another engine swapping thread.

[Pete M]

Recently I've been fitting a proper engine to a 1985 Land Rover 90.

Basically this means I took the horrible diesel engine out, and replaced it
with a 3.5 V8 from a Range Rover.

All the mountings, flywheel etc and the bellhousing were taken from a dead
Landy with a V8 fitted.

Now, here's the bit that's confuddled me.

When the engine was out, it turned over beautifully, I fitted a new clutch
and put the motor in. Engine still turned over nicely, clutch works as it
should. Fitting the engine took some time as it was basically just being
done in bits, the occasional afternoon when weather permits. Carbs etc all
fitted, oil pump primed, went to turn over the engine to TDC to fit the
distributor...

,, and the engine is locked solid. Won't budge. Even tried towing it with
another car and it's solid as a solid thing.

Clues please? I'm really not looking forwards to taking the bloody thing
back out in order to start again.


--
Pete M

Mercedes 260E, RR Vogue 3.9 on it's way.
Ford Capri (ressurection started)
"Never moon a werewolf"

COSOC #5
Scouse Git extraordinaire. Liverpool, Great Britain

 

[EMB]

Pete M wrote:

> Clues please? I'm really not looking forwards to taking the bloody thing
> back out in order to start again.

Leaky head gasket that's filled a cylinder with water?


--
EMB

 

[Pete M]

In news:[email protected],
EMB <[email protected]> decided to enlighten our sheltered souls with a rant
as follows
> Pete M wrote:
>
>> Clues please? I'm really not looking forwards to taking the bloody
>> thing back out in order to start again.
>
> Leaky head gasket that's filled a cylinder with water?

not put water in it yet....

was just in the final stages of putting all the ancillaries on first,
distributor, then it was going to be leads, then the rad..


--
Pete M

Mercedes 260E
Ford Capri (ressurection started)
"Never moon a werewolf"

COSOC #5
Scouse Git extraordinaire. Liverpool, Great Britain

 

[Mark]

Pete M wrote:
> In news:[email protected],
> EMB <[email protected]> decided to enlighten our sheltered souls with a rant
> as follows
>
>>Pete M wrote:
>>
>>
>>>Clues please? I'm really not looking forwards to taking the bloody
>>>thing back out in order to start again.
>>
>>Leaky head gasket that's filled a cylinder with water?
>
>
> not put water in it yet....
>
> was just in the final stages of putting all the ancillaries on first,
> distributor, then it was going to be leads, then the rad..
>
>
Dizzie drive the right type? May be able to lock up an enginee....anyone?

 

[Simon Atkinson]

Pete M wrote:

> Recently I've been fitting a proper engine to a 1985 Land Rover 90.
>
> Basically this means I took the horrible diesel engine out, and
> replaced it with a 3.5 V8 from a Range Rover.
>
> All the mountings, flywheel etc and the bellhousing were taken from a
> dead Landy with a V8 fitted.
>
> Now, here's the bit that's confuddled me.
>
> When the engine was out, it turned over beautifully, I fitted a new
> clutch and put the motor in. Engine still turned over nicely, clutch
> works as it should. Fitting the engine took some time as it was
> basically just being done in bits, the occasional afternoon when
> weather permits. Carbs etc all fitted, oil pump primed, went to turn
> over the engine to TDC to fit the distributor...
>
> ,, and the engine is locked solid. Won't budge. Even tried towing it
> with another car and it's solid as a solid thing.
>
> Clues please? I'm really not looking forwards to taking the bloody
> thing back out in order to start again.

I think you'll need to look at this in order - did it turn over after
you'd fitted the gearbox? Did it still turn after fitting the gearbox
and pressing the clutch a couple of times?

I really would advise against trying to tow or shock it free - it's
almost certainly something mechanical locked and forcing it will break
whatever it is.

Using a spanner on the front pulley, will it turn backwards? If it
will turn a way backwards then lock again, it's probably either the cam
timing out, or a rocker (or several) with insufficient free movement
and the pistons are fouling the valves.

Thrust bearings is a thought - if actuating the clutch has caused it to
lock, maybe it's shifted the crank forwards and locked it?

The other possibility is that you've left a spanner in the sump and
it's jamming one of the webs of the crank!

