discovery sport , freelander replacement

hi

been reading with regards to the freelander replacement

was wondering what did u think of this

Land Rover Discovery Sport 2 2 Sd4 190 Se Tech 5dr Review | What Car?

has got some seriuos electronics , wonder how it will fair in 5 years time

imagine all ur be able to do it change a bulb , without the use of a computer, lol

it's advising it will do around 46 mpg

just wondered what the general consensus was plse

The disco sport isn't a replacement for the Freelander. It's aimed at a different market, or so LR says.

gets confusing when u see other sites , lol

Land Rover Discovery Sport: first pictures of 2015's family SUV | Automotive & Motoring News | Car Magazine Online

Watch the video on you tube where Gerry McGovern the chief LR designer (FL1 designer anorl) talks about the Disco sport as a concept. He states it's not a replacement for the FL2. It's for a different, wider/higher spec market. In the same way the Evoque int a FL2 replacement.

That may include some FL2 owners and those who aspire to LR or FL2 ownership. LR are keep to split the brand into Discovery and RR. This has already happened. The big problem is the name Freelander is used so much elsewhere it's lost the iconic connection to only being a vehicle/LR. The Disco sport may be a similar size to the FL2, but on comparison with where they've taken the spec levels it doesn't match. Same for price.

Sadley the Freelander is no more. I blame the tratterers for killing it oft.

cheers buddy , will check it out

just seems such a confusing concept i dont think land rover know what's going on, lol

gstuart said:

hi

been reading with regards to the freelander replacement

was wondering what did u think of this

Land Rover Discovery Sport 2 2 Sd4 190 Se Tech 5dr Review | What Car?

has got some seriuos electronics , wonder how it will fair in 5 years time

imagine all ur be able to do it change a bulb , without the use of a computer, lol

it's advising it will do around 46 mpg

just wondered what the general consensus was plse

Click to expand...

The Freelander 2 and Discovery 3s are already electronics heavy vehicles.
I've just recently got an IID BT Tool for working on my D3. It's basically essential if you need to do anything on it.
In the future, this won't change.

Test drove a disco sport last weekend not to bad but like being in the evoke. Will go Disco 4 when I change my freelander 2 next summer.

W

Years ago peeps worried about new fangled things in cars. They didn't want electronics, PAS or ABS as it was considered witch craft to fix. Electronics has made cars more reliable, more powerful and more efficient. A diagnostic device will help with this and has become an essential part of maintenance and repairs. The web allows peeps to share data on faults etc so there isn't anything to worry about really. We'll be ok.

Littelwill said:

Test drove a disco sport last weekend not to bad but like being in the evoke. Will go Disco 4 when I change my freelander 2 next summer.

W

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to be honest I prefer the look of the disco 4 and this is my own view think its the most versatile model , as it has the extra height etc

however when u read reviews it is suppose to be very noisy on the motorway and very thirsty when compared to the freelander 2

suprised the disco sport doesn't have full air suspension , as I think it's a good thing with being able to raise the entire body to clear obstacles easier

ive only ever owned the series landies and freelander but seems the disco 4 is the dogs

agree it what ur saying with regards to electronics that it's the way forward now and will just have to get dtc readers in order for them to be diagnosed etc

have never owned a disco so putting my hands up don't know what there truely like to own or drive one but so many reviews say the disco's are the leaders, the sports is suppose to get 40 plus mpg which I cant imagine the disco 4 does

wonder if by the sport not having the ability to raise the suspension that it restricts it's off road ability

I like my landrovers with a wheel on the back

gstuart said:

to be honest I prefer the look of the disco 4 and this is my own view think its the most versatile model , as it has the extra height etc

however when u read reviews it is suppose to be very noisy on the motorway and very thirsty when compared to the freelander 2

suprised the disco sport doesn't have full air suspension , as I think it's a good thing with being able to raise the entire body to clear obstacles easier

ive only ever owned the series landies and freelander but seems the disco 4 is the dogs

agree it what ur saying with regards to electronics that it's the way forward now and will just have to get dtc readers in order for them to be diagnosed etc

have never owned a disco so putting my hands up don't know what there truely like to own or drive one but so many reviews say the disco's are the leaders, the sports is suppose to get 40 plus mpg which I cant imagine the disco 4 does

wonder if by the sport not having the ability to raise the suspension that it restricts it's off road ability

Click to expand...

I own a Discovery 3 which has now been updated to the Discovery 4. I can't see how it can be noisy at motorway speeds. My Discovery 3 is by far the quietest car I've ever driven. It's much quieter than my old Freelander1 V6. The Discovery 3 is better than my old V6 in every way except for cost. The Discovery is worse on fuel than the a TD4 Freelander at around 25 Mpg. I don't think 25 Mpg is bad for a massive vehicle like the D3, especially when you consider it weighs around 2.7 tons.

gstuart said:

...suprised the disco sport doesn't have full air suspension , as I think it's a good thing with being able to raise the entire body to clear obstacles easier...

