If you lane in the Peaks, some of you may be interested in following this and having a say. 
(sorry if this has already been posted)
https://www.facebook.com/PDGLA
(sorry if this has already been posted)
https://www.facebook.com/PDGLA
Peak District Green Lane Alliance
- Thread starter SteveT247
- Start date
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DIFFLOCK66
Well-Known Member
- Posts
- 3,249
- Location
- Chipping, Lancashire
Ruddy hell! Bit of a closed, blinkered shop that one...
"Limer Rake 04-02-2013, Hollinsclough Staffordshire. Local Farmers, Horserider cannot negotiate this lane because it is so badly rutted by offroading and walkers are having trouble traversing it, danger of broken or sprained ankle. Also nowhere to escape to if confronted by trailbikes or vehicles."
"imer Rake, Hollinsclough, Staffordshire. This old Packhorse Route - centuries old - has been very badly damaged. This lane is so bad the Offoaders cannot manage it. It is so badly rutted and the surface of the lane is so broken that they have to resort to "winching" to get over the worst bits by using a winch which is fixed to a tree or a telegraph pole to pull the vehicles over the obstacles that they are responsible for in the first instance."
Erm I don't think that the massive steps have been caused by vehicles....
"The key aim of the Peak District Green Lanes Alliance is to preserve the character and the environmental conditions in the Peak District not merely pitting one user group's needs against another's. Be advised that the vast majority of people who walk, cycle or ride horses also pay road tax, and they also pay council tax and income tax. Derbyshire tax payers are paying in particular for the huge cost of repairing the damage being done by offroaders who come to the Peak District NP from all over the country and also from abroad. Horses cannot use tracks which are so badly rutted as they can fall into them and cause injury to themselves and their riders. Horse riders are being forced off unsurfaced lanes and onto the tarmac road network. Moreover, a disproportionate share of the costs to repair the damage done by vehicles is being borne by the residents of Derbyshire as the general taxpayers; the road tax paid by each off road vehicle owner using these routes is dwarfed by the damage each user causes. And free speech is a right to be defended, but not the making of slanderous/insulting statements as this can not be tolerated."
"Do not believe the off roaders - con men (and women) all - They would have you believe they that are cuddly and warm, and this they are not. They do not live here - they do not pay the council taxes required to repair the damage they do. You the ordinary resident of Derbyshire and the surrounding counties of the National Park do. They as a general rule do not stay in the Peak District National Park for a week or more as holiday makers do, they come for a day and spend very little here - which of course does not help the rural economy much at all. And of allegedly 70,000 + members they managed to get just 100 represented here on the 4th of August 2013 - hardly a resounding success!"
I take offence at that!
"A wonderful success story, the Peak District National Park Authority have agreed unanimously to place full TRO's (Traffic Regulation Orders) banning trail bikes, MPVs (4x4's), and Quad bikes on the following routes The Roych and Chapel Gate one more at least to follow this will be Long Causeway. We will not rest on our laurels but press for more ASAP. Success breeds success, the process will be continued."
I like the reply:-
"This is not sucess. Success will be when all users make use of these shared resources responsibly. What does more damage - a trail bike or a horse? Which users drop more litter - those with a vehicle to keep it in or those who have to carry it? What about the delay in the emergency services getting to you if a byway is blocked to vehicles (I presume that PDNPA can post a risk assessment for this). Rather than blaming other user groups, let's all pull together and give the authorities evidence of misuse and do whatever else we can to stop it. Could PDNPA also let us know when they arrange user groups to help with maintenance - I've done some great days in Essex which are a good opportunity to talk to other users and put something back."
"Limer Rake 04-02-2013, Hollinsclough Staffordshire. Local Farmers, Horserider cannot negotiate this lane because it is so badly rutted by offroading and walkers are having trouble traversing it, danger of broken or sprained ankle. Also nowhere to escape to if confronted by trailbikes or vehicles."
"imer Rake, Hollinsclough, Staffordshire. This old Packhorse Route - centuries old - has been very badly damaged. This lane is so bad the Offoaders cannot manage it. It is so badly rutted and the surface of the lane is so broken that they have to resort to "winching" to get over the worst bits by using a winch which is fixed to a tree or a telegraph pole to pull the vehicles over the obstacles that they are responsible for in the first instance."
