Petrol in diesel disco 3

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My best story, At the last job i had, was there for 12 years driving vans, The one time the boss came out with me, i part filled the van with petrol :doh:
stopped went and paid for the petrol about £15 then filled the rest of the tank with Diesel about £45. Boss was a bit concerend, i told him it would be fine once it was mixed, so spent the next 10miles blasting down country lanes to mix it :D When we got back to base the boss went next door the the garage we used to service it, told him what happened. He just laughed and said it would be fine :D
 
One day I will tell y'all about the day in July last year I put 70 litres of unleaded in my TD5 Disco!

25,000 miles later no harm seems to have resulted, but at the time it was pretty scary.

TD5 fuel gets hotter than the boiling point of petrol ... and that causes bad vapour locks, and an obvious risk from petol vapour igniting.

The way out was OIL into the tank, engine oil and diesel.

It was VERY smokey on cold start-ups every day for over a week, but day after day it got less, and after about 10 days back to normal.

Just threw in 24 litres of ASDA sunflower oil at 85 p a litre, so it's about a 50-50 mix. Their diesel is £1.08.
Saved 24 x 23 pence which is just under SIX POUNDS saved, and the car runs better too!

Charles.
 
CharlesY said:
Just threw in 24 litres of ASDA sunflower oil at 85 p a litre, so it's about a 50-50 mix. Their diesel is £1.08.
Saved 24 x 23 pence which is just under SIX POUNDS saved, and the car runs better too!

Charles.
Click to expand...
I'm sure you were dead against putting veg oil in a TD5 at one point Charles. Have you changed your mind on this point?:confused:

Or do you mean 50-50 PETROL and oil???
 
PASTMASTER said:
I'm sure you were dead against putting veg oil in a TD5 at one point Charles. Have you changed your mind on this point?:confused:

Or do you mean 50-50 PETROL and oil???
Click to expand...


Not a chance! I was NEVER against veg in TD5, but I did make sure the rubber seals and stuff were fit to handle it.

I phoned LandRover and asked WHY the manual said the TD5 was not compatible with BioDiesel. The man said that is because the engine is not compatible with biodiesel. I said that was what was written in the manual, and my question was WHY is it not compatible, what will happen, what will go wrong?

I remember the answer to that - he said "Look Mr Xxxxx, you don't understand this ... the engine is not compatible with biodiesel".

This went on for some time.

I killed the conversation by saying he had no idea what he was talking about. He hung up on me.

PETROL in any amount in TD5 fuel is not a great idea because the return fuel temperature will usually exceed the boiling point of petrol. Bad plan.

My experience is that my TD5 runs noticeably smoother when there's a goodly amount of veg oil or BioDiesel in the fuel. A 50-50 mix is great. As it costs me about 30p a litre at most to make Biodiesel, it has to be worth the slight effort making the stuff

CharlesY
 
Last edited:
CharlesY said:
Not a chance! I was NEVER against veg in TD5, but I did make sure the rubber seals and stuff were fit to handle it.

My experience is that my TD5 runs noticeably smoother when there's a goodly amount of veg ot BioDiesel in the fuel.

CharlesY
Click to expand...
Aaaagh! It's the Senility setting in! Sorry about that. I'm interested now. Did you actually change your seals and stuff?:eek:
 
CharlesY said:
One day I will tell y'all about the day in July last year I put 70 litres of unleaded in my TD5 Disco!

25,000 miles later no harm seems to have resulted, but at the time it was pretty scary.

TD5 fuel gets hotter than the boiling point of petrol ... and that causes bad vapour locks, and an obvious risk from petol vapour igniting.

The way out was OIL into the tank, engine oil and diesel.

It was VERY smokey on cold start-ups every day for over a week, but day after day it got less, and after about 10 days back to normal.

Just threw in 24 litres of ASDA sunflower oil at 85 p a litre, so it's about a 50-50 mix. Their diesel is £1.08.
Saved 24 x 23 pence which is just under SIX POUNDS saved, and the car runs better too!

Charles.
Click to expand...

Did you siphon any of the petrol out before putting the engine oil etc in?
 
PASTMASTER said:
Aaaagh! It's the Senility setting in! Sorry about that. I'm interested now. Did you actually change your seals and stuff?:eek:
Click to expand...

