is the front bumper man enough

is the standard front bumper strong enough to fit a small winch (2ton) and a tow ball that i want to use to launch recover a small boat (680kg inc trailer)?
or will i need to modify it? if so whats the best way to do this, keeping it looking as standard as poss?

Don't know about the winch, but I have always fitted a front towball on every Landy I've had for launching and recovering an all-up weight of 2-3 tons boat and trailer.

The towball is mounted on the bumper as near as possible to the chassis.

What type of winch are you looking at? Is it one which will use the PTO?

Obviously, it all depends on the condition of your existing steelwork!

its an electric one (champion esp4500) i had on the back of my old citreon, i removed it when i scrapped the car and its sat in the garage "spare" for a while.

what i want to avoid is getting the landy wet, i had an old sj that i used to reverse in the drink till water came in the doors and then drive the boat off the trailer. within two years it was rotten, the landys a bit to good to abuse like that.

the chassis is solid, i recently wire brushed, sanded, painted and wax oiled it, i couldnt believe the condition it was in, it looked new.

I'm not familiar with that model of winch. However, depending on the fixings, it should be OK to mount it on the bumper at the end of the chassis leg.

That will transfer all the pull directly onto the bumper mounting bolts and not onto the weaker part in between the chassis legs.

Towball on the passenger side with winch on the drivers side and you should have the best of both worlds.

My winch is mounted on a piece of angle that's fixed between the chassis leg bolts and direct to the bumper, 5 ton winch that's worked hard and not pulled the front off........yet

Just saw this. Was considering getting a simple angled plate I have seen. 5 ton winch on. I like the look of the classic bumper

Front bumper is more than man en0ugh for what you want as long as its not rusty. We always run 12.9 bolts for attaching bumpers but anything above 8.8 is fine.

Std mounts for many comps below is last years nationals not sure who the team were but they werre fun to watch!

They take some abuse:

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jhfq-p0l5d0&feature=related]Team Recovery 2011 - YouTube[/ame]

Jai,

If you look at that video again, the tow hooks aren't mounted to the bumper at all, they're on a box steel section between the chassis rails.

Winch between the bumper is fine as long as it's on a plate mounted to the chassis. Don't rely on the bumper alone it's not that strong.

Completely going away from the question didnt relise that was on utube i am in the picture

Spyderman said:

Jai,

If you look at that video again, the tow hooks aren't mounted to the bumper at all, they're on a box steel section between the chassis rails.

Winch between the bumper is fine as long as it's on a plate mounted to the chassis. Don't rely on the bumper alone it's not that strong.

Click to expand...

They are mounted on box However a tow ball is fine mounted on a decent bumper (not rusty) worth using std spreader plates. Your not towing the titanic and the little winch you intend on using will fail before the bumper. Would advise using a sheet of steel as a spreader for the winch but if its only rated at 600Kgs it need only be 3 mm or 4mm thick.

The video shows strengthened biots however you can use a std ball with spreader plates mounted for the same event and its deemed safe enough.

Matthem I was standing where the competitors entered the team recovery arena belolw the big mound twas good to watch!! Hopefully next year I'll be taking part pending lotsa work on my mota and finding a similar sized motor to team up with!

B.19. RECOVERY POINTS.
B.19.1. Adequate front and rear recovery attachments must be provided for recovery purposes in all events. Bumpers, tie-down rings, lifting rings or Range Rover / Discovery "tow fittings" are not adequate. Factory specification (or better) trailer hitches are acceptable. If a tow-ball is fitted, welding alone is insufficient - high tensile nuts and bolts must be used for attachment. If the recovery point is attached to a bumper, the bumper must be attached to the chassis with high tensile nuts and bolts. A clevis and pin fitting or pair of Land Rover chassis-shackles (not spring shackles) are recommended.

ALRC Regs although not gospel worth a think

i got just the verry thing to make a front bumper out of 8"x3" industrial channel iron with a 5/8" thickness ( butt ugly and bloody bomb proof )

My original series bumper was a lot stronger than the bumper i currently have - off a 2007 defender!

My winch is on a winch plate thing which bolts to both chassis arms so doesn't rely on the strength of the bumper. I also mounted two eye bolts on the bumper, but, these are bending the bumper now so i need to weld some plates in behind to strengthen it! Still, recovered off them plenty of times and they are still holding at present.

Bump said:

My original series bumper was a lot stronger than the bumper i currently have - off a 2007 defender!

My winch is on a winch plate thing which bolts to both chassis arms so doesn't rely on the strength of the bumper. I also mounted two eye bolts on the bumper, but, these are bending the bumper now so i need to weld some plates in behind to strengthen it! Still, recovered off them plenty of times and they are still holding at present.

Click to expand...

Does a defender one bolt straight on? A winch is on my shopping list, there's plenty of winch bumpers available for defenders second hand, but I've not seen many series ones...

Ws_4x4 near glos make to spec. They are on ebay.

Brilliant - cheers for that

=jon= said:

Does a defender one bolt straight on? A winch is on my shopping list, there's plenty of winch bumpers available for defenders second hand, but I've not seen many series ones...

Click to expand...

Yes.

Though i had to remove the rubber corner pieces... only cus my landy is all a bit bent and the wing got in the way on one side... but a Series bumper is the same as a defender one. I've also got a defender winch tray on it too.

Thanks again. Had a look at some of the links posted, and it seems like S3 bits aren't so rare after all..

Any recommendations on a good, cheap winch, to be used for hauling myself/ recovering around P&P sites, that kind of thing? If it's just for occasional (not competition) use, is the standard battery and charging system man enough?

If it's just for occasional use you should be ok with the standard alternator. Battery depends on what size it is currently. If it is 100Ah you'll be ok with it. You can always upgrade in the future if needed, but, for occasional use you should be ok.

I'd just get a cheap one off ebay. For what you need it is silly to spend loads on a ott winch. The 9500lb ones should be ok, but, you could always get a 12000lb if your feeling keen.

I went with a Winchmax one (http://www.winchmax.co.uk/acatalog/Winches.html) but they've stopped doing the 9500lb ones now.

Something like this might do?

Recovery Winch - 12000lb, 12v - FREE Wireless Remote | eBay

Though, if you can afford it get a rope rather than wire with it.