TD5 died on M4 - like no fuel.

My Td5 90 pulling a sankey lost a cylinder and then died on the M4. It was the start of a planned 2000mile overland trip to medeteranian so better this side of the channel i suppose.
Recovered vehicle to nearest garage ("Slogh" of all places ) and my first thoughts were oil in the injector harness. The garge plugged in an "auto-logic" tester to the ECU but there were no faults registered. after changing the injector harness it fired up and seemed good to go, however after 10 miles and on reaching full running temp the same fault ocoured. Engine died as if no fuel. The garage still have no faults on the ECU but thought it was the crank sensor - this didn't solve the problem - any thoughts? could it be faulty ECU or main engine harness. There isn't any oil in the ECU. Its a 2002 TD5 90 CSW with A/C at 46k miles.

You check for water in the filter? Fuel pump pressure ok? Maybe the pump is on its way out. Good test is to rev it from idle to around 4000rpm for 30 seconds or so. If rpm stays at 4000 pump is ok...if it starts to drop u got a sick fuel pump.

The guy at the garage thought it might be the pump. He bypassed the system with a seperate pump and power supply but the engin doesn't seem to be sending any message that it needs fuel. They are having the ECU checked but if that fails i feel the next option will be to start replacing fuel line. Should a pump fault register on the ECU?

you say it died after 10 miles when it wur warm.
has the garage checked it while still warm?

Did a live test with the logic book plugged into the ECU but engine became flat very quickly then died and now wont start. It seems like no fuel. Even when left alone for a while it still wont start. They think ECU but i'm not confident!!!

Sounds very like the problem I had .... copper washers under the injectors letting gas into the fuel rail in the head ....

I fixed mine myself even though it was still in warranty 'cos I don't want some remedially stupid oaf touching my car.

Been fine since I did it.

The symptoms I had were exactly what you describe.

I take it you know how to make the fuel pump run to purge the fuel gallery?

I also assume the pump is making a clearly audible sloshy sort of noise rather than a quiet whine.

CharlesY

Charlesy, Thanks for your reply - I recall reading your fix a when i first started researching into the problem - which is the only thing i can do while my beloved rover is sick. I will give the washer thing a try. Is this caused by the material from the washer degrading? The fuel pump problem in my mind hasn't been ruled out. The garage is on its last attempt to fix and seem to be concentrating on the ECU. If they don't sort it by end of today i will recover the vehicle and start my own investigation. Last time i was at the garage (monday) they had butchered much of the engine. I'll have to stop writing, i'm getting a lump in my throat!!! Regards - Tony

Storm ECU's are very reliable,get your car to a decent garage who can do a fuel pressure test by Teeing a pressure gauge into the fuel line up at the pressure regulator at the back of the head.It should be a constant 4bar all the time the pump is running,I have seen them mess around like this for some time before they finally die.As result of this I made up an adaptor so I can watch the fuel pressure whilst driving.
The ECU will not log a low pressure fault as it does not monitor the low side fuel pressure.

Also check turbo hoses - inner wall can collapse after running for a while and engine chokes and dies like it has no fuel. After stopping and cooling down, it springs back out again, until it warms up again and you put it under a fairly heavy load again.

2p

If the injector washers are leaking, a lot of gas will enter the fuel gallery in the head, and return to the pumps and tank.

The fuel pump will be very noisy in this situation.
If the pump is quiet and normal-sounding, don't head for the injector washers yet.

CharlesY

Thanks for the input . This forum really is the dogs cahuna's for defender info. I am still waiting for some results from a check on the ECU - This could be the garage fobbing me off. The fuel pump does't seem to be making any unusual noises - I havn't ruled this out yet but ill see what they say about the ECU. They have done a diode light check on the injector harness and didn't get any feed to the harness. Not a good sign! as it was replaced on Sunday. If the ECU is screwed is it a quick fix to replace? What's the cost? I have heard that pre 2001 ECU's are difficult to get hold off.

The garage couldn't get access to the ECU so they have moved the vehicle to the main dealer (Stratstone). I have a sneaky feeling this is going to get alot more expensive before i get behind the wheel .

I am presuming (dangerous, i know) that the main dealer with use Rovocom diagnostic kit. Is this going to be much different from Auto logic???

No,a main dealer will NOT use Rovacom or Autologic - they will use Testbook or IDS. The first 2 are aftermarket systems and wont be recognised by franchised dealers.Has anyone done a fuel pressure test yet? Its probably just a tired pump or burnt relay.
TD5'5 are not rocket science - any garage LR biased or not ought to be able to diagnose your cars fault.

As far as i know they havn't done a fuel presure test yet. I am waiting to hear the verdict of the main dealer / LR specialist. After the points raised on this thread i'm inclined to agree that its going to be the fuel line and not the electronics. I will speak to the garage today and ask about fule presure readings as way of assertaining there credability.

main stealers like things that they can look at on the pooter. unfortunately to measure the fuel pump pressure you have to act like a real mechanic and fit a guage into the line. This is not difficult.

you should have 4 bar at the engine or 60 psi - a bit less is OK

JimAttrill said:

main stealers like things that they can look at on the pooter. unfortunately to measure the fuel pump pressure you have to act like a real mechanic and fit a guage into the line. This is not difficult.

you should have 4 bar at the engine or 60 psi - a bit less is OK

Click to expand...

Jim,

You know about this ... and I would like to fir a fuel pressure gauge to my TD5 Disco.

What bits are needed.

Is there a kit to do it?

Do you know who could supply the bits?

CharlesY

You need a male and female push-on coupling as used on the TD5, some fuel line, a decent gauge that will measure at least 80 psi (4 bar = 60 psi). Just fit it all together with hose clamps. It is better if you can get completely transparent hose because then you can look for air bubbles in fuel lines at the fuel cooler.
It's a bit of a pig to fit to the pressure regulator, especially in a Disco. Easier with a Defender.

I'm not sure where you can buy the push-on couplings, maybe someone can help you on that.

I had an update from the main dealer today - they have changed the lift pump and fuel reg. This has apparently cured the fault - I have asked them to do a thorough road test on the motorway before i go and collect tommorrow. I am expecting to have to sell at least 1 arm and 3 legs to pay for the bill and i imagine that i may have been able to do this job myself .

They should have done what was suggested on this forum FIRST.

Seems to me the big bill could be argued. Their incompetence should not be charged at your expense.

CharlesY

yeh - your right, i am going to take the bill i have already paid with me and see if i can off set the final cost.