'go' then you need it welding to fix it. If a bolt
>>shears you just need a new bolt. IMHO roofracks need a certain amount of
>>'give', they withstand pretty strange forces and loads sometimes.
>>
>>> Or perhaps a bottle of
>>> loctite and an allen key inside the vehicle makes the Patriot "best"??
>>
>>I'd agree with that ... plus a supply of extra bolts and nyloc nuts.
>>
>>I've seen a short Patriot on a friends Discovery and they look and feel the
>>business, sturdy, well-constructed and seemingly able to withstand beig
>>forced through bushes and trees/shrubberies with no apparent ill-effects.
>> Mind, I've also seen some pretty stringly constructed welded racks too
>>...
>>
>>I guess ypym,ytyc ...
>
>Paul,
>Thanks. Youve pretty much confirmed what I thought.
>
>Always good to get other opinions though...
>
>Thanks
>Jon

I have a Patriot

The great thing about it is simplicity and strength. The point already made
about nuts/nyloc/Alen keys etc is vary valid

They will take about twenty years to have a serios rust problem though, mine
is well rusted through in parts but there is still enough of it to hold
together.


--
Larry
Series 3 rust and holes


"fanie" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> I think the Hanibal is a South african Affiar, and I am sure that they
> are well loaded up here and usually used on very rough roads.
>
> I have not heard of any of these packing up here and I doubt you will
> use them harder than they are used here. I would avoid steel ones like
> the plague as they are overweight and prone to rust.
>
> Regards
> Stephen
>
> On Fri, 30 Jun 2006 12:40:15 +0100, Jon <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> >On Fri, 30 Jun 2006 12:09:57 +0100, "Paul - xxx"
> ><[email protected]> wrote:
> >

On Fri, 30 Jun 2006 11:44:00 +0100, Jon <[email protected]> wrote:

>Im about to buy a roofrack for my 90 prior to overlanding.
>
>Short List of Racks so far:
> Patriot - Aluminium, bolted construction
> Hannibal - Aluminium, welded construction
> G4 Style - Steel, welded construction
>
>Question is which are best? As I see it the aluminium racks are
>lighter and therefore allow more "luggage weight". BUT aluminium
>welds don't flex and will fatigue / crack before a steel one will.
>Also aluminum wont rust. That sort of leaves the Patriot out in
>front, but do bolts work / vibrate loose?
>
>Perhaps theyre all as good as each other??? Or perhaps a bottle of
>loctite and an allen key inside the vehicle makes the Patriot "best"??
>
>Any thoughts please...
>
>Jon
Hi,

I have a patriot rack on my 90. I was looking for an adaptable rack
which I could initially use as a completely flat load bed. So the
patriot was the only option really. That and the useful option of the
rear loading roller persuaded me to order one last year.

However following my experience with the company, I would most
strongly recommend AGAINST having the rack assembled and fitted by the
company - like I did (

Much better to buy it flat packed and assemble and fit it yourself.

I would also strongly suggest that if you have any specific
suitability queries to put to the staff regarding their racks, DO IT
IN WRITING and make sure that anything they tell you is confirmed in
writing.

Why?

Because although the product is of basically good quality and well
designed, mine was sloppily assembled and unknown to me was fitted and
left with many extremely sharp edges at the front which inflicted some
quite significant damage to a canoe which was the first thing I
happened to carry on the rack.

I was not a happy bunny! So I phoned the company to complain only to
be told the boss wasn't in and they would phone back after speaking to
him.

No return call!

So I wrote to them asking what they were prepared to do by way of
rectifying the fault.

Letter ignored!

So I emailed with pictures of the offending areas attached.

Ignored!

So I wrote again saying the product was unfit for purpose and I would
be pursuing the possibility of rejecting the rack for a full refund on
those grounds, as they hadn't offered to make any attempt to rectify
the fault.

Their reply to this was a very acid and stroppy letter basically
denying any knowledge of the lengthy conversation I had had with them
prior to my order in which I made it very clear that the canoe would
be the main cargo on the rack. Obviously being only verbal, I cannot
prove that I had the conversation if they chose to lie about it.
Hence my recommendation to get anything specific in writing.

In the end, the company refused to respond any further, and I was left
with two possibilities:-

1 Take them to court, and if successful, get a refund and lose the
rack(except that in all other respects the rack is exactly the design
that I wanted).

2 Forget about getting any satisfaction from Patriot racks, and
disassemble and rebuild the rack PROPERLY.

I chose the latter as I really could not be without a rack, but it's
left a bitter taste regarding Hogarth engineering, and I would not
deal with them again!

With hind-sight, I'd have assembled the rack myself from the start and
avoided this - BE WARNED!