 

[Pete M]

In news:[email protected],
Simon Atkinson <[email protected]> decided to enlighten our sheltered souls
with a rant as follows
> Pete M wrote:
>
>> Recently I've been fitting a proper engine to a 1985 Land Rover 90.
>>
>> Basically this means I took the horrible diesel engine out, and
>> replaced it with a 3.5 V8 from a Range Rover.
>>
>> All the mountings, flywheel etc and the bellhousing were taken from a
>> dead Landy with a V8 fitted.
>>
>> Now, here's the bit that's confuddled me.
>>
>> When the engine was out, it turned over beautifully, I fitted a new
>> clutch and put the motor in. Engine still turned over nicely, clutch
>> works as it should. Fitting the engine took some time as it was
>> basically just being done in bits, the occasional afternoon when
>> weather permits. Carbs etc all fitted, oil pump primed, went to turn
>> over the engine to TDC to fit the distributor...
>>
>> ,, and the engine is locked solid. Won't budge. Even tried towing it
>> with another car and it's solid as a solid thing.
>>
>> Clues please? I'm really not looking forwards to taking the bloody
>> thing back out in order to start again.
>
> I think you'll need to look at this in order - did it turn over after
> you'd fitted the gearbox? Did it still turn after fitting the gearbox
> and pressing the clutch a couple of times?

Yep.

>
> I really would advise against trying to tow or shock it free - it's
> almost certainly something mechanical locked and forcing it will break
> whatever it is.

Well, you're right, but you know what it's like when things get annoying.
>
> Using a spanner on the front pulley, will it turn backwards? If it
> will turn a way backwards then lock again, it's probably either the
> cam timing out, or a rocker (or several) with insufficient free
> movement and the pistons are fouling the valves.

Nope, it's solid.
>
> Thrust bearings is a thought - if actuating the clutch has caused it
> to lock, maybe it's shifted the crank forwards and locked it?

Maybe
>
> The other possibility is that you've left a spanner in the sump and
> it's jamming one of the webs of the crank!

Not taken the sump off, the engine was complete bar carbs, waterpump and
dizzy.


--
Pete M

Mercedes 260E
Ford Capri (ressurection started)
"Never moon a werewolf"

COSOC #5
Scouse Git extraordinaire. Liverpool, Great Britain

 

[Simon Atkinson]

Pete M wrote:

> In news:[email protected],
> Simon Atkinson <[email protected]> decided to enlighten our sheltered
> souls with a rant as follows
> > Pete M wrote:
> >
> >> Recently I've been fitting a proper engine to a 1985 Land Rover 90.
> > >
> >> Basically this means I took the horrible diesel engine out, and
> >> replaced it with a 3.5 V8 from a Range Rover.
> > >
> >> All the mountings, flywheel etc and the bellhousing were taken
> from a >> dead Landy with a V8 fitted.
> > >
> >> Now, here's the bit that's confuddled me.
> > >
> >> When the engine was out, it turned over beautifully, I fitted a new
> >> clutch and put the motor in. Engine still turned over nicely,
> clutch >> works as it should. Fitting the engine took some time as it
> was >> basically just being done in bits, the occasional afternoon
> when >> weather permits. Carbs etc all fitted, oil pump primed, went
> to turn >> over the engine to TDC to fit the distributor...
> > >
> >> ,, and the engine is locked solid. Won't budge. Even tried towing
> it >> with another car and it's solid as a solid thing.
> > >
> >> Clues please? I'm really not looking forwards to taking the bloody
> >> thing back out in order to start again.
> >
> > I think you'll need to look at this in order - did it turn over
> > after you'd fitted the gearbox? Did it still turn after fitting
> > the gearbox and pressing the clutch a couple of times?
>
> Yep.
>
> >
> > I really would advise against trying to tow or shock it free - it's
> > almost certainly something mechanical locked and forcing it will
> > break whatever it is.
>
> Well, you're right, but you know what it's like when things get
> annoying.

Only too well!

> > Using a spanner on the front pulley, will it turn backwards? If it
> > will turn a way backwards then lock again, it's probably either the
> > cam timing out, or a rocker (or several) with insufficient free
> > movement and the pistons are fouling the valves.
>
> Nope, it's solid.

Hmmm... Probably not that then. Good.

> > Thrust bearings is a thought - if actuating the clutch has caused it
> > to lock, maybe it's shifted the crank forwards and locked it?
>
> Maybe

How careful was the rebuild? Were things like crank thrusts and
runouts measured?

> > The other possibility is that you've left a spanner in the sump and
> > it's jamming one of the webs of the crank!
>
> Not taken the sump off, the engine was complete bar carbs, waterpump
> and dizzy.