Erm I don't think that the massive steps have been caused by vehicles....
"The key aim of the Peak District Green Lanes Alliance is to preserve the character and the environmental conditions in the Peak District not merely pitting one user group's needs against another's. Be advised that the vast majority of people who walk, cycle or ride horses also pay road tax, and they also pay council tax and income tax. Derbyshire tax payers are paying in particular for the huge cost of repairing the damage being done by offroaders who come to the Peak District NP from all over the country and also from abroad. Horses cannot use tracks which are so badly rutted as they can fall into them and cause injury to themselves and their riders. Horse riders are being forced off unsurfaced lanes and onto the tarmac road network. Moreover, a disproportionate share of the costs to repair the damage done by vehicles is being borne by the residents of Derbyshire as the general taxpayers; the road tax paid by each off road vehicle owner using these routes is dwarfed by the damage each user causes. And free speech is a right to be defended, but not the making of slanderous/insulting statements as this can not be tolerated."
"Do not believe the off roaders - con men (and women) all - They would have you believe they that are cuddly and warm, and this they are not. They do not live here - they do not pay the council taxes required to repair the damage they do. You the ordinary resident of Derbyshire and the surrounding counties of the National Park do. They as a general rule do not stay in the Peak District National Park for a week or more as holiday makers do, they come for a day and spend very little here - which of course does not help the rural economy much at all. And of allegedly 70,000 + members they managed to get just 100 represented here on the 4th of August 2013 - hardly a resounding success!"
I take offence at that!
"A wonderful success story, the Peak District National Park Authority have agreed unanimously to place full TRO's (Traffic Regulation Orders) banning trail bikes, MPVs (4x4's), and Quad bikes on the following routes The Roych and Chapel Gate one more at least to follow this will be Long Causeway. We will not rest on our laurels but press for more ASAP. Success breeds success, the process will be continued."
I like the reply:-
"This is not sucess. Success will be when all users make use of these shared resources responsibly. What does more damage - a trail bike or a horse? Which users drop more litter - those with a vehicle to keep it in or those who have to carry it? What about the delay in the emergency services getting to you if a byway is blocked to vehicles (I presume that PDNPA can post a risk assessment for this). Rather than blaming other user groups, let's all pull together and give the authorities evidence of misuse and do whatever else we can to stop it. Could PDNPA also let us know when they arrange user groups to help with maintenance - I've done some great days in Essex which are a good opportunity to talk to other users and put something back."
Bromsgrove Defender
Well-Known Member
- Posts
- 5,759
- Location
- Out to lunch
Bobblies annoy me intensly
It does not seem to occur to them that there are disabled folk who would love nothing more than to be able to walk in the countryside but have to rely on vehicular transport to enjoy what they take very much for granted.
That's not to say, unfortunately, that they don't have a point when it comes to irresponsible behaviour, though they do seem to miss themselves off the list.
arrogant aerosols :fighting:
It does not seem to occur to them that there are disabled folk who would love nothing more than to be able to walk in the countryside but have to rely on vehicular transport to enjoy what they take very much for granted.
That's not to say, unfortunately, that they don't have a point when it comes to irresponsible behaviour, though they do seem to miss themselves off the list.
arrogant aerosols :fighting:
Last edited:
- Posts
- 14,902
- Location
- Doncaster
Just posted the following on https://www.facebook.com/PDGLA
"I'm surprised to see this page .. There are, according to Visiting: Peak District National Park Authority, 1,867 miles of public rights of way. Does anyone know what proportion of those miles are legal for 4x4's and trailbikes? What percentage are NOT legal for 4x4's and trail Bikes?
If walkers don't like mixing with 4x4's and trailbikes, then why not stick to footpaths? I do when I walk .. Mam Tor to Lose Hill is definitely traffic free .. but it's been paved!!! Why? Erosion from too many walkers ...
