Temperature gauge

MR BFG · Feb 11, 2014

Morning, recently I replaced my temp sender after my gauge suddenly stopped working on Christmas Day, I replaced the item with a 2.5petrol sender as that is the engine that was in my 90 before the 200tdi swap.

The sender got the gauge working again, but now as soon the key is turned in the ignition the gauge flies straight up as far as it can. It only drops when ignition is turned off again?

I do have a few other electrical troubles around the dash when I put my sidelights/dip or full beam or the heater on my fuel gauge shoots up and so did the temp gauge before it broke. Also my fog light warning light is on all the time when any other lights are on, but fog light is not on itself.

I don't mind so much about the dash lights being on but if anyone has any ideas, then brilliant but the temp gauge is a bit of a worry when laning in traffic as I have removed the viscous fan so any help appreciated greatly.

Thanks,

Lloyd

Landyfox · Feb 11, 2014

Check all of your earths!

ebbadger · Feb 11, 2014

Definately sounds earth related..... to test the temp gauge moves you earth the wire to the block and it will shoot right up so sounds as though the sender is earthing.... test it for a ground connection using a multimeter from connector to earth... as for the rest.. also sounds earth related... electrics are the devils work

Cheers Steve

MR BFG · Feb 11, 2014

So it could be a buggered sender from brookwells?

Cheers

ebbadger · Feb 11, 2014

MR BFG said:
So it could be a buggered sender from brookwells?

Cheers

possibly if its earthing, just do a continuity check between the stud on the sender and a known earth

Cheers Steve

MR BFG · Feb 11, 2014

Proper job, will give it a try after lunch, cheers,

cornish rattler · Feb 12, 2014

MR BFG said:
Proper job, will give it a try after lunch, cheers,

That's funny I am having a few prob's with my gauges, lights, etc, going to have a look at the weekend

cowasaki · Feb 12, 2014

I've just answered a similar question a few seconds ago so you can have the same answer:

Doesn't the temperature gauge get 12v ignition live via the green wire and variable ground via the wire leading to the sender? Shouldn't be a ground other than the one feeding the bulb.

Disconnect the sender wire and check the gauge. Stick a rivet into the terminal of the sender wire and touch against the engine, the needle should go full on. Only problem will electrics other than that would be if the green wire was being pulled low by a dodgy component but you would see issues with the fuel gauge and countless other circuits.

If you've changed the sender already the next job is to check the sender wire.... Crimp a red bullet terminal to the end of some 1mm2 electrical wire 4-5 metres in length. Push the red crimp over the senders centre pin and feed the end of the wire out through the gap in the edge of the bonnet and in through the door then connect this to the sender wire connection of the temp gauge. Now try it..... If it does the same as it did before then you have tested and ruled out the sender wire leaving the gauge as most likely culprit IF however the gauge now works correctly you have a damaged sender wire so feed the temporary wire to the gauge by a more permanent route and snip off the old wire at each end.

The entire temp sender circuit only consists of gauge fed from ignition live and sender wire which goes to sender and this takes ground from the engine ground. How is your engine ground?? If it is dodgy then it could be an issue but is easy to test, attach a jump lead to the engine and to a ground point (easy one is to get two 3m jump leads and connect them to each other creating a 6m lead then connect one end to the neg on battery and the other to the engine..... Again, if this curses the problem you have your cause so replace this with a fresh earth strap from engine to chassis.

PLUS

If you are using a gauge off a different model/engine then you might want a different sender. The sender is designed to give a certain resistance at a certain temperature and this is what the gauge 'expects'. What was the normal temperature of your last engine and new engine? If they are the same then you need to change your current sender for the same one that you had in the car that the gauge came from. If the normal running temperature is higher or lower then you would need to check specs etc..... There are ways of adjusting the resistance to fit by using additional resistors but you would need more information to work out values and it would probably just be easier to replace the gauge.

MR BFG · Feb 12, 2014

Thanks cowasaki.

Had a little look this evening after I gave up trying to undo the propshaft bolts to sort the UJs. And I noticed that I don't need the ignition on to turn the gauges on. I switched on the lights and the 2 original gauges (water temp, fuel) both shot up without the keys even in the Landy. I have put in a volt gauge and boost gauge in, the volt gauge light I took power from one of the other gauges lights I'm wondering if something around there has made it ll go a bit frog eyed.

cowasaki · Feb 13, 2014

MR BFG said:
Thanks cowasaki.

Had a little look this evening after I gave up trying to undo the propshaft bolts to sort the UJs. And I noticed that I don't need the ignition on to turn the gauges on. I switched on the lights and the 2 original gauges (water temp, fuel) both shot up without the keys even in the Landy. I have put in a volt gauge and boost gauge in, the volt gauge light I took power from one of the other gauges lights I'm wondering if something around there has made it ll go a bit frog eyed.

Looks like you have used the lights feed as a ground by mistake. Disconnect the new gauge's and get back to a working state then connect them up correctly and all should be sorted. If you need any help let me know.

