Just bought Disco 2 (54 plate) with new engine - boy does it clatter when cold!

I am the not so proud owner of a 2004 Discovery TD5 with a brand new engine (500 miles so far!). It is VERY noisy when cold - the usual diesel clatter just very loud. The car is slow to warm and there is a distinct diesel clatter (seems to be from one cylinder mainly although hard to tell) which gradually reduces as the engine warms up. It is most noticeable with a light throttle setting (cruising along). When accelerating hard (ish) the clatter disappears and when the throttle is backed off it also disappears.

The car starts fine and when the engine is hot it is pretty quiet although you can still hear a bit of clatter again just with a light throttle setting.

I was thinking maybe one of the injectors is over fueling? Also I checked the oil level and it seems to have increased a tiny bit - (not really sure about this!).

Bearing in mind that the local garage has just fitted the engine and used the existing ancillary engine bits which have done 116,000 miles is it likely that I have a fuel related problem?

Hope you can help!!

John

johndenney said:

I am the not so proud owner of a 2004 Discovery TD5 with a brand new engine (500 miles so far!). It is VERY noisy when cold - the usual diesel clatter just very loud. The car is slow to warm and there is a distinct diesel clatter (seems to be from one cylinder mainly although hard to tell) which gradually reduces as the engine warms up. It is most noticeable with a light throttle setting (cruising along). When accelerating hard (ish) the clatter disappears and when the throttle is backed off it also disappears.

The car starts fine and when the engine is hot it is pretty quiet although you can still hear a bit of clatter again just with a light throttle setting.

I was thinking maybe one of the injectors is over fueling? Also I checked the oil level and it seems to have increased a tiny bit - (not really sure about this!).

Bearing in mind that the local garage has just fitted the engine and used the existing ancillary engine bits which have done 116,000 miles is it likely that I have a fuel related problem?

Hope you can help!!

John

Click to expand...

Hi John, as a garage did the work I'm assuming there is some sort of guarrantee so I would have th car back to them TODAY.

My car makes almost no diesel clatter at all, if it's as prominent as you suggest, something is wrong !!!!!!

TD5s only have 4 glow plugs so it's not uncommon for them to run lumpy for a short while

Hi, yes - I have been back to the garage that fitted the engine this morning but he cant look at it until next week. He said that he will adjust the injectors and check all nuts and bolts for tightness...... but I am pretty sure he does not have the diagnostic software for the car.... I am worried that if I keep running it for another week I may do mechanical damage to the engine... the slight increase in engine oil level is a bit disturbing!

does anyone know of a good indy in the Warrington / St Helens area?

the injectors need programing to the the ECU if he has no equipment to do this then i would say this has not been done

Looks like you are right - I took it to a local Landrover specialist and he thinks the problem is that the ecu still thinks it has the old injectors in and is metering the fuel accordingly. Apparently the injectors have a number on them which has to be entered into the computer so it knows they are different ones! Anyway it is going in on Thursday to get it sorted out. In a nutshell the problem seems to be inaccurate fueling due to the new injectors. Thanks to all who have helped.

I am thinking about keeping this car - it is growing on me. Anyone know where and how much it would be to get a computer to sort out this type of problem myself... its about £50 every time they hook it up to the computer!

what you need is a nanocom they are about £225 from most land rover placed but i understand that there is a new model coming out soon so might be best to leave it abit for the new model or for the old model being sold off on ebay

Many thanks..... I shall wait for the new model to be released - I guess any news will be posted on here... again many thanks for all the help....
I am really starting to see the attraction of these cars... they seem to be a bit "agricultural" (in a nice way!) but very rewarding to drive. I can see why they are popular!

johndenney said:

Many thanks..... I shall wait for the new model to be released - I guess any news will be posted on here... again many thanks for all the help....
I am really starting to see the attraction of these cars... they seem to be a bit "agricultural" (in a nice way!) but very rewarding to drive. I can see why they are popular!

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Hi John, once you get yours running well, "agricultural" is probably not the label you will put on her.

New Nanocom supposedly out end of April/beginning of May.


If the garage who fitted the new engine didn't know that they had to code the injectors onto the ECU, they don't know TD5. Incidentally, when they did the engine swap, did they use the old ECU and the old injectors?

Took delivery of my first Discovery just before Christmas - 2004 Landmark. Mine seemed pretty clattery to me too, and went back to the dealer. They've had it overnight for a cold start (and believe me, it's still winter in scotland) but assure me my noise levels are totally normal. So maybe it's just a question of getting used to it!

best
Bill

Mine seems very clattery when cold but then I was used to a V8. I've decided it's just the way they are. Once warm it's very civilised.

It's also absolutely gutless when it's cold and I can see why people who may have only tries them for a short distance complain about the lack of power.

Yes - I have been doing some digging and it seems that the car has had two new engines - the first was 3 months ago!! The original ecu is in still use as are 4 of the original injectors. (116,000 miles) The new injector has not been "introduced" to the ecu and is over fueling hence the clatter!! I have left it with a LR specialist tonight and they will enter the number on the new injector into the computer tomorrow. I am a bit worried about the remaining old injectors and wondering if the problems with the engine have been caused by long term over fueling. I am not sure how long an injector should last and even if they can be tested???

I have been told that it really needs new injectors in a new engine but that is a LOT of money - they tell me up to £400 each plus fitting and another trip to the computer to set them up again. I was wondering if cheaper alternatives (ebay) are ok? Its all a bit frustrating but I must admit I like the vehicle so I am prepared to spend a bit of time and effort on it.

I might buy the computer and offer it to "club/ forum" members in the north west - seems crazy for us all to buy one and only use it once in a while.