Click to expand...

If it did have air suspension then it would cost more to build. They would also want to sell at a higher price.

Look up the Evoque suspension video's on you tube. They have small metal bits in the suspension liquid which they magnetise to control stiffness of the suspension. Cars have come a long way since the FL1 in only a short period of time.

I think the noise peeps talk about is in comparison to having no noise. There will always be some, but they're looking for jag quietness in a much bigger vehicle. I don't see why the press want no noise at all. It's not as if it's intrusive or annoying to the driver in the D4. The D3 had higher wind noise but the front bumper and wing mirrors were changed on the D4 to reduce this.

I'm starting to think my v6 hippo is too quiet. Reason being the number of people who walk out in front of it when I'm driving along.

Hippo said:

Years ago peeps worried about new fangled things in cars. They didn't want electronics, PAS or ABS as it was considered witch craft to fix. Electronics has made cars more reliable, more powerful and more efficient. A diagnostic device will help with this and has become an essential part of maintenance and repairs. The web allows peeps to share data on faults etc so there isn't anything to worry about really. We'll be ok.

Click to expand...

Years ago peoples fears over electronics were proved wrong because they were basic, individual systems. ABS failed? get another pump from a scrapyard and bang it in. Injection ECU died? get another and bang it in - maybe need to recode the immobiliser to match it, but its no biggie.

Now? Canbus systems linking every single part of a car from the engine to the interior light.....touch screen panels controlling everything instead of knobs and switches....automatic everything, requiring various sensors and controllers.....Its just no longer possible to change parts as before.
We are now at a point where something as simple as changing the battery requires it to be coded to the ECU (see intelligent adaptive charging systems) and frankly when cars that are made today are out of warranty and fail, the sheer complexity of the interlinked systems will mean that VAST numbers will be scrapped due to relatively simple faults just being too expensive to fix.
Land Rover are right up there among the others producing things that are too complicated. Need to change your turbo? well, you now need to separate the body from the chassis - good luck trying that on your driveway. Its now pretty much obligatory that that job has to be done at a garage, and as the second hand values of the cars fall, this is one of many jobs that will end up being the death of a car - for the sake of a bloody turbocharger.

Anyone who can afford a new or nearly new car will be ok, as long as they change it every few years and can afford to pay for out of warranty repairs, but anyone who cant afford a new one or wants to maintain it and repair it themselves is rapidly going to find themselves **** out of luck.

dave21478 said:

Years ago peoples fears over electronics were proved wrong because they were basic, individual systems. ABS failed? get another pump from a scrapyard and bang it in. Injection ECU died? get another and bang it in - maybe need to recode the immobiliser to match it, but its no biggie.

Now? Canbus systems linking every single part of a car from the engine to the interior light.....touch screen panels controlling everything instead of knobs and switches....automatic everything, requiring various sensors and controllers.....Its just no longer possible to change parts as before.
We are now at a point where something as simple as changing the battery requires it to be coded to the ECU (see intelligent adaptive charging systems) and frankly when cars that are made today are out of warranty and fail, the sheer complexity of the interlinked systems will mean that VAST numbers will be scrapped due to relatively simple faults just being too expensive to fix.
Land Rover are right up there among the others producing things that are too complicated. Need to change your turbo? well, you now need to separate the body from the chassis - good luck trying that on your driveway. Its now pretty much obligatory that that job has to be done at a garage, and as the second hand values of the cars fall, this is one of many jobs that will end up being the death of a car - for the sake of a bloody turbocharger.

Anyone who can afford a new or nearly new car will be ok, as long as they change it every few years and can afford to pay for out of warranty repairs, but anyone who cant afford a new one or wants to maintain it and repair it themselves is rapidly going to find themselves **** out of luck.

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You can do a D3 turbo without taking the body oft if you have a correctly shaped spanner, bent/welded bars to its etc to get it to the right place. There was a chap on another forum who does them for a main dealer. They made up a special spanner some years ago. Only problem was if they dropped the nuts, the body had to come oft to get them back.

I'm happy with electronics so I'm looking forward to the newer vehicles being cheap after 3 years, although I don't think this will happen. If you look at the number of peeps buying L322 RR's and maintaining them themselves it's surprising what we can do as home diy-ers. Also suppliers of diagnostic equipment have a huge carrot to tempt them to produce the diagnostic kit to help us.

When I first had ma hippo I'd never even changed the oil in an engine before. 3 or 4 years later I changed all 3 cam belts. My hawkeye is invaluable to help me with my hippo. It surprises me that so few have been sold for the Freelander 1. I've tried my best to display what they can do. the cost may put them oft but we have e bay to sell them on which wasn't available 20 years ago.

I would like to agree with Hippo, but have to agree with Dave. The introduction of electronics into vehicles should be no more complicated than your phone, tablet or PC. Bits should be 'plug & play' adaptable, expandable etc.

