Opinions on MOT - LR garage or not?

On Tue, 10 Aug 2004 23:24:05 +0100, "Andrew Carr"
<[email protected]> wrote:

>I remember I once had a 4wd drive Subaru took it a local fit and forget type
>place and had the tester report that the had brake was non functional. I
>explained that the hand brake worked on the front wheels. Watched then put
>back on the ramp lift it and every 'fitter' came and had a look at the front
>callipers, then back onto the rolling road and I was told that the hand
>brake was now fine.

'Tis the same with the Citroen BX.

--
QrizB

"On second thought, let's not go to Z'Ha'Dum. It is a silly place."

On or around Thu, 12 Aug 2004 07:16:05 GMT, [email protected] (QrizB)
enlightened us thusly:

>On Tue, 10 Aug 2004 23:24:05 +0100, "Andrew Carr"
><[email protected]> wrote:
>
>>I remember I once had a 4wd drive Subaru took it a local fit and forget type
>>place and had the tester report that the had brake was non functional. I
>>explained that the hand brake worked on the front wheels. Watched then put
>>back on the ramp lift it and every 'fitter' came and had a look at the front
>>callipers, then back onto the rolling road and I was told that the hand
>>brake was now fine.
>
>'Tis the same with the Citroen BX.

and they don' half get confused by citroen suspension, if they've not seen
it before.

--
Austin Shackles. www.ddol-las.fsnet.co.uk my opinions are just that
"The great masses of the people ... will more easily fall victims to
a great lie than to a small one" Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
from Mein Kampf, Ch 10

On Wednesday, in article
<[email protected]>
[email protected] wrote:

> On Tue, 10 Aug 2004 23:24:05 +0100, "Andrew Carr"
> <[email protected]> made me spill my meths when he wrote:
>
> >Always be present to give advice to the examiner as he does the test.
>
> You're not wrong there.
>
> Came back to collect the Land Rover from the local test and was told
> they took quarter of an hour to suss out the military NATO light
> switch on the Carawagon, "we knew it worked somehow because you came
> in with the lights on". They gave up on the switch that said 'Infra
> Red', must have thought it was one of those quick tan sun beds in the
> back.

That one doesn't seem to be connected on my Lightweight.



--
David G. Bell -- SF Fan, Filker, and Punslinger.

"History shows that the Singularity started when Sir Tim Berners-Lee
was bitten by a radioactive spider."

Larry vaguely muttered something like ...
> How old does a disco have to be before it leaks ?

Mine's a '96 300 Tdi ..

> You can tell where I park, as I have marked my territory.

Heheheh

--
Paul ...

(8(|) ... Homer Rocks

"A tosser is a tosser, no matter what mode of transport they're using."

EMB vaguely muttered something like ...
> Judith wrote:
>
>> Manuel passed his MOT. I went to the independent garage which does
>> all the MOTs for James Edwards in Chester. You could tell he'd seen a
>> few Land Rovers before, which was reassuring!
>>
>> Although the brakes work, I was advised that all of the discs are
>> corroded/rusty. I had already seen this myself but wasn't quite sure
>> what to do.
>>
>> It looks as if the pads are not pressing equally over the discs. ie
>> there is a part of each disc which is not getting any contact with the
>> pad and, therefore, is going rusty.
>
> Quite possibly siezed pistons and/or caliper slides. Strip &
> disassemble the calipers. Check that the pistons aren't rusty or pitted
> and reassemble with new seals (and pistons if required). Clean any rust
> of the discs with emery cloth (really clean - rust eats brake pads) or
> if the discs are badly scored get them machined or replace them. Put the
> calipers back onto the vehicle with new pads, bed them in gently and
> you're right for another umpteen thousand miles.
>
> Another post mentions pushing the pistons back into the calipers. There
> is only one "right" way to do this and it's absolutely vital on ABS
> vehicles as it stops all the collected crap in the caliper being pushed
> back through the ABS unit and knackering it. Use a brake hose clamp to
> clamp off the flexible hose, open the bleeder, then force the piston
> back (the excess fluid will exit through the bleeder). I generally use
> a large pair of polygrips to force the piston back - if they are tight
> enough to need a g-cramp then they are partially siezed and should be
> pulled apart and repaired as above. Once it's all reassembled give the
> brakes a bleed. Even on non-ABS vehicles this is a good idea as it also
> keeps the crap from being pushed back to the master cylinder where it
> does a good job of wearing out the seals.

Heh, didn't know about that .. mine doesn't have ABS .. '96 300 Tdi, manual
3 door, no electric windows or mirrors or anything 'luxurious

--
Paul ...

