Series 2 Alarm

Hi,
I have a 52 plate series 2 GS TD5 manual, I've had it about a month now and love it to bits. But, (there's always a but!) About 9 times out of ten when I try to start the car the key won't turn in the ignition. It seems to be an alarm problem because if I rearm the alarm and once again disarm it I can turn the key and start the engine. I now know when It's going to do it. When I unlock the car using the fob, normally the alarm light in the dash goes out and I put the key in the ignition, turn it and all is well. When it's going to do it, I unlock the car with the fob and if the light flashes very fast, then I know that it wont allow me to turn the key in the ignition. I then either have to reset the alarm by locking and unlocking or sometimes It will allow me to press the unlock button once while it's in the ignition and it will then allow me to turn the key, but sometimes if I do this the alarm is triggered, very embarrasing.
I have read on this forum that there is no electronic device which prevents you from turning the ignition key, but it feels very much like it to me, it certainly isn't jammed and as soon as I press the button it releases. I have a rave workshop manual and it doesn't show any device, but like I said it feels as though there is. The alarm system is made by VALEO and both keyfobs have new batteries and behave in exactly the same way.
Anyone got the same problem, anyone got any good info regarding this system.
Thanks and Regards
RichardG

hi there i to have 51 td5 adventuer ltd edition i have the same problem but my key does make the turn but the starter does not kick in and like you i press the button one more time thats 3 in total, it lets the starter function it was obviously imobilised still after i had pressed it twice it does not allways do this and i am pretty sure its to do with the passive imobilisation function in other words how you left it when you last drove it ,if you got out and did"nt arm the allarm it imobilise its self using its passive function it does show this in your handbook along with other functions that it can do onits own ,very scary stuff init, hopr this helps but i dont fully understand it either,cheers phil

Hi Phil,
Thanks for that, not the same unfortunately or do I mean fortunately
I know what you mean though about the passive imobilisation, mines not doing that, I just can't turn the key. I thought it was just a sticky barrel etc, because when it does turn it turns so easy and engine starts no problem. Has yours got an alarm sounder as well as the two tones, apparently some have them fitted. I've never heard mine, so it's either not working or not fitted. You're right about it being scary. I've got visions of me being locked in one day or locked out when it's throwing down.
I reckon I'm gonna see if anyone knows at Landrover.
Bet they don't.

RichardG

hi richard,no mine does not have any tones to the functions only flashing indicators,it does toot the horn in anger when i have pressed tho fob when one of the doors is open,unless its in warranty with a landrover mian dealer i would"nt use them find your self a good independant they are more clued up with the same diagnostic gear and dont want a kidney for there work hope you sort it ,let me know

Just a thought but when it happens that you cannot turn the key, have you tried to waggle the steering wheel a bit? If your steering lock is on, sometimes its difficult to turn the key.

I do remember my key getting a little sticky at times, I gave the lock a light spray with WD40, made a big difference.

Having a look at the handbook, the LED rapidly flashing when you unlock means -

If it flashes until you turn the key to position II - the alarm has been triggered while you were away.

If it flashes for 10 seconds - the battery in the key fob is low.

Hi Mantamad,
Yes, I tried waggling the steering wheel, my series 1 200 tdi was a pig for doing that. You had to develop a knack . With the series 2, I did think it was mechanical, but the more it does the more it feels electrical. The flashing led, also indicates a fault condition, when it flashes rapidly. As you say it indicates that the alarm has been triggered while away. But on these times the led has been flashing slowly whenever I have returned. Yes, I am also aware that it can mean that the fobs battery is low. I have two fobs with new batteries and like I said earlier this doesn't happen everytime, but when it does it's a pain. What I would like to know most of all is why the ignition switch appears to be locked. I will try some lubrication on the key, although I have been told that you shouldn't use oil on a lock, due to it causing problems later.
Thanks for your input, keep it coming

RichardG

This is my fault exactly TD5 Tdi on an '02. Ive replaced the (2 btn) fob battery and the spare fob too but it keeps activating the immobiliser/alarm. I have to reset it wait 5 mins and it clears for a week, sometimes a month, often when its been sitting in the sun.

I have stood in supermkt car parks in the rain, stuck in laybys, outside shops etc etc It is driving me mad and no-one has a definitive answer. Dealers can fix it for a wad of cash just like the window winder mechanisms. They said its a known fault and wanted just under £200 to replace them with identical components. I was furious that they would replace a 'known fault' with a 'known fault'. I took them out and welded them up properly (not silly little spot welds). Cost = 2 weldng rods and about 1 1/2 hours work.

The immobiliser is the same - Its a 'known fault' and I am damned if I am going to be ripped off by them replacing it with the same components and mindset. There has to be someone who has found a fix.

Please help before I end up as the King of The Mushroom People dribbling down my chin.