Neil

(Reply via NG please)

On Wed, 05 Jul 2006 01:52:10 +0100, Neil <[email protected]>
wrote:

>On Fri, 30 Jun 2006 11:44:00 +0100, Jon <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>>Im about to buy a roofrack for my 90 prior to overlanding.
>>
>>Short List of Racks so far:
>> Patriot - Aluminium, bolted construction
>> Hannibal - Aluminium, welded construction
>> G4 Style - Steel, welded construction
>>
>>Question is which are best? As I see it the aluminium racks are
>>lighter and therefore allow more "luggage weight". BUT aluminium
>>welds don't flex and will fatigue / crack before a steel one will.
>>Also aluminum wont rust. That sort of leaves the Patriot out in
>>front, but do bolts work / vibrate loose?
>>
>>Perhaps theyre all as good as each other??? Or perhaps a bottle of
>>loctite and an allen key inside the vehicle makes the Patriot "best"??
>>
>>Any thoughts please...
>>
>>Jon
>Hi,
>
>I have a patriot rack on my 90. I was looking for an adaptable rack
>which I could initially use as a completely flat load bed. So the
>patriot was the only option really. That and the useful option of the
>rear loading roller persuaded me to order one last year.
>
>However following my experience with the company, I would most
>strongly recommend AGAINST having the rack assembled and fitted by the
>company - like I did (
>
>Much better to buy it flat packed and assemble and fit it yourself.
>
>I would also strongly suggest that if you have any specific
>suitability queries to put to the staff regarding their racks, DO IT
>IN WRITING and make sure that anything they tell you is confirmed in
>writing.
>
>Why?
>
>Because although the product is of basically good quality and well
>designed, mine was sloppily assembled and unknown to me was fitted and
>left with many extremely sharp edges at the front which inflicted some
>quite significant damage to a canoe which was the first thing I
>happened to carry on the rack.
>
>I was not a happy bunny! So I phoned the company to complain only to
>be told the boss wasn't in and they would phone back after speaking to
>him.
>
>No return call!
>
>So I wrote to them asking what they were prepared to do by way of
>rectifying the fault.
>
>Letter ignored!
>
>So I emailed with pictures of the offending areas attached.
>
>Ignored!
>
>So I wrote again saying the product was unfit for purpose and I would
>be pursuing the possibility of rejecting the rack for a full refund on
>those grounds, as they hadn't offered to make any attempt to rectify
>the fault.
>
>Their reply to this was a very acid and stroppy letter basically
>denying any knowledge of the lengthy conversation I had had with them
>prior to my order in which I made it very clear that the canoe would
>be the main cargo on the rack. Obviously being only verbal, I cannot
>prove that I had the conversation if they chose to lie about it.
>Hence my recommendation to get anything specific in writing.
>
>In the end, the company refused to respond any further, and I was left
>with two possibilities:-
>
>1 Take them to court, and if successful, get a refund and lose the
>rack(except that in all other respects the rack is exactly the design
>that I wanted).
>
>2 Forget about getting any satisfaction from Patriot racks, and
>disassemble and rebuild the rack PROPERLY.
>
>I chose the latter as I really could not be without a rack, but it's
>left a bitter taste regarding Hogarth engineering, and I would not
>deal with them again!
>
>With hind-sight, I'd have assembled the rack myself from the start and
>avoided this - BE WARNED!
>
>Neil
>
>(Reply via NG please)


Neil,
Sorry to hear about your experiences. Despite your problems it seems
that this is still about the best rack on the market.

Having spoken to Hogarth last week it now seems that they no longer
sell direct to the public and the racks need to be bought through
resellers.

I think he (the chap at Hogarth) also said they now only come flat
packed.

Who knows, perhaps your incident did have a beneficial impact on
customer the service service department?!?!?

Jon

On Wed, 05 Jul 2006 12:00:42 +0100, Jon <[email protected]> wrote:

<snipped>

>>With hind-sight, I'd have assembled the rack myself from the start and
>>avoided this - BE WARNED!
>>
>>Neil
>>
>>(Reply via NG please)
>
>
>Neil,
>Sorry to hear about your experiences. Despite your problems it seems
>that this is still about the best rack on the market.
>
>Having spoken to Hogarth last week it now seems that they no longer
>sell direct to the public and the racks need to be bought through
>resellers.
>
>I think he (the chap at Hogarth) also said they now only come flat
>packed.
>
>Who knows, perhaps your incident did have a beneficial impact on
>customer the service service department?!?!?
>
>Jon

Hmmm.....Interesting to learn that about no longer offering the racks
assembled and fitted! That's almost an admission of their inability
to assemble their own product in a quality controlled manner. However
I'm sure they would never admit that. )

That result has to be to the benefit of the customer though. I would
still maintain that it is the best rack on the market in terms of
versatility.

Neil

(Reply via NG please)