(8(|) ... Homer Rocks

"A tosser is a tosser, no matter what mode of transport they're using."

Paul - xxx wrote:

>
> Heh, didn't know about that .. mine doesn't have ABS

One of the benefits of being a (good) mechanic is that you can get along
to training courses, read the trade publications and learn from others
in the industry. Judging by the some of the comments here about the UK
automotive repair industry I should emigrate and set up fixing
Solihull's finest.

--
EMB
change two to number to reply

"Judith" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On Wed, 11 Aug 2004 01:24:07 +0100, Aled <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> >With a Disco, what's the "correct" way of testing the brakes then, and
> >should I need to find a specialised tester?
>
> At the MOT garage I used today, they only have a single axle rolling
> road so they can't test the brakes of 4WD vehicles. The tester did a
> very short road test of the brakes. He said he was checking that the
> ABS light went out, that the vehicle stopped and that there was no
> veering to the side.
>
> I'm not sure why he mentioned ABS. Although I should think that ABS
> is not MOT-able, perhaps the warning light would give indication of
> "something" not being right.
>
> Judith

Unfortunately ABS is MOT-able or at least the warning light is
it must illuminate then extinguish at the correct time so no
taking the bulb out
I have tested most 4x4's on a single axle brake tester the only
problem I have encountered is with Freelanders if you check
for imbalance on the front so both rollers are turning it locks
the viscous coupling and climbs out of the rollers


Andy
--
SWB Series 2a ( dressed as a 3) "Bruce"
It's big it's mean it's really really green

On Fri, 13 Aug 2004 06:20:22 +0100, "Paul - xxx"
<[email protected]> wrote:

>Mine's a '96 300 Tdi ..
>

And mine is a 97 300 Tdi (so somewehere between 7 and 8 years old
seems to be right for dripping)

The rear diff seems to be seeping, too. I'm not sure where - it looks
like it's coming from around what looks like sealing compound holding
the two halves of the diff together. It's nothing major ....... it
cleaned up nicely with a bit of kitchen roll!

Judith

On Fri, 13 Aug 2004 17:33:13 +1200, EMB <[email protected]> wrote:

>Paul - xxx wrote:
>
>>
>> Heh, didn't know about that .. mine doesn't have ABS
>
>One of the benefits of being a (good) mechanic is that you can get along
>to training courses, read the trade publications and learn from others
>in the industry. Judging by the some of the comments here about the UK
>automotive repair industry I should emigrate and set up fixing
>Solihull's finest.

Really good mechanics (as opposed to uniformed fitters) are very
difficult to find. And when you do find one, there's always some git
with a purple 101 who's got him booked until 2007.




--

Tim Hobbs

'58 Series 2 88" aka "Stig"
'77 101FC Ambulance aka "Burrt"
'95 Discovery V8i aka "The Disco" (FOR SALE)
'03 Volvo V70

My Landies? http://www.seriesii.co.uk
Barcoding? http://www.bartec-systems.com
Tony Luckwill web archive at http://www.luckwill.com

On or around Fri, 13 Aug 2004 07:16:17 +0100, "Andy.Smalley"
<[email protected]> enlightened us thusly:

>I have tested most 4x4's on a single axle brake tester the only
>problem I have encountered is with Freelanders if you check
>for imbalance on the front so both rollers are turning it locks
>the viscous coupling and climbs out of the rollers

all mine have been too. I dunno if the viscous coupling in the middle of
the RR with the BW transfer box would lock. But in general, the only 4x4
you have a problem with is one with an LSD.

having said that, the 4x4 ford has been tested on a 2-axle rig and that has
a viscous centre diff, too.

--
Austin Shackles. www.ddol-las.fsnet.co.uk my opinions are just that
"Nessun maggior dolore che ricordarsi del tempo felice nella miseria"
- Dante Alighieri (1265 - 1321) from Divina Commedia 'Inferno'

On or around Thu, 12 Aug 2004 16:06:16 +0100, Judith
<[email protected]> enlightened us thusly:

>Although the brakes work, I was advised that all of the discs are
>corroded/rusty. I had already seen this myself but wasn't quite sure
>what to do.

Use 'em. the more you use 'em, the cleaner they get.

having said that...

check the disc thickness. they should be something around 13mm, if they're
less than about 11mm you may as well replace them anyway, as they're not
expensive from Paddock et al.

same applies if the discs are very pitted. surface red rust on an
otherwise-smooth disc happens within days if the vehicle is standing and is
of no consequence and will disappear after a journey of 20 miles or so,
provided you use the brakes.

If the pads are noticeably worn (less than about 3-4mm left) then change
them at the same time.