Thanks for suggestions and comments - this is a great place for help and information.

Mr Bill,

Thanks for your post.. as you may have gathered I have only just got myself a Disco.. (last week) same model as yours I think. I was wondering about doing the EGR blanking thing and fitting the upgraded hoses -- oh and the ecu remap... (phew - must check bank account!) Have you any experience of these or any other mods you would recommend?

I have a feeling I may keep this car for a while - other than the high mileage and current injector problem it is is really nice nick with a full service history.
Greatfull for any advice suggestions!!

John

johndenney said:

Mr Bill,

Thanks for your post.. as you may have gathered I have only just got myself a Disco.. (last week) same model as yours I think. I was wondering about doing the EGR blanking thing and fitting the upgraded hoses -- oh and the ecu remap... (phew - must check bank account!) Have you any experience of these or any other mods you would recommend?

I have a feeling I may keep this car for a while - other than the high mileage and current injector problem it is is really nice nick with a full service history.
Greatfull for any advice suggestions!!

John

Click to expand...

Hi John, if I may I'll offer you one or two pointers to optimising your TD5:

1. De-EGR - this is a good thing for the engine as it will run cleaner without the EGR. Cost for the kit about £30 from Paddocks;

2. If your vehicle has a catalytic converter in the exhaust downpipe, replace it with a de-catted one one - improves smoothness, performance responsiveness AND mpg. Mine went up by at least 10% when I did it about three weeks ago.

Both of these modifications are entirely legal and will not adversely affect your mot test results.

3. Add a K&N air filter. I know some people are concerned about these having a bad effect on the Mass Airflow (MAF) sensor but I haven't had that problem and I did notice a slight increase in responsiveness.

4. Change all your oils and filters. Irrespective of what the previous owner may have told you, doing a service now will only be good for the car and help you set a baseline for the future.

5. Check for oil in the red ECU plug. This is a common issue which can produce various different pooor running problems. Look at the plug, if oily clean with switch cleaner and replace the injector loom.

Enjoy your new toy they are great cars.

Cheers
Dave

Hi Dave, many thanks - I shall get the bits ordered!
ps I have re-set the cam to injector clearances and it has made a big difference - much less knocking / pinking. I still have a feeling that one or two of the injectors are over fueling but its not too bad for now. I shall maybe buy one and use a bit of trial and error to see if things improve...

John

Just one point you mentioned in your original post, the bit about the engine oil level possibly rising. Given your fuel problem this could actually be due to diesel fuel leakage into your oil if what you said is correct. ie your engine oil may have become diluted with diesel. Whilst this is a good way to clean-out the engine it's not so good in the longer term as far as engine lubrication is concerned. I would suggest changing the engine oil and filter as soon as possible just to be sure.

Yes - I have been monitoring that closely - I changed the oil and made sure I filled it accurately and so far it has stayed the same. I guess the mechanic that fitted the engine overfilled it a bit originally! I am at a loss as to the next step now... I get the feeling I will have to bite the bullet and buy new injectors - at least then I can rule them out!! Wish they were not so expensive.

johndenney said:

Mr Bill,

Thanks for your post.. as you may have gathered I have only just got myself a Disco.. (last week) same model as yours I think. I was wondering about doing the EGR blanking thing and fitting the upgraded hoses -- oh and the ecu remap... (phew - must check bank account!) Have you any experience of these or any other mods you would recommend?

I have a feeling I may keep this car for a while - other than the high mileage and current injector problem it is is really nice nick with a full service history.
Greatfull for any advice suggestions!!

John

Click to expand...

Hi John,
I think Dave (aka Big Lad) has covered it all for you. I'm going to Td5 Alive Tuning in Grimsby next month for an ecu remap - they seem to come out best in testimonials on this forum. Bit of a schlepp from Glasgow but worth it, I hope. This is the mod I suspect late model owners will notice most - looking forward to the extra performance but more than that, the improvement in fuel consumption (assuming i can keep my right foot off the accelerator). A lot of my driving is urban cycle with a reasonable load, and the diesel fair disappears.

all the best with the new baby
Bill

Update...

Well I am waiting for the new injectors to arrive and I have just removed the originals from the engine... Couple of things for info.....

Once the injector operating cam has been removed the injectors come out very easily - I had to rotate the engine a bit to get clearance on a couple of cam lobes.

I used a small pry bar (Stanley £4.00) which fitted nicely and raised the injectors with no problem - no need for a slide hammer!

The injectors (the business end) were covered in thick carbon, some of which ended up in the holes so I had to vacuum it all out along with some fuel. (get the thinnest plastic tubing from B and Q - the next one up is too fat!)

Also the "natural" curve on the plastic pipe is a pain... warm it up and get it straight so you can feed it into the hole.

I have spoken to the mechanic who fitted the new engine and he assured me that one of the injectors was brand new... I located the "new" one and discovered that the code had been etched onto the solenoid body with an engraving tool... ???? Does this mean that the injector is actually a recon?? The other injectors have the code stamped on... ie by the manufacturer so I guess these are original.

This throws up another problem because I had the injectors coded by the local garage and I bet they used the manufacturers codes on the top.. they will not have been able to see the etched on code on the side of the "new" injector. Hence I guess this would mess up the coding process and the computer would be trimming an injector using the wrong settings!! Maybe this has been the problem all along.. ie causing the diesel knock..

Anyway the new ones will arrive tomorrow and I will pop them in and see how it sounds.

I will let you all know how I go on..

ps - anything I should be aware of whilst re-fitting? - I guess the system will need bleeding.

pps - I dont have new adjuster bolts - apparently they should be renewed - how critical is this?