Suspected IRD problems. Need confirmation

Hi folks,

I think I know what the response I will get to this post, but I need to ask.
I have read around the forum and things and I'm still unsure.

I think I'm having IRD problems, there is a clickey metallic sound when
I put it in reverse, but no noises after it's moved a couple of feet. It reverses free and easy and doesn't stiffen or struggle.

Just recently I was driving to work and hit 50mph, it started to vibrate like mad, but not through the steering wheel. This vibration cleared up and went away by the time I hit 70mph. It's been doing it ever since, but seems to have subsided slightly in the last couple of journeys.

My first suspicion was prop centre bearings, or some kind of balance issue being as the vibrating went away at 70mph so when I was changing the pads and shoes I got underneath for a proper inspection. The centre bearings were fine and everything was as tight as it should be. It all seemed really solid.

All in all I'm not getting any other noises than the occasional clink when I begin to move in reverse and the vibration that comes and goes, but seems to be smoothing out a little.

The only reason I ask is that most IRD problems on here seem to be creating a lot of noise with lots of reverse grinding. Is this the early stages of a catastrophic failure?

It's extremely annoying as I've only had the car 5 months and it's needed two injectors and now this, as always though, it was dandy on the test drive...
One of the main reasons for buying it was so I can get through the snow. Missing work isn't an option, so with winter fast approaching I need to get it sorted.

Any help is much appreciated guys.

Mine vibrated like that when the VCU was buggered.
Went away at about 70.
Don't know about the click in reverse though.

Really!? We're there any other symptoms and is it advisable to drop the prop off now before I blow the IRD to bits?

Absolutely. No other symptoms but I think I caught it fairly early.
How near are you to Bell Engineering?
https://maps.google.co.uk/maps?q=DY12+2XG
For the sake of a few hundred quid it's worth getting the VCU reconditioned, and he might check out the other bits, maybe...

[edit] Hmm 109 miles. I'd definitely give them a call though. 01299 266503 [/edit]

Nowhere near unfortunately! With my work schedule at the mo, it'd be near impossible to get there too.

What I could do with knowing is; If I drop the prop off and the IRD is buggered, will the signs still be there? If not, is there a sure fire IRD test?
I just don't want to go buying a VCU unnecessarily.

[edit] yeah, I think I'll give them a shout. Thanks for the number and info man! [edit]

One thing is for sure- if you buy a Freelander without proof of a recent VCU, then you should fit a recon one from Bells at the very minimum. ONLY fit GKN support bearings, or they will fail within a few months again. A knurdled VCU will cause all the other problems- they START with the VCU which wears everything else. You're looking about £300 and a couple of hours tops. Do it now before the weather turns too bad. If the IRD is knurdled then you will need a new VCU and bearings anyway, so start with them and you might be lucky. Personally I'm going with it being a propshaft/VCU?support bearing issue rather than IRD.


What year and mileage is your Freeloader?

Right, well that definitely sheds some light on the situation.

I'll drop the prop off and replace the VCU (when I get my hands on £300 that is) and run it 2wd for now. If that saves the IRD then it'll be done!

It's an '03 3dr kalahari TD4 with 195k on it. And no, I don't think there is proof of a VCU being done in the history of the car. Not the best situation I know. It's already cost me two injectors...

You could test the vcu yourself...

Hippo said:

You could test the vcu yourself...

Click to expand...

Which method? I've read that the 'tip-ex prop' and 'strong arm on the rear wheel' methods are useless.

MoominTD4 said:

Which method? I've read that the 'tip-ex prop' and 'strong arm on the rear wheel' methods are useless.

Click to expand...

Try the "one wheel up test" in me signature below and post the results on ere and in the VCU Torque Test Results fred at the top of the Freelander section.

Good shout, I'll give it a go as soon as I can!

If you find that you need a VCU, Bell Engineering will put one in the post for you - check their web site.

Bells recommend the best way to test a VCU is a 15 mile drive and test if it is hot. If it's hot, it's shot. Makes sense if you understand how it works.

195k is a lot, but as long as the driveline is ok, the rest should be ok. Maybe need to replace shocks, springs, bushes, bearings. The injectors should be reconned every 100k and VCUs last about 70k. At 195k, it's most definitely shot if it's the original and no doubt knurdled the rest. Check the rear diff mounts too.

After 15 mines a vcu will be warm but there are additional factors involved here. If there's problems with tyres then the vcu would get a lot hotter and changing it wouldn't solve the problem. You could be buying a replacement vcu when you don't need it.

True, but Bells said hot, hot, hot- not just warm, and at 195k you've gotta agree it should be changed if there's no proof it's been done. For the sake of £300 I'd consider it a service item like a cambelt. Nobody would leave a cambelt of unkown age and the cost is similar.

How does it and the support bearings look? Do they look shiny and new or rusty and scratched with flaky paint? Do the bearings grumble? Are they rough when you spin them after dropping the prop? Could be a rough indication of the age of the VCU...?

Well, strangely enough it all looks rather new. No flakey paint really, but then the whole car doesn't feel like it's been used, even at that mileage. It's been serviced well and kept on top of, so I would say that if this sort of thing had cropped up in the past, the previous owner (of which there was one) would've had it sorted...

I haven't managed to get the prop off tonight, I've no access to torx spanners/sockets, but my journey to work is roughly 15 miles and it's nice and flat and straight near enough all the way in.

I'll check the temp tomorrow when I get to work and report heat levels.

As far as diff mounts go, I checked the other day when I did pads and shoes and they're all fine.

I understand what you're saying about the cost of repairing the VCU and indeed, getting it done as a matter of course is the best and most logical thing to do. Problem is though, I don't live in a world where £300 is not a lot of money. If I'm spending that kind of money then I can't afford to be wrong.

As I said, I'll report the heat findings and try to get the prop off ASAP. I'll let you know if there's a difference when I do.

Thanks for all the advice and suggestions guys, I really appreciate it.

I'd be tempted to say the VCU and/or bearings could be recent based on condition, but we truly don't know. Mine was shot when I bought it. It felt nice and loose when cold and a 5 mile test didn't stiffen it up, but a 20 mile drive did! When I did a full lock reverse at slow speed it was fine when cold, but after 20 miles it felt as if the handbrake was on and stopped very quick. I didn't know about the hot VCU think until after I'd sent mine off so I can't comment, only except that is what Bells told me. Now I have a recon VCU and GKN bearings and the car still feels loose after 100 miles. 4wd still works as it should, tested on gravel so everything is cool. Any way to write to the previous owner and ask about VCU?

Writing to them may be the thing to do.

It used to feel tight when I reversed, but after a quick brake inspection it turned out the shoe retaining clips were missing. All four of them, so since sorting those out it's been great. Until this vibration and metal-y clink business.

Ah well, I'll take it one step at a time and post results.

Ha! Nice rant! I'll be sure to do the test and see what happens!

Right. Just done a near 20 mile journey and checked the VCU... stone cold... Hmmmmmm.
And on second inspections, it looks brand new.

The earliest I can get to take the prop off is Friday, so I'll look at the bearings and double check them too. I'll also run it with the prop off for a bit, initially to see if the vibration is prop/rear drive related, but to save the VCU from wearing while I'm doing flat, boring work mileage.

Update on the vibration also, it has settled a bit now. It is still there from 50-70mph and now gets a bit worse before it gets better as you push past 70mph. However, it's not as violent for the most part and the reverse 'clinking' has stopped (at least for the last 5 or 6 times I've reversed).

Make of it what you will! I'll report back when the prop is off!