I suspect that my next job would be to remove the starter motor, spark
plugs (just in case) and the sump. Testing the engine with a spanner to
see if it turns in between each removal. Eventually the engine will be
in bits again, or working!

 

[Austin Shackles]

On or around Fri, 28 Jan 2005 09:14:40 +0000, Mark <[email protected]>
enlightened us thusly:

>Pete M wrote:
>> In news:[email protected],
>> EMB <[email protected]> decided to enlighten our sheltered souls with a rant
>> as follows
>>
>>>Pete M wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>>Clues please? I'm really not looking forwards to taking the bloody
>>>>thing back out in order to start again.
>>>
>>>Leaky head gasket that's filled a cylinder with water?
>>
>>
>> not put water in it yet....
>>
>> was just in the final stages of putting all the ancillaries on first,
>> distributor, then it was going to be leads, then the rad..
>>
>>
>Dizzie drive the right type? May be able to lock up an enginee....anyone?

though I'd expect that to break if you tried towing. is it solid backwards
as well?

--
Austin Shackles. www.ddol-las.fsnet.co.uk my opinions are just that
"Quos deus vult perdere, prius dementat" Euripedes, quoted in
Boswell's "Johnson".

 

[Steve]

"Pete M" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> Not taken the sump off, the engine was complete bar carbs, waterpump and
> dizzy.
>

Were all your tools and sundry bits accounted for after you mated the engine
to the gearbox? Something might have found its way into the bell housing
(like a nut or something) and lodged between the starter ring gear and the
casting and is now acting like a bi-directional spragg clutch!

Steve

 

[Pete M]

In news:[email protected],
Steve <[email protected]> decided to enlighten our sheltered
souls with a rant as follows
> "Pete M" <[email protected]> wrote in
> message news:[email protected]...
>>
>> Not taken the sump off, the engine was complete bar carbs, waterpump
>> and dizzy.
>>
>
> Were all your tools and sundry bits accounted for after you mated the
> engine to the gearbox? Something might have found its way into the
> bell housing (like a nut or something) and lodged between the starter
> ring gear and the casting and is now acting like a bi-directional
> spragg clutch!

I'll find out next week. Everything seems to be present and correct though..

I must be mad, I might be swapping the Merc for a 92 3.9 Rangey tomorrow..

I must have murdered priests in a previous life or summat.. I don't deserve
this!!

--
Pete M

Mercedes 260E
Ford Capri (ressurection started)
"Never moon a werewolf"

COSOC #5
Scouse Git extraordinaire. Liverpool, Great Britain

 

[Austin Shackles]

On or around Sat, 29 Jan 2005 03:01:51 -0000, "Pete M"
<[email protected]> enlightened us thusly:

>I'll find out next week. Everything seems to be present and correct though..
>
>I must be mad, I might be swapping the Merc for a 92 3.9 Rangey tomorrow..
>

nah, the 3.9 RR is the canine gonads. 'specially if it's a full-spec vogue
with leather and aircon. lovely motors. convert it to LPG (unless it is)
and it'll cost about the same to run as a TDi.


--
Austin Shackles. www.ddol-las.fsnet.co.uk my opinions are just that
"The boys are dreaming wicked or of the bucking ranches of the night and
the jollyrodgered sea." Dylan Thomas (1914 - 1953) Under milk wood

 

[Pete M]

In news:[email protected],
Austin Shackles <[email protected]> decided to enlighten our
sheltered souls with a rant as follows
> On or around Sat, 29 Jan 2005 03:01:51 -0000, "Pete M"
> <[email protected]> enlightened us thusly:
>
>> I'll find out next week. Everything seems to be present and correct
>> though..
>>
>> I must be mad, I might be swapping the Merc for a 92 3.9 Rangey
>> tomorrow..
>>
>
> nah, the 3.9 RR is the canine gonads. 'specially if it's a full-spec
> vogue with leather and aircon. lovely motors. convert it to LPG
> (unless it is) and it'll cost about the same to run as a TDi.

I used to have a lovely Vogue SE about 8-9 years ago. Unfortunately this one
is just the Vogue. No leather or AC

--
Pete M

Mercedes 260E
Ford Capri (ressurection started)
"Never moon a werewolf"

COSOC #5
Scouse Git extraordinaire. Liverpool, Great Britain

 

[EMB]

Simon Atkinson wrote:
>
> The other possibility is that you've left a spanner in the sump and
> it's jamming one of the webs of the crank!

Wrong starter motor jamming the ring gear?


--
EMB