Normal or not?

Hi Paul & all,

Thanks for the update. So looking at it logically, it was either faulty (but test says not so unlikely), you fixed sommat else when removing and replacing (e.g. prop bolts were loose) but you'd have noticed when removed, or.........more likely either the diff and / or IRD are worn and when the vehicle is on full lock the transmission is at max stress as all wheels are trying to turn at different speeds. The noise may just be wear in either component and a new VCU reduces the load. If this is the case then the problem should return after a few thousand miles when the new VCU starts to tighten a bit.

Any other ideas?? I rechecked my VCU and it reads the same with a torque wrench as it did when new (10k miles ago). I am concerned that Bell were worried about a hot IRD as mine is always hot as it appears to get heat from the engine via conduction. Maybe a new thread - How Hot is your IRD?!?!?! Seriously, what do others experience after a relatively short run, I can't bear my hand on mine. Checked oil in IRD and all good. Incidentally Paul, why did you replace VCU in first place? Was it same tight turn problem? Thanks Andrew (off to Bell in August me thinks:scratching_chin

Hi Andy,
Well I wonder if the worn CV joint is having an affect? The Drive seal needs replacing on the same side as its leaking. Whether this sets up a vibration that transmits through the drive train? My IRD got so hot that Ken burnt his hand on it, hence I changed the oil in case there was some problem with that. There is a cooler in the VCU which is connected to the cooling system in the rest of the car, perhaps mine is blocked and is not cooling the IRD? A job for another day as it looks a right SOB to get at.
Will report back if anything changes, next job inner CV joint and drive seal.

Why did I change the VCU? Well being a noob and reading horror stories of transmission parts failing left right and centre I thought I'd get it replaced. The car had done 90,000 with no record of having a replacement. When Austen tested it, it wasn't great so we changed it.

Best Wishes,
P

If the vcu was replaced and the fault gone, then logically that's the cause? What else have you also changed just before the fault disappeared? New bearing on the replacement vcu? Were the props loose?

Well that's the thing.. as soon as the prop was dropped the noise went away completely.

Now the prop is back on with a new VCU there is no recurrence of the vibration, so as you say "logic" says it must have been the something around VCU or bearings. But if the hanging weight test was ok what else could it have been?

The prop shaft was on tight, all the bolts were tight. I've changed nothing on the car since the prop was removed and put back on.

The acid test will be next Friday when I do a long drive up to London and back, a good 250 mile round trip but since I've already rattled down the M5 for 70miles on Thursday evening with no re-occurence of the vibration whatsoever I am hopeful of a completely eventless journey.

As mentioned. Bell are scratching their heads over this one. Ken and Austen have made some recommendations e.g. the inner CV joint, IRD fluid change, check IRD cooler and change of auto box fluid. The IRD fluid I did on Friday, the rest I will get done in the next couple of weeks.

Every problem has a root cause, however it seems in the case of the Freelander... "It defies all logic Captain"

All good stuff. It would be great to solve this problem with the experience on this site.

My only thought is that if the diff and / or IRD are worn (and at 90k they must be as is mine - same mileage) then without the prop and VCU there is no load on worn parts. With it (and a new VCU) there is no noise, but a slightly tighter, but still perfectly o.k VCU can put load on enough to get the noise br br br when on tight lock.

Can anyone comment on the very hot IRD? Mine is too hot to touch, but I assumed that was heat from the engine, I see a cooler is fitted, no idea how to test it. Anyone else comment on IRD temperature please? Paul - is yours running cooler with new oil please?

I measured mine a while ago:

Hippo said:

Went on a 140 mile trip today. Took loads of measurements at different intervals. These are the results of my trip. 2001 v6 with new Pirelli Scorpion STR 215R65/16 98H tyres. Short story is:

120 miles at 60mph + 20miles mixed speed of 30/40/50mph (some at beginning, middle and end of trip).

