TD4 Auto in-gear acceleration causes judder...?

Hi All.

We have a 2004 TD4 Auto (Sport) and in-gear acceleration under load causes judder through the whole car.

For example... if the car is in 5th at 50mph (1700rpm ish) and you're going up any sort of hill/incline and try to accelerate enough that the engine can pull but not enough that the auto boxes needs to change down you get a juddering. It feels a little like a manual car with a worn clutch! Its like the engine has enough torque to pull in-gear but the transmission or drivetrain isn't liking it.

The second you feel the judder, if you kick the pedal to get it to change to 4th - your fine. The judder won't occur once the revs are up. Its like the tranmission doesn't like pulling under load at low revs.

There are no problems pulling away (etc). Its litrally in-gear pull at low revs the drivetrain seems to frown upon.

Any ideas what could be faulty?


Rob

RobBentley said:

Hi All.

We have a 2004 TD4 Auto (Sport) and in-gear acceleration under load causes judder through the whole car.


Any ideas what could be faulty?

Rob

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Hi Rob - clue could be in your sig? I don't know if it's a fault, but perhaps a symptom of having more power/torque than the transmission has been set up for?
I have a ron synergy unit in my auto and it seems to like to hold on to the higher gear for longer before down shifting - easily remedied by kick down.
As I say I don't know if this is the case but it could be a possibility?

Remapping the TD4 FreeLander is common as hell. I know a few people who have had it done and loads of Land Rover specialist garages around here offer it. I don't think thats the problem... I think something is worn/faulty. Of course the remap may be aggrevating it more / early.

Norbet said:

Hi Rob - clue could be in your sig? I don't know if it's a fault, but perhaps a symptom of having more power/torque than the transmission has been set up for?
I have a ron synergy unit in my auto and it seems to like to hold on to the higher gear for longer before down shifting - easily remedied by kick down.
As I say I don't know if this is the case but it could be a possibility?

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sorry to jump on this thread, but mine does this, and have wondered from time to time, whether mine has been re-mapped, or indeed has a ron unit, because compared to other td4's ive had this one goes like stink!!, is there any way of telling whether it has been mapped or where would i look to see a ron unit????

If its had the ECU reflashed (as mine has) you won't physically be able to tell. I presume yours is an Auto?

Mine doesn't exactly "go like stink" even with the remap! (although mine was mapped for a balance of economy and performance). Yours might be mapped for all-out power.

I think I'm going to get the map taken away for a day or two... See if its the same!

dont get me wrong when i say goes like stink, it aint no sports car, but when the power comes in it pulls like a biatch and just takes off, yeah it is an auto, just compared to td4's ive owned and company cars ive drove, this is like a diffrent car, and i still seen to get good economy

Mine has oodles of acceleration power which builds from 2000rpm until about 3300rpm.. but the power tails off pretty quickly.

My other car is a 300BHP 4motion Passat... which makes me a real bad judge of how the TD4 is performing.

Hi. I had a Td4 auto (X reg.) that would 'judder' when accelerating. Turned out it was a faulty valve block in the auto box, a split in the valve body was letting fluid from one valve into another, box was trying to engage 2 gears/clutches at the same time! The auto gearbox specialist we sent the box to had repaired several with the same fault, cost to repair was about the same as a recon at the time, about £1000. Changed it for a Td4 manuel soon after getting the box repaired.

This isn't really on accelerating... as such. If you kick the box down a gear it accelerates fine without judder. Its when trying to hold load a low revs.

Yeah, mine used to do it mainly when trying to maintain speed going up-hill, I live in East Anglia so no big hills, if I kicked the gearbox down it was ok.

Mine has a powerbox module, this allows you to vary the amout of power and return to standard at will. About 7000 miles ago mine started to change gear violently on partial throttle / gentle acceleration at low revs 1500 - 2000. Changing to a softer state of tune helped, then sent it in for a service early. Guy Salmon changed the transmission oil as part of the service and the fault has dissappeared.

RobBentley said:

Hi All.

We have a 2004 TD4 Auto (Sport) and in-gear acceleration under load causes judder through the whole car.

For example... if the car is in 5th at 50mph (1700rpm ish) and you're going up any sort of hill/incline and try to accelerate enough that the engine can pull but not enough that the auto boxes needs to change down you get a juddering. It feels a little like a manual car with a worn clutch! Its like the engine has enough torque to pull in-gear but the transmission or drivetrain isn't liking it.