--
Austin Shackles. www.ddol-las.fsnet.co.uk my opinions are just that
"The breezy call of incense-breathing Morn, The swallow twittering
from the strawbuilt shed, The cock's shrill clarion, or the echoing
horn, No more shall rouse them from their lowly bed."
Thomas Gray, Elegy Written in a Country Churchyard.

On or around Fri, 13 Aug 2004 01:53:25 +0100, "Larry" <[email protected]>
enlightened us thusly:

>One of the reasons I drive a series is that I don't have to worry about all
>that ABS stuff. I don't feel any the less secure without it, though I
>wouldn't mind a set of discs.

most discos don't have ABS either... but the 4-pot caliper discs on the
front of the disco/RR/110 are seriously good stoppers.

--
Austin Shackles. www.ddol-las.fsnet.co.uk my opinions are just that
"The breezy call of incense-breathing Morn, The swallow twittering
from the strawbuilt shed, The cock's shrill clarion, or the echoing
horn, No more shall rouse them from their lowly bed."
Thomas Gray, Elegy Written in a Country Churchyard.

On Fri, 13 Aug 2004 10:09:53 +0100, Austin Shackles
<[email protected]> wrote:

>On or around Fri, 13 Aug 2004 01:53:25 +0100, "Larry" <[email protected]>
>enlightened us thusly:
>
>>One of the reasons I drive a series is that I don't have to worry about all
>>that ABS stuff. I don't feel any the less secure without it, though I
>>wouldn't mind a set of discs.
>
>most discos don't have ABS either... but the 4-pot caliper discs on the
>front of the disco/RR/110 are seriously good stoppers.

True, but the whole system does 'go off' with age. Mine got to the
point where they would hardly lock the front wheels in the dry.

New fluid, hoses and better pads made a world of difference. I'd
strongly recommend new fluid and hoses to anyone with a vague pedal -
they don't have to be like that.
--

Tim Hobbs

'58 Series 2 88" aka "Stig"
'77 101FC Ambulance aka "Burrt"
'95 Discovery V8i aka "The Disco" (FOR SALE)
'03 Volvo V70

My Landies? http://www.seriesii.co.uk
Barcoding? http://www.bartec-systems.com
Tony Luckwill web archive at http://www.luckwill.com

Judith vaguely muttered something like ...
> On Fri, 13 Aug 2004 06:20:22 +0100, "Paul - xxx"
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> Mine's a '96 300 Tdi ..
>>
>
> And mine is a 97 300 Tdi (so somewehere between 7 and 8 years old
> seems to be right for dripping)

Yeah .. I dunno why, but we used to think ours was a '97, maybe the P plate
... Actually, just looked through documents and I've just found out why
... It was first actually registered on 2/8/96 on the V5, but the first
keeper and only other owner, first acquired it on 7/3/97 .. so it sat on the
dealer forecourt for a few months before 'living' ... Which we know it did
as first owner said it came to him with only 6 miles on the clock ...

> The rear diff seems to be seeping, too. I'm not sure where - it looks
> like it's coming from around what looks like sealing compound holding
> the two halves of the diff together. It's nothing major ....... it
> cleaned up nicely with a bit of kitchen roll!

<smug mode> Everywhere's nice and dry on mine. </smug mode>

We got it last September with 55k on the clock, it's now got 72k on and had
absolutely no problems that weren't self-inflicted .. Like the 31" tyres
scuffing and bending the rear wheel arch, and me tearing off the rear bumper
end caps etc when off-roading. Nothing that can't be fixed with just baling
wire, gaffer tape and a hammer .. so just like my old S3 then ..


--
Paul ...

(8(|) ... Homer Rocks

"A tosser is a tosser, no matter what mode of transport they're using."

On or around Tue, 10 Aug 2004 18:32:11 +0100, "Larry" <[email protected]>
enlightened us thusly:

>As to things like windscreen washers, it depends on whether they feel like
>working or not, and exhausts blowing should be something between you and
>your neighbours. (mind you I have just fixed mine properly at last)

if the 'zorst blows CO into the cabin, and you could pass out while driving
it, with possibly fatal results.

--
Austin Shackles. www.ddol-las.fsnet.co.uk my opinions are just that
Soon shall thy arm, unconquered steam! afar Drag the slow barge, or
drive the rapid car; Or on wide-waving wings expanded bear the
flying chariot through the field of air.- Erasmus Darwin (1731-1802)

On Thursday, in article
<[email protected]>
[email protected] wrote:

> On Thu, 12 Aug 2004 15:02:48 +0100 (BST), [email protected]
> ("David G. Bell") made me spill my meths when he wrote:
>
> >They gave up on the switch that said 'Infra
> >> Red', must have thought it was one of those quick tan sun beds in the
> >> back.
> >
> >That one doesn't seem to be connected on my Lightweight.
>
> It wasn't on the Carawagon either but still had to shout "bang" when
> they flicked it.

