td5 starting problems

I am still having a problem with my TD5.
I recently had the fuel pump replaced (it wouldn't 'buzz' when the ignition was turned on) but I once again have the same problem.

When the landy is stood for a while it won't start. I have tried puring the system by leaving the ignition on and waiting for a few moments. It still wouldn't start.

I presume it wasn't the fuel pump. Where do I start looking now?

Please help.

filter????

Fuse? Broken wiring? I would want to know whether power was getting to the fuel pump and whether the fuel pump was suppling fuel at the correct pressure and flow. Usually you hear a pump noise or screach like a cat in pain! More so when the filter is blocked or after renewing it. Generally when the fuel pumps go the vehicle is un-startable.

I managed to get it started this morning after charging the battery. the pump is working as I can hear the high pitch scream.
I have a feeling that air is getting into the system. I have been told that a NRV could prevent the fuel draining back into the tank. Where would be the best place to install the valve?
The other possibility is that there could be a fault with a regulator, but I'm not sure what this item does or where it is.
Any help from anyone who has had air leaks before would be appreciated as it gives me a head start to find out where to start.

There is a valve in the fuel filter housing. This valve allows air through and fuel untill it becomes wet then it only allows air through. Its situated (if looking at filter through the rear wheel arch) on the left hand side and the nearest fitting to you. Basically theres four pipes that come out the fuel filter housing. The bleed valve is set into the housing then a pipe is next on a quick release fitting. This pipe returns to the fuel pump inside the tank and just dumps in to the top( its isnt submerged in fuel) I have taken these out before and blown them out or replaced them. But in theory if that valve was no good it would allow fuel to just circulate back to the tank. The pressure regulator maintains a constant pressure of fuel to the fuel rail. They usually give you a warning when they are ****ed! (leaking fuel which drops on the drivers side of the back of the engine)
The vehcle usually still starts and runs though.

Would this prevent the vehilcle starting if the valve was defective. I have been out in it today and if the nose is pointed down hill it has been starting well, but if the vehicle was pointing up hill then it would struggle to start. Also on the way home the vehicle suddenly started ,making smoke (like a world war two destroyer) and sounded as though the tappets were going to come through the roof.

Then no more smoke and all was quiet again. I thought it could have been air entering the system?

What I have done before is taken the pipe off of the fuel filter from the bleed valve and turned the ignition on. Really there shouldnt be any fuel coming out, air may come out if its in the system.
When you park it in different positions does the fuel pump make different noises when the ignition is turned on. They usually screach more when the filter is empty of fuel.
What colour was the smoke that your car made?

Sometimes the pump screams and some times it seems to give a low hum. The pump has just been replaced, so I gathered that it should be in working order. Do you know in which order the hoses should be connected to the pump. The pipes have colours on but the pump does not, just incase it has been wrongly connected?

I have been listening to the engine bay and i can hear fuel getting to the fuel cooler. I've had a good look around and I can't see any obvious leaks.

I have check tightened the fuel filter just in case it was loose. I haven't taken the bleed hose of yet as i am unsure which one is the bleed and what the others are.
The smoke I mentioned was grey in colour, but it hasn't done that 'Make smoke number one' thing again.

Hey, DO you have a copy of Rave? (the workshop manual) It would be easier for you to look at the diagrams and then it would be all clear.
If there isnt any leaks then i would suspect the pipes and fitting are all sound as they are pressurized.
Grey/white smoke is unburnt fuel.

irpbath said:

What I have done before is taken the pipe off of the fuel filter from the bleed valve and turned the ignition on. Really there shouldnt be any fuel coming out, air may come out if its in the system.
When you park it in different positions does the fuel pump make different noises when the ignition is turned on. They usually screach more when the filter is empty of fuel.
What colour was the smoke that your car made?

Click to expand...

You really ought to understand the layout of the TD5 fuel system before offering help like this - its not going to help.

my thoughts are still along the air leak line.
I do have a copy of the workshop manual, but in the removal replacement of the pump the line colours are not mentioned.
I am still thinking that air is entereing the fuel sytem and thus allowing the fuel to drain back to the tank. If the fuel line were air tight then the fuel will not move along the lines. I have pretty much worked out that the fuel only drains when the nose of the vehicle points up hill. When the nose point down hill the fuel stays at the engine end and allows the vehicle to start.

