2003 Discovery Td5, Poor starting!?

Hi all!

Are there any common issues that relate to this fault.....

Starts up fine initially from cold, short drive, then stop, then re-start but cranks and cranks but reluctant to fire!?

I have interorgated the fault memory with my Snap-On SOLUS Pro machine, which showed a fault with the crankshaft synchronisation sensor, which I have replaced.

I will be re-checking the fault memory tomorrow.

Any help or suggestions will be most appreciated.

Dave

Does the fuel pump make a nasty noise?

It makes a different noise if there is air or GAS in the fuel. Gas can get into the fuel gallery if an injector lower (copper) washer has started leaking. You might JUST get away with re-torquing the injector clamp nuts. Back them off half a turn and immediately torque in ONE MOVE to 32 Nm / 24 lbf.ft or just a trifle more. If you are lucky this will do the job. If not, it needs a set of new copper washers and O-rings.

It would be smart to eliminate other possible causes before doing the injector washers.

CharlesY

I don't know if it's related but mine will do a similar thing sometimes. It will always start fine from cold.

But once warm after a short stop (e.g. filling up with fuel) it will occasionally start fine for ~0.5 second and stall. Then will crank over and over but not fire. Leaving it for 30 seconds and trying again works.

I suspect its something to do with the immobiliser but it only happens quite rarely so I've not bothered looking too much into it.

CharlesY said:

Does the fuel pump make a nasty noise?

It makes a different noise if there is air or GAS in the fuel. Gas can get into the fuel gallery if an injector lower (copper) washer has started leaking. You might JUST get away with re-torquing the injector clamp nuts. Back them off half a turn and immediately torque in ONE MOVE to 32 Nm / 24 lbf.ft or just a trifle more. If you are lucky this will do the job. If not, it needs a set of new copper washers and O-rings.

It would be smart to eliminate other possible causes before doing the injector washers.

CharlesY

Click to expand...

No, no wierd fuel pump noises. It's intermittant whether it fires, stalls then cranks for ages, OR, it just cranks for ages, then eventually fire.

I presume these have a fuel "lift" pump in the tank?

rickead2000 said:

I don't know if it's related but mine will do a similar thing sometimes. It will always start fine from cold.

But once warm after a short stop (e.g. filling up with fuel) it will occasionally start fine for ~0.5 second and stall. Then will crank over and over but not fire. Leaving it for 30 seconds and trying again works.

I suspect its something to do with the immobiliser but it only happens quite rarely so I've not bothered looking too much into it.

Click to expand...

VERY similar, if not the same.

I'm thinking along a fueling kind of problem!?!?

My guess was that the immobiliser might not be allowing the fuel pump to start.

Next time yours does it let it stand for about 30 seconds before trying to restart. If it bursts back into life straight away (no more cranking than usual) then I would guess it is the same problem. Keep me posted if you find a solution!

rickead2000 said:

My guess was that the immobiliser might not be allowing the fuel pump to start.

Next time yours does it let it stand for about 30 seconds before trying to restart. If it bursts back into life straight away (no more cranking than usual) then I would guess it is the same problem. Keep me posted if you find a solution!

Click to expand...

No probs. I will check the activation of the fuel pump tomorrow whilst checking the fault memory again.

It won't be the immobiliser (I think) but it may well be the fuel pump not being allowed enough TIME to flood up the fuel gallery in the cylinder head.

Try this .... always turn the key to IGN, which starts the fuel pump and all the dash lights show, then keep an eye on the GLOWPLUG light. After the glowplug light goes OUT, wait a full 15 seconds (use your watch, it's a long time!), and THEN run the starter. This will give a longer glow, AND more time for the pump to prime the fuel system.

The TD5 does NOT switch off the glowplugs when the light goes out! The system powers the glowplugs when it feels like it, and for quite some time after the engine is running on cold days.

Let me know if this helps - I have a TD5 and I don't have that problem - YET.

CharlesY

Hi everyone!

I was reading on Autodata last night the test procedures for fuel pump and relay and according to that, the fuel pump should run and continue to run for 3 minutes with just the ignition switched on!!

It don't.

Plus I rechecked the fault memory, it now says: "Noisy crank signal"

Which to me suggests electrical interference on the crank position sender wiring!?!?!?

I

You nknow that you must NOT have your foot on the throttle when starting a TD5 don't you?

It floods the cylinders with diesel because that is a system PURGE process.

Make sure your foot is off the go pedal when starting.

Remove and clean the crankshaft position sensor. It might help.

CHarlesY

CharlesY said:

You nknow that you must NOT have your foot on the throttle when starting a TD5 don't you?

It floods the cylinders with diesel because that is a system PURGE process.

Make sure your foot is off the go pedal when starting.

Remove and clean the crankshaft position sensor. It might help.

CHarlesY

Click to expand...

Oh yes. No throttle.

There is a new Crankshaft SYNCHRONISATION sensor fitted, this goes into the bell-housing on the gearbox.

Is there another Crank sensor?

Speedy said:

Oh yes. No throttle.

There is a new Crankshaft SYNCHRONISATION sensor fitted, this goes into the bell-housing on the gearbox.

Is there another Crank sensor?

Click to expand...

I think that's it.

CharlesY

CharlesY said:

I think that's it.

CharlesY

Click to expand...

Bugger.

Looking at the wiring diagram, the wires to the crank sensor ARE shielded. Looks like that may be where the problem is.

As per Autodata diagram, the shielding wires come from the ECU, Connector plug A, pin 16. This then looks like it goes into 2 wires, surrounding the CPS wires.

Loom issue then.

Great.

ere Speedy..........
is the post 2002 TD5 ECU(M) loom different from the pre 2002?

The Mad Hat Man said:

ere Speedy..........
is the post 2002 TD5 ECU(M) loom different from the pre 2002?

Click to expand...

According to wiring diagram on Autodata, No.

But in reality, I have no idea.

I have been Google-tastic this evening, looks like the old "oil in the loom/ecu" is still a common issue.

Got a few things to check now.

Interestingly, the "kit" for the Crank sensor that Land Rover sent me, didn't come with a spacer that has been mentioned through my Googling.

This I will query tomorrow.

If the air gap is wrong between the flywheel and sensor, this will create problems.

hi,
i have a simillar problem, i have changed the fuel pump and the wiring loom as i found oil on the ecu connector, the computer say this: "Can error fault currently active". there is no air in fuel system as checked all the pipes. sometimes when i leave it for more than 6 hours its hard to start, glow plugs new. any help please
regards
chris

Hi All. I have a 2001 TD5, with similar issues.. Sometimes you can crank it first time and she'll start. Others it just turns over.. If you blip the remote it sometimes will start, others you have to remove the keys, lock unlock then restart.. very intermittent. Checked the Red ECU connector and these a little oil, so weekend job is Injector rail. It was fitted with a cheap fuel pump by the previous owner, would it be advised to swap it out for a VDO one?

Magee'73 said:

Hi All. I have a 2001 TD5, with similar issues.

Click to expand...

Hi Magee

You have missed the introduce yourself post and posted straight onto a 2009 post, not sure you will get much life out of that.

Post a new post in the Disco section, just one question is your fob an original D2 fob or a cheapie / rover 45 one?

Cheers