What do you think will happen if the drivers and riders lose even more Byways? They then try to squeeze onto fewer and fewer miles of what's left. Far from reducing any issues, TRO's mostly tend to magnify the issues elsewhere.
live and let live ... most of the byways are man-made, they aren't being destroyed at all, they're evolving .. "
It'll be interesting to see if they allow debate or just don't post it ...
"I'm surprised to see this page .. There are, according to Visiting: Peak District National Park Authority, 1,867 miles of public rights of way. Does anyone know what proportion of those miles are legal for 4x4's and trailbikes? What percentage are NOT legal for 4x4's and trail Bikes?
If walkers don't like mixing with 4x4's and trailbikes, then why not stick to footpaths? I do when I walk .. Mam Tor to Lose Hill is definitely traffic free .. but it's been paved!!! Why? Erosion from too many walkers ...
What do you think will happen if the drivers and riders lose even more Byways? They then try to squeeze onto fewer and fewer miles of what's left. Far from reducing any issues, TRO's mostly tend to magnify the issues elsewhere.
live and let live ... most of the byways are man-made, they aren't being destroyed at all, they're evolving .. "
It'll be interesting to see if they allow debate or just don't post it ...
SteNova
Well-Known Member
- Posts
- 2,200
- Location
- N. Wales, LL22
when I did Hollinsclough at night there were walkers on it and they waved us through, personally I wouldn't find it enjoyable to walk and a certainly wouldn't ride my horse up it, I suspect as its so rocky it needs little or no work to keep it maintained
KeepDigging
New Member
- Posts
- 403
- Location
- East Midlands
Need to make it clear how much 4x4 drivers contribute to the local economy.
Hotels, pubs, local shops.
Bobblies won't back down. A lot of the shouting is on ideological grounds (not all walkers, obviously, but the ones that are making the noise) so the proportionality argument is lost.
Need to explain the financial facts of life to the council.
Since I don't lane, I can't help I'm afraid, but cyclists went through a similar thing and the national association did a lot of PR with the tourist industry to make us more acceptable to local authorities, because tourism = cash.
Anyone who does lane in the area: write !
Hotels, pubs, local shops.
Bobblies won't back down. A lot of the shouting is on ideological grounds (not all walkers, obviously, but the ones that are making the noise) so the proportionality argument is lost.
Need to explain the financial facts of life to the council.
Since I don't lane, I can't help I'm afraid, but cyclists went through a similar thing and the national association did a lot of PR with the tourist industry to make us more acceptable to local authorities, because tourism = cash.
Anyone who does lane in the area: write !
Turboman
Mab An Gov
- Posts
- 60,151
- Location
- Lathrowda, Kernow
So sad to see the propaganda that is being spread about this, some of the users seem to think they don't even touch the ground themselves, and have no footprint on the landscape.
I don't know the peaks at all, but in the Westcountry one of the main threats to many byways is simply being grown over. Sunken tracks and lush summer growth mean a track can become impassable to all in just a few years. And vehicles make quite a good job of clearing the vegetation. Many footpaths are kept clear by working parties of ramblers, this is not usually needed on routes with a mix of traffic. So provided the tracks aren't driven in very wet conditions, causing problems for walkers, the interests of all user groups would seem to be served.
I don't know the peaks at all, but in the Westcountry one of the main threats to many byways is simply being grown over. Sunken tracks and lush summer growth mean a track can become impassable to all in just a few years. And vehicles make quite a good job of clearing the vegetation. Many footpaths are kept clear by working parties of ramblers, this is not usually needed on routes with a mix of traffic. So provided the tracks aren't driven in very wet conditions, causing problems for walkers, the interests of all user groups would seem to be served.
OK everyone, please like this PDGLA page, brilliant idea PMSL
https://www.facebook.com/PDGLA99
It already has twice the likes of the real thing
https://www.facebook.com/PDGLA99
It already has twice the likes of the real thing
Wilkshake
New Member
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pocketrocket
Active Member
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- 655
- Location
- sheffield
Its a like from me too! :fencing:
DIFFLOCK66
Well-Known Member
- Posts
- 3,249
- Location
- Chipping, Lancashire
It'd be a like from me too, but I don't do facebook..