No. Eventually I found out that even before 2004 when my Disco was made, ALL cars have had to use tubes and seals and O-rings etc that can stand BioDiesel (and svo) in Diesel fuel and also alcohol (ethanol) in petrol. Almost all diesel these days contains some Bio. The animal rendering plants extract the animal fat, that is reacted into BioDiesel, and lobbed in with the real diesel. All those greeny vegans don't know that the fuel they use is partly melted down cows and horses!

CharlesY
 
andymach23 said:
Did you siphon any of the petrol out before putting the engine oil etc in?
Click to expand...

We were well trapped on the M40 motorwaywhen we worked out why the Disco was a bit off song. Kept Going. No point in stopping while she was running.

As long as it was running at about 50-ish it was running sort of OK, but when the revs dropped it got sick as a parrot. Then we met a HUGE traffic jam, but were dead lucky there was a slip road. I was in LOW range to keep the revs up, and we were again lucky there was a filling station really near. Pulled in. Threw in some litres of engine oil and filled her to the brim with diesel. I was fairly hopeful she would start up because of the way the TD5 circulates the fuel. It pumps gallons a minute round the system. I let it pump for a couple of minutes (learn the TD5 priming system folks!) and fired her up. Back up the north roads but we stayed off the motorway for the first 50 miles. We threw in more diesel on the way home, and got home. TD5 Disco 420 miles on 70 litres unleaded petrol! BAD PLAN!

Next morning when I started it there was smoke like a London smog. I was sick. It really looked like the engine was stuffed. But after it warmed up the smoke cleared. It drove that day fine. Next morning, more smoke, but maybe not QUITE as much. And so on. After a week or so it was not smokey on start-up, and it has run fine for 20k miles since. THERE IS A GOD, and he drives a LandRover!

CharlesY
 
CharlesY said:
No. Eventually I found out that even before 2004 when my Disco was made, ALL cars have had to use tubes and seals and O-rings etc that can stand BioDiesel (and svo) in Diesel fuel and also alcohol (ethanol) in petrol. Almost all diesel these days contains some Bio. The animal rendering plants extract the animal fat, that is reacted into BioDiesel, and lobbed in with the real diesel. All those greeny vegans don't know that the fuel they use is partly melted down cows and horses!

CharlesY
Click to expand...
Including, I hear, those post Chernobyl radioactive sheep (Chernobyl's fascinating btw - went there a couple of weeks ago). OK, I'm going to have a look at pouring the odd pint of SVO in if I can find the right stuff cheap enough.:)
 
CharlesY said:
We were well trapped on the M40 motorwaywhen we worked out why the Disco was a bit off song. Kept Going. No point in stopping while she was running.
Click to expand...
That's the way my Freelander behaved in the Alps - just running a bit rough but fine until I switched off, after which it refused to start and a bit later I worked out why. TD5 obviously made of sterner stuff!
 
PASTMASTER said:
Including, I hear, those post Chernobyl radioactive sheep (Chernobyl's fascinating btw - went there a couple of weeks ago). OK, I'm going to have a look at pouring the odd pint of SVO in if I can find the right stuff cheap enough.:)
Click to expand...

Get a 3 litre of sunflower oil from ASDA etc, at 85p a litre up here.

Find a clear clean plastic bottle. Half fill it with pump diesel. Fill it up with sunflower oil. You probably won't even need to shake it to mix.

Now tip the whole lot in the tank. You saved 3 x 25 pence just like that.

You save 25 pence a litre on every litre of veg you use. This rule applies whether you run on neat Veg or a mix.


If you have a MAKRO card you may be able to buy 25 litre cans of veg oil even cheaper, but they may restrict how many you can buy. WHY do they restrict? Because everyone and his brother would clean them out for fuelling taxis and trucks, and the chippies wouldn't be able to get any. If you used a 50-50 mix in a Disco, that's 45 litres of veg per fill. The saving on every tankful would be 45 x 25 pence, that's saving £11.25 per tank-full!

TD5 is particularly good on veg and bioD because of the way the oil is circulated and heated. Ideal.

