LT77/LT230 - checking the spline wear.

Dudes and Duddesses

I have an occasional clunk from under the wagon, it happens in the first couple of gears, but not reverse. It happens when i come off the clutch and accelerate briskly. I can change gear without it happening, by being careful and by delaying by a fraction of a second before accelerating. I dont get any other kinds of noises, it selects all gears fine but occasionally i will select reverse when i mean to select first, no clutch slip etc.

My A frame bush is good, my props are ok as far as i can tell, my engine/gearbox and other bushes are not perfect but not shagged either. Diffs seem ok.

I am wondering if it is halfshafts or gearbox/tbox splines.

I have had a search on here and loads of threads suggest removing the PTO cover and pulling out the gears to check the wear.

Is it really that easy to do?

Will i need PTO gasket or to drain the Tbox etc? I was wondering about having a look tonight after work but havent ordered any bits etc.

Can someone give a rough breakdown of what i need to do to check it?

Halfshafts i am fine with, but that can wait till i have some axle oil.

Cheers

Ed

p.s is a 2.5NA with LT77 and LT230 with mil ratios. Recon box fitted in 2003.

huh this is interesting.

Geoffrey Miller's website

Will have a look under the PTo cover and then decide what i need to do.

Anyone heard of that oil feed plate mod? Worth doing?

also on a side note would it be worth changing the oil in the Tbox, i cant think taht that would cause a clunk though

Ed

Sorry if this is a stupid question, but have you checked oil levels in the transfer and gearboxes?

If you are going to play about and dismantle the box, it would be worthwhile changing the fluid at the same time.

You shouldn't need to new PTO gasket, the old one should be ok but if in doubt, use a bit of rtv sealant when you reassemble it.

not a stupid question,

did the oil about 3 months ago, will check again tonight. I have fluid so might aswell renew it see if it makes a difference.

ATF in main box and ep80/90 in xfer right? Thats what i have done before

If you remove the outer bearing carrier in order to extract the input gear for inspection then make sure it goes back with a gasket if it had one fitted. The thickness of this gasket is taken into account when setting the preload on the input gear bearings so if you remove it and replace it with just sealant for example you will over-load the bearings. It needs to have a gasket, be it the old one re-used or a new one. Later models that just use sealant instead will have their preload set up with this in mind, so don't go adding a gasket in that instance as you will end up with slightly loose bearings. Basically just make sure it goes back as it was!

If you are just taking the cover plate off (which is all you need to do to inspect the spline wear) then you don't need to worry about this. So I'd recommend that, you can check the wear by turning the handbrake drum and seeing if there's play between the shaft and the input gear.

Nice thanks will have bash over the weekend and bung some photos in this thread as a how to I guess.

Will change the oil anywy I think, won't hurt.

Thanks

Ed

ok guys whipped the PTO cover off tonight to check wear in the gearbox/transfer box splines, not sure how to withdraw the shaft but this is what i saw, would appreciate opinions.

Initial view


after cleaning some gunk out


Video of the slack, i took this by rotating the propshaft as much as i could by hand with the handbrake off
LT230 transfer box slack - YouTube

Opinions please!

Ed

just pull it out looks a tadge dry not a cross drilled gear by the looks of it, vid shows some wear

Well there's some slack there for sure. If you want to see how much jack a rear wheel up so the rear prop will turn some more, just chock some of the others first!

The red "paste", mixture of oil and bits of metal, is usually a sign of wear.

Ok is it worth getting an oil feed plate for it then to slow down the wear? Or a x-drilled gear? Is that an extreme amount of slack or a small bit? Sorry I have no frame of reference!

Or is bad enough that it needs sorting now? I can't afford a new gear/transfer box at the moment, and it's only my weekend toy. Perhaps if I drive it gently!

i have some oil feed plates but you need to cut thread off the shaft for it to fit , fixing properly entails new input gear ftc5089 (fit bearings and fit in box )and new mainshaft ,but to fit m/s you need total strip of box

There's certainly some slack there. Is it possible to slide the outer component off and check just how much spline you've got left? From this angle it looks like there's still plenty of meat there but it's hard to tell just how badly stepped or hooked they've become. Maybe the easiest option is to put up with it until it becomes worth thinking about getting a whole exchange unit.

Ok cheers chaps, will take it apart again later and pull the lot out and have another look, if it's partially work I think I will get an oil feed plate/cross drilled shaft to give me more time, if it's bad I will start saving!!

It only clinks of I drive it in an in-mechanically sympathetic way. I.e use the clutch like a on/off switch rather than progressively

Cheers

Ed

flat said:

ATF in main box and ep80/90 in xfer right? Thats what i have done before

Click to expand...

Yes that's correct

With regards to the rtv sealant comment, i meant for the rear inspection cover, not for the outer bearing cover

ok guys dropped all the oil out the gearbox and transfer box and pulled the tranfer box shaft out via the PTO access panel.

Here is what I found.... opinions please, I dont think its to bad though!

generally not bad


Transfer box inner splines - some wear here


Gearbox output shaft splines, not sure on wear here, maybe less than the transfer box splines??




And this was my gearbox main drain plug


Would appreciate your comments/opinions on the wear to the splines (inner and out). I have ordered an oil feed plate from Ashcroft transmission, and have also sent them some photos for them to look at.

Ashcroft tell me it isnt possible to cross drill the transfer box shaft at home, but I was wondering if any of you had and if so how?

Cheers

Ed

Following this closely, got a simular problem.

general consensus from ashcroft is that there is some wear but it is minimal, they said fitting the oil feed plate will stop it wearing any further.

I am also going to fit the cross drilled but as someone has offered me a good used one so i might as well.

Will up date as soon as i get the parts, will write it up as a how to if it helps anyone else

flat said:

ok guys dropped all the oil out the gearbox and transfer box and pulled the tranfer box shaft out via the PTO access panel.

Here is what I found.... opinions please, I dont think its to bad though!

generally not bad


Transfer box inner splines - some wear here


Gearbox output shaft splines, not sure on wear here, maybe less than the transfer box splines??




And this was my gearbox main drain plug


Would appreciate your comments/opinions on the wear to the splines (inner and out). I have ordered an oil feed plate from Ashcroft transmission, and have also sent them some photos for them to look at.

Ashcroft tell me it isnt possible to cross drill the transfer box shaft at home, but I was wondering if any of you had and if so how?

Cheers

Ed

Click to expand...

theres little wear ,gears are very hard ,filings on plug are normal if its not had oil changed in a while ,could have let you have a plate i have a good few

Quick question.

If I fitted a good secondhand cross drilled item, what would I do about the bearing preload?

Will the replacement item just slot in and the preload be more or less the same or is it a bit of a ball ache to sort out?

On my old 90 I had to replace the PTO bearings as they had collapsed due to running dry. Instead of buying a cross drilled gear I just drilled the old one myself! You'll need a Rockwell drill bit or similar to get through it though. Cured the problem a treat. I now have the same to do on my 110 although the problem isn't that bad. I've just changed my front output bearing as that had collapsed and was clunking badly!