Td4 starting... to annoy!

Right then.

After my injetor leak testing, (and subsequent replacement of two) i thought I had it sussed. Then the other morning, sameas before, **** starting 5 secs to catch on, but not as much smoke as before.

As in the leak test number 1 wasnt brilliant, I thought that I'd swap that out as i had 1 spare left. still ****.

I can hear a liquid-y flow noise from the engine when i'm keyed on but not turning, arch pump sounds fine.

The funny thing is the longer i leave it in key position two (three is turning) the **** starting comes back. If i get it after the dials come on it starts straight away.

I have unplugged my synergy in case that was playing tricks as i have read about that previously.

Help really needed now! Missus-g is almost refusing to be conveyed in the 'Ferking Landrover'

Billy g

You certainly don't deserve this hassle after the work you've put in:

We took some some signal voltage readings in the early days just in case of future problems, maybe this can help?


High pressure sensor (battery end of fuel rail) Voltmeter connected between blue/black wire and battery earth ( the sensor remains connected during the test so you have to probe into the connector)

Ign 'ON' ie position 2. Signal voltage =0.5 volts
Engine idling. Signal voltage =1.28 volts
3000 RPM. Signal voltage = 1.96 volts

Good luck

Might be a co-incidence, but on my TD4, if I leave the key in position two for any length of time it doesn't want to start! All the way back to off and then through to start and it starts fine!

Chris.

Maybe there is a timelimit built in someplace which makes you have to start from zero again if you leave it too long (beyond that timelimit) in pos. 2 ??

While it often is a leaking injector that you have changed (were they new ones). We had this problem with a TD4 and it turned out to be the plug that is attached to the common rail pressure switch, had started to corrode and the contacts were not engaging correctly giving a false reading to the cpu. We fit a new plug and bingo no problem.
I remember reading a bulletin from LR saying that a modified plug was available to alleviate the problem. So that may just be the problem.

I'll have a look at the fuel rail voltages, thanks for the gen on that.

The connector looked absolutely fine when I had a ganders yesterday, do you mean the sensor end or vehicle wiring? I'm thinking that it may well be worth putting in a new pressure sensor, anyone know a price?

Thanks for all your help

Billy-g

CJK said:

Might be a co-incidence, but on my TD4, if I leave the key in position two for any length of time it doesn't want to start! All the way back to off and then through to start and it starts fine!

Chris.

Click to expand...

And my TD4 Auto doesn't have this problem at all. I have had pos 2 selected for a while at times while I fiddle with connecting charger to phone before starting up.

willo said:

Maybe there is a timelimit built in someplace which makes you have to start from zero again if you leave it too long (beyond that timelimit) in pos. 2 ??

Click to expand...

The longer i leave it the worse it is, so i would not think it is meant to do it......

Sensor issue? Overpressure from fuel pump to rail? Let's face it when the weather gets colder there will be a delay for the glowplug operation.

Dann said:

You certainly don't deserve this hassle after the work you've put in:




Ign 'ON' ie position 2. Signal voltage =0.5 volts
Engine idling. Signal voltage =1.28 volts
3000 RPM. Signal voltage = 2.79 volts!

Good luck

Click to expand...

Before a warm-up run it came up with 3.20v and was very smokey (white) i'm not sure if that was my probing introducing something to the signal.

over fueling d you think?

Billy-g said:

Before a warm-up run it came up with 3.20v and was very smokey (white) i'm not sure if that was my probing introducing something to the signal.

over fueling d you think?

Click to expand...

I think you can expect a higher reading due to increased fueling for a cold engine, don't think it's over fueling though as the smoke would be black.
Assuming you have no full power fuel starvation the under arch pump should be OK. So still think your loosing pressure via injector/s, have you any leaking back now?

Gonna have to do another test. I sent my test test kit to MICK0'CTD4 so i'll have to get that back first. I really am getting annoyed with this car now. Spose I had two and a bit years hassle free, paying for it now though.

Will you expect it to be over a volt out when warm though? 1.8v and 2.8v seem very different to me

The pressure sensor voltage signals were taken from 2 TD4s, both running well and the engines were warm when testing.

I would recheck the injectors.

Billy i have sent you a PM regarding the test kit. Thanks again for that!!!

Billy-g said:

Will you expect it to be over a volt out when warm though? 1.8v and 2.8v seem very different to me

Click to expand...

I didn't notice this in your post, must of been distracted by the reference to the 3.20v.
Agree it seems a long way out. Not actually sure if volts goes up or down when fuel pressure drops. If volts increase as pressure falls then that explains it. Maybe Dann knows?
Anyhow still think you should check injectors one last time then if you are definitely holding pressure there then you might have to consider trying another sensor.

MickO'CTD4 said:

Billy i have sent you a PM regarding the test kit. Thanks again for that!!!

Click to expand...

NO probs.

Gonna retest, once this baby has popped out (missus g is 8 days overdue!) Till then I'm gonna wonder about grumblin' about my great misfortunes... Not really- plans for the injectors i have taken out

Does anyone know an injector recon person(s) who'll do 'em?

Billy g

"Not actually sure if volts goes up or down when fuel pressure drops"


The voltage signal seems to be directly proportional to fuel pressure e.g. rising voltage = rising pressure.

Unplugging the LP pump whilst the engine is running causes a reduction in voltage until the engine stops at approx 0.7 volts.

Although the multimeter I use is good quality, more exact results would be obtained with a scope using data capture etc.

Just a quicky
Should the injectors leak at all? I would have assumed that they will leak slightly hence the return pipe.

Also would the increased pressure because of the Synergy tuning module increase the leak or cause a leak due to increased pressure?

old 'un this one but i thought that i'd better update.

Missus G had the baby and he has kept me fairly busy ha aha aha!

the freebie starts alright mostof the time, always first time. I have cx'd 3 injectors, maf, egr mod, crankcase breather mod, synergy and glowplugs. Gave the inlet manifold a bloody good cleaning n all + regular servicing.

now, every so often it gets lumpy on idle, like its strugglin for diesel, tap the pedal and it smooths out no questions. getting an lp fuel pump and that has to do it.

incidently, it has done 2 and a half k like this including home to Kernow n back thrice....

she int bothere anymore as she has a bigger car for my little boy!

Billy G

Billy-g said:

Missus G had the baby and he has kept me fairly busy ha aha aha!

Click to expand...

top congrats to you and the missus, harder than ever to find freelandering time now I should think !