CharlesY
 
PASTMASTER said:
That's the way my Freelander behaved in the Alps - just running a bit rough but fine until I switched off, after which it refused to start and a bit later I worked out why. TD5 obviously made of sterner stuff!
Click to expand...


The TD5 Injection works in a quite different way from the TD4. These engines have NO connection with each other. A TD5 is NOT a TD4 with an extra cylinder. A lot of people assume otherwise. TD5 Engine's real name is the STORM Engine.

In the TD4 there is a high pressure fuel pump (driven by a chain?) that is quite a long way from the injectors. The injection pressure of about 300 BAR (I think) is created in that pump, and fed to the common rail. There is a lot of fuel between the pump and the injectors.

In a TD5, the fuel pump only circulates the fuel TO the injectors, but a lot of fuel circulates, like gallons a minute. Each injector has a small pushrod on top that is hit by a rocker driven by a cam. The injection pressure of over SIXTEEN HUNDRED BAR is created IN THE INJECTOR BODY. Up to that stage the fuel pressure is only FOUR BAR. There is only a tiny drop of fuel between the fuel supply gallery and the injector tip, so in a TD5 the fuel is refreshed more or less immediately if one runs the priming procedure for a minute or two before trying to start her up.

All very interesting stuff!

Or a complete bore?

CharlesY
 
This int spam, I don't work for the AA, I'm not an AA member, but even their non-member rate is way cheaper than any main dealer rates, and you can leave the vehicle where it is, and don't have to worry about towing it to the main stealers:

News : AA fuel assist - new service for drivers who fill up with the wrong fuel - The AA

What to do if you misfuel

If you put the wrong fuel in your tank, do not turn on the ignition or start the engine as this will circulate the contaminated fuel and increase the risk of damage.

Instead, just call us 24 hours a day seven days a week on 0870 240 3985.*

Our specialist service will:

•drain, flush and replenish your vehicle's fuel system
•ensure the contaminated fuel is recycled through a waste management company
– it can then be used to power kilns and furnaces

We aim to attend any vehicle, providing the Fuel Assist van has enough capacity in its tank.

Prices start at:

•£184 (£160 plus VAT) for AA Members who have been with us for more than one year
•£218.50 (£190 plus VAT) for new AA Members within the first year of Membership
•£264.50 (£230 plus VAT) for non-members
Effects of misfuelling
Damage to the engine can be very expensive for some vehicle owners: manufacturers often recommend change of parts (as high as £5,000+) and garages often charge £300+ for a fuel drain (AA Fuel Assist costs from £160).

How Fuel Assist works
•Cars, vans, lorries, motorcycles, etc are covered.
•Fresh fuel to refill the tank is charged at pump price.
•An appointment system is in place.
•Technicians arrive within an hour, on average.
•The AA is investing around £1.7 million in the service after a one-year trial.
Fuel AssistSM is a registered Service Mark.
 
Optimus Prime said:
This int spam, I don't work for the AA, I'm not an AA member, but even their non-member rate is way cheaper than any main dealer rates, and you can leave the vehicle where it is, and don't have to worry about towing it to the main stealers:

News : AA fuel assist - new service for drivers who fill up with the wrong fuel - The AA

What to do if you misfuel

If you put the wrong fuel in your tank, do not turn on the ignition or start the engine as this will circulate the contaminated fuel and increase the risk of damage.

Instead, just call us 24 hours a day seven days a week on 0870 240 3985.*

Our specialist service will:

•drain, flush and replenish your vehicle's fuel system
•ensure the contaminated fuel is recycled through a waste management company
– it can then be used to power kilns and furnaces

We aim to attend any vehicle, providing the Fuel Assist van has enough capacity in its tank.

Prices start at:

•£184 (£160 plus VAT) for AA Members who have been with us for more than one year
•£218.50 (£190 plus VAT) for new AA Members within the first year of Membership
•£264.50 (£230 plus VAT) for non-members
Effects of misfuelling
Damage to the engine can be very expensive for some vehicle owners: manufacturers often recommend change of parts (as high as £5,000+) and garages often charge £300+ for a fuel drain (AA Fuel Assist costs from £160).