8 = ambient temp
10 = average road temp
22 = max rear tyre temp
23 = max front tyre temp
41 = max vcu temp (measured circumference side of vcu) (7.8 at start)
46 = max rear diff temp (measured underside outer case) (7.8 at start)
75 = max ird temp (measured ird filler plug)

All values in degrees. I got 28mpg.

Click to expand...

some more values from others on the same fred: http://www.landyzone.co.uk/lz/f9/vcu-life-201233-7.html

Hi Andy,

Well I can touch the IRD without leaving my skin on it, but I wouldn't like to hold it for more that a second. Speaking with Ken on Thursday, he said that he'd come across some blocked IRD coolers. But they are sod to get at. I guess the only way to clear these coolers is to trace the hoses back to the main cooling system and give 'em a good blow through. Trick is finding where they attach first.

Lordy... Do you get bolognese with that

No, just coolant if your lucky. Circle near the middle is the ird cooler connection.

OK... quick sit rep.

Changed IRD fluid, new drive shaft oil seal, replaced auto transmission fluid. Going really nicely, better now the fluids have been changed. No re-occurence of the br br br br br noise yet, even after a 200 mile round trip to the smoke and back. Most odd.

Thanks for update, I'm off to Bell on 5th Sept for a bit of a look see. Will close loop when fault known.

Cool. At least Austen and Ken will at least experience the fault first hand. I must admit I was a tad embarrassed when they put the prop back on (with a new VCU) and nothing happened.

Andy, How did you get on at Bell Engineering? Did they solve the problem?

Hi,

So - to recap and to close the loop on this problem (for others).
TD4 - refurb Bell VCU fitted and all quiet for around 5k miles. Then a brrr .....brrrrr when on full lock going forwards only.

Also, noticed an increased rumble at speed in the mid transmission area. I suspected a prop bearing or VCU, but it passes the wheel up test.

So - Bell asked to see it again and I took it up on 5th Sept. Austin and Ken (good guys !) took it for a drive and we all had an interesting debate but VCU wasn't first suspect. That is, until Austin got underneath and started to remove it. He found that the rubber surround on one bearing was very loose and allowing the prop to run off centre.

VCU removed and tested o.k as thought.

Bell kindly replaced the VCU and both prop bearings f.o.c and we road tested the vehicle with all fingers crossed.

SORTED !!!

So - all quiet and Bell have now added to their experience of a unit on the car (as many they see are off the car). Noise level inside car measured at gear lever is now 80dB compared to 86dB before the change. That's with the radio off !!!

The noise appeared to be the prop off centre and then a groan and release when the auto box disconnected at low speed. This may be masked on a manual as you would depress the clutch much earlier.

If Bell wish to correct my limited understanding please feel free to do so.

Thanks to Bell and recommended to all Freelander owners as being honest, experienced and not just interested in selling you stuff. The after sales support was excellent with no quibble and time invested freely.

Regards,

Andrew

Nice one Andy,
I can only assume that the same issue befell my VCU. Coz when Bell put a new replacement VCU in with my propshaft the symptoms never re-occurred.
Austen and Ken really know their stuff and their good lads too.

Very pleased you got your car sorted Andy.

Cheers,
P

Glad the 2 cars are sorted. I'd just like to clarify that both VCU's were perfect, and the fault was due to the carrier bearings, we just changed the VCU as we had prepared them with new bearings prior to the customers arriving. The itema were replaced FOC as was our time as we value our customers and our reputation

austen said:

Glad the 2 cars are sorted. I'd just like to clarify that both VCU's were perfect, and the fault was due to the carrier bearings, we just changed the VCU as we had prepared them with new bearings prior to the customers arriving. The itema were replaced FOC as was our time as we value our customers and our reputation

Click to expand...

at one end you get Bell (the best) and then you get freelander spares need I say more Bell are worth the extra because they go the extra ,and that is what I have just read on here

Interesting story and I fully agree about Bell's professionalism

I'm looking forwards to meeting Austen tomorrow evening and having my VCU replaced.

Mike