Any ideas?

I think the fault has cured it's self. The landy does start now. Some very helpful people at Helston Diesel (01326 561977) replaced the fuel pump as it was intermitent. I also swapped the realys around just in case. If it happens again i will aim for the regulator as they have a habit of leaking. If you need any help with diesel engines use Helston diesel guys, very helpfull guys.

Hi guys. New to the site. not had my 2001 landrover defender td5 90 long and its already broke down on my.

Suspect the injectors not getting fuel. I can hear the electric fuel pump going. removed fuel inlet from pressure regulator. Found fuel coming out but not fast. I that right? Suspect fuel filter might be blocked. Replaced filter. Engine will still not start.

I think the pump is ok as when the filter is off and the pump is turned on diesel ****es out offilter head.

Any ideas of what to do next will be greatly appreciated.

Thanks franky..

Hi,
I will share my experience regarding TD5 having a starting problem.
I picked up on other sites that it my be the injector seals which may be worn from the vibration of the engine and leaking. This turned out to be correct.
My TD5 had done about 200000Kms and when starting cold would fire for one revolution and then die. It was then difficult to start and would take several goes for extended periods and times before slowly sputtering to a start. It helped to keep the throttle down and even all the way to the floor sometime to get it started.
As the problem persisted over a few weeks the engine sometimes cut out when slowing at a set of lights.
The sound from the fuel pump was strange and was not consistent as if the pump was fighting air locks and or fuel line leaks.
If your injector seals are leaking from what I read you have to watch the oil level to see if it goes up. Well it did but the next day it looked down again to a normal level. So this is hard to convince you the seals are leaking. What I think happened is on hot days the diesel in the oil evaporated off. Maybe in a very cold climate the diesel may accumulate in the oil over several days and you may see a steady rise. What I determined as the best way to diagnose this is pull the dipstick out when the engine is hot and has run for a while. You will see above the oil level that the dipstick looks clean as if it has been scrubbed in degreaser. It will look like clean metal. No honey brown baked on look like you see under the rocker cover when braking a car engine down. What is happening is the hot diesel in the oil is cleaning the inside of the engine. Really this is not a good thing. Its just like putting degreaser in your engine oil. The second thing you will notice is the oil level on the dipstick is hard to pick. The oil does not stick to the dipstick because it is thin and the stick is very clean. Thirdly and most importantly when you smell the hot oil on the dipstick it will STINK of diesel.
Replacing the injector seals is not difficult for a medium level backyard mechanic but I had mine done by a mechanic because I didn’t have the time. Like many people my mechanic initially thought the pump was going because of the noise it made. There are many good wed site descriptions on how to replace the seals.
Two things happen when the seals go on the injectors. They seem to both go around the same time and usually the lower copper seal before the upper O ring seal. The lower copper seals will allow diesel to leak into the chamber which is not much deal, engine a bit rich on a few cylinders and does not run smooth but really I thought the engine was a bit old and the vibration was acceptable. When the upper seal goes the diesel leaks up the stem of the injector into the rocker cover cavity and then gets washed down into the engine oil. The oil thins and the diesel washes everything like degreaser and the oil then does not stick to the metal surfaces like the cylinder walls. VERY VERY BAD SITUATION.
Don’t get fooled by the fuel pump noise. The pump noise when you turn the ignition on sounds strange because its not able to pump up to full pressure due to the seals leaking diesel and I have heard that air also enters the fuel line and can then recirculate back to the pump. So the sound varies with the air pockets and the pump seems to go for too long when you first start.
When I had my seals done the engine ran smooth with more power and starts first pop. It’s fantastic.
Really you should just do the seals if your car is about 200000Km and save yourself the hassle of waiting for it to happen. Why does it happen. Well like a lot of things on a TD5 the injectors are subject to vibration and that is what has caused the seals to wear.
If you do the seals yourself it takes about 4 hours and you have to change the oil and the external oil paper filter. GOOD LUCK. HOPE THIS HELPS. MARK