The second you feel the judder, if you kick the pedal to get it to change to 4th - your fine. The judder won't occur once the revs are up. Its like the tranmission doesn't like pulling under load at low revs.

There are no problems pulling away (etc). Its litrally in-gear pull at low revs the drivetrain seems to frown upon.

Any ideas what could be faulty?


Rob

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Hi there did you ever find out the problem was, because im having the exact same problem with my freelander 2 auto 2009

mervin said:

Hi there did you ever find out the problem was, because im having the exact same problem with my freelander 2 auto 2009

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He's not been on here since 2010.
When an autobox does that, it usually means that it's recieving enough torque to hold the higher gear, but in actual fact it needs to be one gear lower.
For example, if your pottering along in 5th at 1750rpm and encounter an incline but try and hold the revs steady, the box will hold 5th thinking everything is hunky, but the car will shake due to torque rattling the drive train. Pushing the accelerator a bit harder will sort this.
If you've had a remap or have a tuning chip like me, this happens quite a bit, I just push the go pedal til it changes down.
Hope this helps a bit.
Mike

Skinny Mike said:

He's not been on here since 2010.
When an autobox does that, it usually means that it's recieving enough torque to hold the higher gear, but in actual fact it needs to be one gear lower.
For example, if your pottering along in 5th at 1750rpm and encounter an incline but try and hold the revs steady, the box will hold 5th thinking everything is hunky, but the car will shake due to torque rattling the drive train. Pushing the accelerator a bit harder will sort this.
If you've had a remap or have a tuning chip like me, this happens quite a bit, I just push the go pedal til it changes down.
Hope this helps a bit.
Mike

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Unless the torque converter clutch is on its way out.
Mine was doing a shudder after I overloaded the TC clutch one hot day last June. TC clutch shudder can cured it with 2 tubes of Dr Tranny's Shudder Fix.

I bought my TD4 auto with 70k miles on it in 2013. It had had a remap done by a previous owner. After a few months I noticed the same judder. Very occasionally but always in the same circumstances. A gentle incline, a little bit of throttle, the car pulling nicely but feeling like it should just hold, or drop down a gear. Since then I've done 55k miles and loads of jobs. I've also been running a Ronbox for three years. I've done two auto fluid changes since owning the car. The judder has not changed one bit in all that time though. I just blip the accelerator and it's fine. I may be tempting fate, but have just learned to live with it. It does seem to be slightly more prevalent when the car is heavier though. I have always put it down to a non factory map.

kernowsvenski said:

I bought my TD4 auto with 70k miles on it in 2013. It had had a remap done by a previous owner. After a few months I noticed the same judder. Very occasionally but always in the same circumstances. A gentle incline, a little bit of throttle, the car pulling nicely but feeling like it should just hold, or drop down a gear. Since then I've done 55k miles and loads of jobs. I've also been running a Ronbox for three years. I've done two auto fluid changes since owning the car. The judder has not changed one bit in all that time though. I just blip the accelerator and it's fine. I may be tempting fate, but have just learned to live with it. It does seem to be slightly more prevalent when the car is heavier though. I have always put it down to a non factory map.

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Very helpful and exactly what is happening with my sons's 07 auto Freelander. Being new to this, can you explain the "Ronbox". Thanks

JBKK said:

Very helpful and exactly what is happening with my sons's 07 auto Freelander.

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It's quite common, and if it's the torque converter clutch, unfortunately expensive to sort.

JBKK said:

Being new to this, can you explain the "Ronbox". Thanks

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The Ronbox or Synergy2 to use it's more modern name is a tuning box, which tricks the engine control module into adding more fuel, and so the engine makes more power. Its not relevant for the FL2, as it has more complex fuel management system.

Nodge68 said:

It's quite common, and if it's the torque converter clutch, unfortunately expensive to sort.

The Ronbox or Synergy2 to use it's more modern name is a tuning box, which tricks the engine control module into adding more fuel, and so the engine makes more power. Its not relevant for the FL2, as it has more complex fuel management system.

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Thanks!

I just put this down to too higher a gear and too low revs, plus the added confusing of your right foot in a goldielocks position....Just normal me thinks. Kickdown changes down a gear and your fine again...you cant go up steep hills in 5th at 30mph