Hi Billy,
I seem to have mastered my little problems I had when I first got the vehicle, I am now happy. The problem that I had initially as I reported at the top of this thread actually turned out to be the key. The key blade has a stop near the fob which has been cut so that the blade is too long which allows the key to be inserted too deep into the barrel, stopping it from turning. I have to pull it out about 1/32" which allows it to turn. So now I know about it, the problem has gone away. Since then I've had a really weird problem with the alarm, where under certain circumstances it will not allow the engine to turn. This up to now has only happened if I leave a passenger in the car and leave the keys in the ignition for more than 10minutes (approx). When I come back to the car and turn the ignition the warning lights do their check but the engine will not turn. The only thing to do is to lock the car up (with the fob) and wait 3 minutes, then it's fine. It's done it twice and both times under the same circumstances, I now take the keys out everytime I leave it (which I should do anyway) and haven't had the problem since (touching head). I've also noticed If I leave a passenger in the car for a while and don't lock it, if that person gets out of the car the hazard lights flash once. I wonder what it's trying to tell me. I did read somewhere, but can't find or remember where, that the car would imobolise itself if the keys were left in the ignition, basically to stop anyone jumping in it and driving off. I am pretty sure my alarm hasn't a fault, it's just that the instructions for use and function are sparse to say the least.
Experts Please!
Hope this helps
Regards
RichardG

Hi everyone,
Just had a three week holiday touring with my series 2 disco and caravan. Really impressed with the way the car handled the caravan, been a pleasure to drive. However, I am still having problems with the alarm, I thought I had mastered it, but during a solo outing to a big shopping centre, I parked up and left the car fully locked, about an hour later went back to the car opened it up, got in, including passengers, closed all doors, inserted key, turned key, dash lights came on, turned key further and "Nothing Happened".
I thought, here we go again. We all got out the car, I locked it up again, allowed the alarm to set and went through the whole process again. Usually this works, but again nothing happened. I did this again twice and still it wasn't having any of it. So I thought, at last we've broken down and we're gonna get to the bottom of it. I phoned my breakdown service and was told that someone would be with us in less than an hour. So, we relaxed a little and listened to the radio. Half an hour later, I turned the key and the damned thing started, five minutes later the recovery truck arrived. Embarrassing or what? The car behaved perfectly for another four days, during the four days I visited a Landrover Dealer in Hinckley, (Trinity Motors) for some advice, I couldn't get to see a Techy, I had to go through a receptionist, who told me the Techy said it was 80% likely to be the starter motor, which would be £295 and £70 labour + vat. Now, how the hell can it be the starter motor when 95% of the time it's ok? The battery is also ok.
Today, I am back from my holls and went to the local supermarket to fetch some vitals etc. and the bloody thing wouldn't let me in at all this time, I opened the door with the key and used the switch on the dash to unlock the back door, which set the alarm off, Jesus, talk about panic. So shut all the doors and relocked, started again and everything was ok. This is now starting to do my head in!
Has anybody got any ideas, what could be causing this.
Regards
RichardG

I had a problem with mine last summer, every now and then, the doors would unlock as normal, turn the key, lights come on but the starter motor would not turn. This was very intermittent and I wanted to check if it was an immobiliser or starter motor problem so wired up a temporary light inside the car that would come one when the starter motor was turning.

Finally the day came when it failed to turn over but the light came on as normal, this comfirmed the problem to be the starter motor. I called my local dealer for a laugh just to get a price on a new starter motor but in the end, sourced one from a specialist breaker on ebay (£40)

Never had a problem since.

To make a test light, locate the 12v spade connector the the started solenoid (on top of the motor) and connect a wire to this and run into the car. Connect this to a bulb then run a further wire to earth. The bulb should light up when power goes to the starter.

Hi again

My problem more precisely is the key (with checked new battery) opens on the button and equally closes and sometimes the button fails to open it at all. I am able to open by physically inserting the key and opening that way. Without ryhme or reason it will open the door and the alarm will go off. I have the details to reset the code which I do. After the statutory five or so minutes I get in and go and it all works again. Earlier resets would allow the key to once again open it on the button but more recently it is key in door only.

It is a pathetic situation where I feel I am being held to ransom by the stupid who in their own words say 'its a known fault' but add '...and we can fix it for a gazillion pounds'. But it is still a known fault thereafter.

Three LR's and the final insult - I will never ever buy LR again and have cancelled my new one already and ordered a Toyota Land Cruiser.

Mine came from the dealer at Hinkley too.

Thanks for that Mantamad,
I'll give it a try. How or where did you route the wire into the cab.
Regards & Thanks
RichardG

As it was a very temporary situation I just routed it up through at the corner of the bonnet and into the car over the rubber door seal, held in place with some tape.

Thanks again Mantamad,
Just two more questions. Did you fit your replacement starter motor?
I've just been told that the exhaust pipe has to be dropped to allow access to the starter motor, is this true?

Regards
RichardG

Yes I did fit the replacement myself and no, there is no need to drop the exhaust. The rear bolt is difficult to get to because you cannot see it, you have to feel for it. Took me a while as I didn't realise it was a different size to the other ones (LR having a laugh there!) From memory the rear was a 15mm the front 2, 13mm but it was over a year ago so don't take that as gospel.

If it helps, I still have the old starter motor if you need a photograph to identify the bolt locations.

I changed mine with the drivers side jacked up a few inches (and supported) and worked underneath, a pit or ramp would have been easier but I could not get access to a pit at the time.