MR BFG · Feb 14, 2014

I will have a look when I get a chance, thanks for all your help!

cornish rattler · Feb 14, 2014

Found out yesterday part of my problem was a fooked battery and once I swapped the battery over for a used but better battery my temp gauge is reading right now just got to check the rest of the electrics over now as I am still having probs with other stuff

MR BFG · Mar 20, 2014

Only just seen your reply, I managed to fix all of my other gauge issues really easily.
I may have been a silly boy when I swapped the engine and forgot to reattach an earth on a ring terminal on the bulkhead near the fuel filter. Still having trouble with the temp readings though.

trax · Mar 20, 2014

cornish rattler said:
Found out yesterday part of my problem was a fooked battery and once I swapped the battery over for a used but better battery my temp gauge is reading right now just got to check the rest of the electrics over now as I am still having probs with other stuff

that doesn't sound right. i'd be checking my alt and earths.

cornish rattler · Mar 21, 2014

trax said:
that doesn't sound right. i'd be checking my alt and earths.

Yeah I have had the alternator checked out and it is faulty but as its charging I want to get a few other jobs done first as I want to fit an 100 amp alternator but they are £100, sorry for sounding like I am doing stuff arse uperds but there is so many ergent things that need doing first the alternator can wait

trax · Mar 21, 2014

cornish rattler said:
Yeah I have had the alternator checked out and it is faulty but as its charging I want to get a few other jobs done first as I want to fit an 100 amp alternator but they are £100, sorry for sounding like I am doing stuff arse uperds but there is so many ergent things that need doing first the alternator can wait

got a 65amp one i'm flogging

i'm heading down to manchester in a couple of weeks if you are after any other parts. i'm breaking a 300tdi fender and disco. i'm in a rammed car though, so can't carry big stuff.

oh and can you recommend a cheap place for a night? b&b, hotel?

cornish rattler · Mar 21, 2014

trax said:
got a 65amp one i'm flogging

i'm heading down to manchester in a couple of weeks if you are after any other parts. i'm breaking a 300tdi fender and disco. i'm in a rammed car though, so can't carry big stuff.

oh and can you recommend a cheap place for a night? b&b, hotel?

Where about's in Manchester are you going

trax · Mar 21, 2014

cornish rattler said:
Where about's in Manchester are you going

middle bit

some food show on at the convention center that swbo wants to go to.

had to get a travel lodge as all the decently priced hotels booked up within hours

bloody hate travel lodges, always noisy.

i'm going to see if i can find somewhere outside of manc to visit for a night after the show. any ideas on interesting places nearby? heading north

cornish rattler · Mar 21, 2014

trax said:
middle bit

some food show on at the convention center that swbo wants to go to.

had to get a travel lodge as all the decently priced hotels booked up within hours

bloody hate travel lodges, always noisy.

i'm going to see if i can find somewhere outside of manc to visit for a night after the show. any ideas on interesting places nearby? heading north

I know you said you hate travel lodges and depends on how far you want to go outside manc but there is a nice one in poynton just outside stockport that is nice and quiet bit out in the sticks and no pub or anything to keep you a wake but there is loads of places in or around manc anyway hope this helps

Oscar Romeo · Mar 22, 2014

cowasaki said:
I've just answered a similar question a few seconds ago so you can have the same answer:

Doesn't the temperature gauge get 12v ignition live via the green wire and variable ground via the wire leading to the sender? Shouldn't be a ground other than the one feeding the bulb.

Disconnect the sender wire and check the gauge. Stick a rivet into the terminal of the sender wire and touch against the engine, the needle should go full on. Only problem will electrics other than that would be if the green wire was being pulled low by a dodgy component but you would see issues with the fuel gauge and countless other circuits.

If you've changed the sender already the next job is to check the sender wire.... Crimp a red bullet terminal to the end of some 1mm2 electrical wire 4-5 metres in length. Push the red crimp over the senders centre pin and feed the end of the wire out through the gap in the edge of the bonnet and in through the door then connect this to the sender wire connection of the temp gauge. Now try it..... If it does the same as it did before then you have tested and ruled out the sender wire leaving the gauge as most likely culprit IF however the gauge now works correctly you have a damaged sender wire so feed the temporary wire to the gauge by a more permanent route and snip off the old wire at each end.

The entire temp sender circuit only consists of gauge fed from ignition live and sender wire which goes to sender and this takes ground from the engine ground. How is your engine ground?? If it is dodgy then it could be an issue but is easy to test, attach a jump lead to the engine and to a ground point (easy one is to get two 3m jump leads and connect them to each other creating a 6m lead then connect one end to the neg on battery and the other to the engine..... Again, if this curses the problem you have your cause so replace this with a fresh earth strap from engine to chassis.

PLUS

If you are using a gauge off a different model/engine then you might want a different sender. The sender is designed to give a certain resistance at a certain temperature and this is what the gauge 'expects'. What was the normal temperature of your last engine and new engine? If they are the same then you need to change your current sender for the same one that you had in the car that the gauge came from. If the normal running temperature is higher or lower then you would need to check specs etc..... There are ways of adjusting the resistance to fit by using additional resistors but you would need more information to work out values and it would probably just be easier to replace the gauge.

Great post mate!

Lee

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