Those things are made that way because of open & shared standards. Unfortunately that's not in the car makers interest as they want to tie owners into their service centers, and more recently resale schemes. The results are bespoke systems and electronics that share none of the attributes.

We should thank the American government for enforcing the ODB standards that make basic analysis of problems 'open' and has resulted in vehicles having to be made so that there is a choice of diagnostic equipment that is available to the 'everyday handyman'. Comparing the ease/cost of diagnostics equipment for my early Freelander to the later ones, shows how those laws improved things.

Governments are quick to introduce laws affecting auto manufacturers to help protect the environment, they need to step up and help protect people from these corporations as well. After all, that is also protecting the environment by reducing scrap and the need for more cars to be built - but there's the catch, governments want their auto manufacturers to build more cars - so we're f****d.

Things like key and immobiliser coding are difficult but a lot of the other stuff like coding injectors can be done at local garages. When I knocked my immobiliser/engine computer out of synchronisation it needed T4 or similar to re-synchronise it. Putting aside why it happened, my hawkeye helped me understand what/why it wouldn't start (which is big of it considering it caused the problem) and allowed me to self diagnose what was/wasn't happening from different angles. I could test the keys to see if they were recognised etc and see the immobiliser status. It won't go further than this but that's a fair way forward than if I didn't have the hawkeye. diagnostics for future vehicles will be the same or better. Half the problem is down to knowing what the personalised manufacturer error codes relate too.

Solution for me was to take it to a main dealer on a truck (£45+vat) and they re-coded it for 1 hour labour at £90+vat which was reduced due to it being an older vehicle, from £110+vat. If I hadn't of been able to use my hawkeye and advise them of what I thought the problem was, I may have been open to higher costs. They may have pushed for a new computer etc.

The one thing we have on our side is diagnostic providers want their product to be betterer than the rest. So their competition benefits us.

Engine diagnostics are one thing, but when your heater controls look like this....



what happens when that goes wrong? A couple of years ago this sort of thing was reserved for supercars and if it were to fail, the repair or replacement costs are a relatively low percentage of the cars value so it would be done without hesitation, but now you can find them on middle of the range family cars....When that car is twelve years old and worth under fifteen hundred pounds then paying out for it to be repaired will be out of the question to most people.

Yeah, people want gadgets and comfort but this sort of thing is completely, utterly stupid. Driving down a busy motorway in the rain, the windscreen starts fogging up. Normally you would reach down, put your hand straight on the heater knob and turn it to the right to demist the screen - no need to take your eyes off the road. But with this sort of pish you are FORCED to look down at it and fiddle through a menu system to achieve the same effect. Progress? No. No, its not.

Yeah, there are workarounds for things like the d3 turbo change just like specialists came up with ways to change fiat coupe timing belts without removing the engine, but something like a touch screen that is such an integral part of so many cars systems will be another story, especially as this sort of tech filters down from luxury marques to the cheaper cars.
My other car is a C2 VTR. Its has a Sensodrive gearbox....or a "flappy paddle" box as they would call it on Top Gear. That sort of thing is fine on an Aston Martin or a Ferrari with a well designed system, twin plate clutch etc, but the low budget version made by Citroen for their warmed over shopping-trolley model is a load of cheap, unreliable pish that is actually unpleasant to use. The day mine dies is the day it gets ripped out and replaced with a manual gearbox - I have the skills to do this, and fortunately its pre canbus so its control system is not too enmeshed with the rest of the cars systems so can be removed, but you just need to look at how many of these are on ebay being broken up due to gearbox failure on an otherwise reliable, rust-free wee car to realise the folly of the whole principle.


Anyway, this is going way, waaay off topic, so I will quit my moaning!

As Hippo said. It's very possible to change the D3 turbo without taking the body off. LR don't so why should anyone else?
The complexity of vehicle electronics has caused all manor of companies to start producing fantastic bits of kit for the home mechanic to use. My IID tool will do basically anything I'm ever likely to use. If it doesn't, a quick email to the manufacturer and an update is issued within hours. This is then loaded into the tool using a PC via USB and wallop it's now got the update needed.
These moder electronics control everything in a modern car. As said even the humble interior lighting is now computer controlled, generally by the BCU.
The downside to all this technology is complexity. My own Discovery 3 works as it should. I get no warning bongs or lights on the dash. However if I do a fault scan with the IID, I get a pile of errors, around 10 iirc. Most are to do with Canbus errors or one computer has lost contact with another computer. I have a Hevac fault but the heating system works fine
There are even audio system errors, again the audio system works fine.
This is the way of things to come, the automotive future. I feel it's best to get a grip on what is and what isn't important now, before a proper fault appears. This way the important information can be picked out of the list of potential red herrings.

went for a drive in disco sport, and i think its a very good replacement for freelander 2, more comfort, more adjustment of seating, rear included and bigger boot, remember the outcry when fl2 was released, it was so much better, and so is the disco sport imo.