How Fuel Assist works
•Cars, vans, lorries, motorcycles, etc are covered.
•Fresh fuel to refill the tank is charged at pump price.
•An appointment system is in place.
•Technicians arrive within an hour, on average.
•The AA is investing around £1.7 million in the service after a one-year trial.
Fuel AssistSM is a registered Service Mark.
Click to expand...

They use the same vaccuum fuel drain vessels as we do at work.

Just for balance the RAC charge £205.:)
 
Optimus Prime said:
This int spam, I don't work for the AA, I'm not an AA member, but even their non-member rate is way cheaper than any main dealer rates, and you can leave the vehicle where it is, and don't have to worry about towing it to the main stealers:

News : AA fuel assist - new service for drivers who fill up with the wrong fuel - The AA

What to do if you misfuel

If you put the wrong fuel in your tank, do not turn on the ignition or start the engine as this will circulate the contaminated fuel and increase the risk of damage.

Instead, just call us 24 hours a day seven days a week on 0870 240 3985.*

Our specialist service will:

•drain, flush and replenish your vehicle's fuel system
•ensure the contaminated fuel is recycled through a waste management company
– it can then be used to power kilns and furnaces

We aim to attend any vehicle, providing the Fuel Assist van has enough capacity in its tank.

Prices start at:

•£184 (£160 plus VAT) for AA Members who have been with us for more than one year
•£218.50 (£190 plus VAT) for new AA Members within the first year of Membership
•£264.50 (£230 plus VAT) for non-members
Effects of misfuelling
Damage to the engine can be very expensive for some vehicle owners: manufacturers often recommend change of parts (as high as £5,000+) and garages often charge £300+ for a fuel drain (AA Fuel Assist costs from £160).

How Fuel Assist works
•Cars, vans, lorries, motorcycles, etc are covered.
•Fresh fuel to refill the tank is charged at pump price.
•An appointment system is in place.
•Technicians arrive within an hour, on average.
•The AA is investing around £1.7 million in the service after a one-year trial.
Fuel AssistSM is a registered Service Mark.
Click to expand...


What a rip-off! And, note prices START at ... so they are not saying how much they REALLY charge, are they?

And that crap about recycling the fuel to power kilns and furnaces! HA Bloody HA! PETROL INTO A FURNACE! I think not. I bet none of the operatives in this scheme buy a lot of fuel for their own cars. Job for life - free fuel for life too.

But for silly people who have NO IDEA how to fix things, it's a way out of a mess. It's still very expensive though.

CharlesY
 
CharlesY said:
What a rip-off! And, note prices START at ... so they are not saying how much they REALLY charge, are they?

And that crap about recycling the fuel to power kilns and furnaces! HA Bloody HA! PETROL INTO A FURNACE! I think not. I bet none of the operatives in this scheme buy a lot of fuel for their own cars. Job for life - free fuel for life too.

But for silly people who have NO IDEA how to fix things, it's a way out of a mess. It's still very expensive though.

CharlesY
Click to expand...

I do draindowns for most of the breakdown clubs. I don't EVER put contaminated fuel in my vehicles. The odd bit goes in my chainsaw but virtually all of it is taken away in 205L drums.:eek::eek::eek:
 
ratty said:
I do draindowns for most of the breakdown clubs. I don't EVER put contaminated fuel in my vehicles. The odd bit goes in my chainsaw but virtually all of it is taken away in 205L drums.:eek::eek::eek:
Click to expand...

I think it is ILLEGAL to keep PETROL in big drums.

I wonder if they have considered that.

The fuel is not contaminated! It is all just good clean fuels that got a bit MIXED with another fuel.
The trick is to find a use for it that saves paying £1.10 a litre.

CharlesY
 
CharlesY said:
I think it is ILLEGAL to keep PETROL in big drums.

I wonder if they have considered that.

The fuel is not contaminated! It is all just good clean fuels that got a bit MIXED with another fuel.
The trick is to find a use for it that saves paying £1.10 a litre.

CharlesY
Click to expand...

205l drums are the legal way of disposing of the waste fuel. ;)

I've watched guys blow up engines by using the contam. A mate of mine has a Russian Gaz66. That used to run fine on it. Unfortunately he switched the petrol engine for a diesel after the timing cog/pulley decided to strip itself.
 
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