But it works. When it is in the 'on' position the headlamps will emit
infra-red light.

--
David G. Bell -- SF Fan, Filker, and Punslinger.

"History shows that the Singularity started when Sir Tim Berners-Lee
was bitten by a radioactive spider."

On Thursday, in article
<[email protected]>
[email protected] "Judith" wrote:

> On Fri, 13 Aug 2004 09:06:21 +1200, EMB <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>
>
> <snip useful info>
>
> > There
> >is only one "right" way to do this and it's absolutely vital on ABS
> >vehicles as it stops all the collected crap in the caliper being pushed
> >back through the ABS unit and knackering it.
>
>
> Oo-eck! I forgot about ABS. It looks like I'm going to learn a lot
> from this job!
>
> Thanks for the advice everyone.

What brake fluid costs, and how much the vehicle needs, it can be
worthwhile doing a near-total change. It does gradually 'age'. This
can be a tedious job, and sometimes needs a non-obvious procedure, but
is worthwhile if you're changing pads or doing other work.

--
David G. Bell -- SF Fan, Filker, and Punslinger.

"History shows that the Singularity started when Sir Tim Berners-Lee
was bitten by a radioactive spider."

On Thu, 12 Aug 2004 16:50:38 +0100, "Paul - xxx"
<[email protected]> wrote:

>Have fun .. they're easier to do than S3 brakes ...

Thanks, Paul, for the detailed reply.

Next time it stops raining, unless I can think of another excuse, I'm
going to try to get the wheels off but (as discussed in a previous
thread up there ^) I'm expecting to have to take it to a tyre fitter
and ask them to correctly torque the wheelnuts.

[Although I've had the Disco for a couple of years, I've used garages
for most of the work that the vehicle has needed. I've lost the knack
of working on Land Rovers.... although I did spend a couple of hours
last week tracking down the Disco's first oil leak! It's leaking
where the oil cooler pipe comes out of the oil filter. I was
*astounded* when I noticed a drop of oil underneath ..... I've got so
used to having a clean drive!]

Judith

In message <[email protected]>, Judith
<[email protected]> writes
>Hello
>
>Manuel (my 300 Tdi Disco) is due his MOT test soon and I was wondering
>where to take him.
>
>My local LR franchise doesn't have their own tester and they take all
>their MOTs round the corner to an independent. Most of my local
>garages won't get many Land Rovers passing through.
>
>So, do you think I am better taking it to a garage that gets a load of
>Landies, so should know about common failure/safety points, or should
>I just take it to the local bloke on the basis that an MOT *should* be
>an MOT!
>
>In the past (when I had Series Landies) I always regarded the MOT as
>just a legal thing that you had to have. *I* am solely responsible
>for the safety of my vehicle. I've had things pass that were, shall
>we say, on the borderline.
>
>Judith
Personally I'd take mine to someone who knows Landies and knows what to
expect. Just my opinion. What you want is an honest assessment of your
vehicle, passed if it meets the legal requirements and advised on things
which are marginal or not covered by the MOT.
--
hugh
Reply to address is valid at the time of posting

I can punch out the glass can't I or stick my head out the window, landie
drivers need to be ingenios,

Worse things have happened on the motorway, I have had gearboxes catch fire
twice (not on a landie)

As for carbon monoxide poisoning, it is not exactly like I am hermetically
sealed into the cab is it ?

The fact that the washers may work during an MOT test does not guarantee
they will ever after and sods law dictates that they won't when you most
need them.




"Andy.Smalley" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
>
>
> So your driving down the motorway your windscreen gets covered in crap
> you turn your wipers on and it smears across the screen so you can't
> see out of it but your washers don't work cos there not a safety item
>
> or
>
> your driving down the motorway exhaust blowing being in a Land Rover
> that's air tight ;-) you start to nod off due to carbon monoxide poisoning
> but you'll be ok cos it's not a safety item
>
> I agree some items are not safety related but most are
>
> As for taking it to an independent garage all MOT's should be the same
> having said that not all testers are aware of Land Rover quirks
> If your not happy with any item it's failed on ask to see the manual
> they have to show you what it says
>
> Andy
> MOT tester (unfortunately)
> --
> SWB Series 2a ( dressed as a 3) "Bruce"
> It's big it's mean it's really really green
>
>