IRD… problem?

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c_figliola

c_figliola

Member
Posts
50
Location
Luton
Hi everyone. Had my gearbox and IRD oils changed today. Half because I needed them done and the other half because I got a whine every now and again. They told me IRD probably had never been done before. Was very filthy and had metals in it. Basically he told me to replace for a new IRD… Didn’t hear any whining on the way home and felt smoother. Opinions?
 
c_figliola said:
Was very filthy and had metals in it.
Click to expand...
It kinda depends on what sort of metallic particles are in it really.
If it's just some fine, dark colour metallic "fuzz" on the magnetic drain plug, then it's of no real importance.

However if the oil is grey in colour, or has a metallic sheen, then the IRD is in need of a rebuild.
All the bearings are available, and it's not that difficult to do. However before embarking on an IRD rebuild, you need to check the rear output crown wheel and pinion of wear and damage, as if those are work, a rebuild isn't really worth doing, so a reconditioned unit will be required.
 
Thanks for your reply. I didn’t see the oil unfortunately… I may call back and ask how excessive it was.

the VCU seized last year. I took it off immediately drove around on 2WD for a few months whilst I sourced a replacement recon. New one has been on since early last year.
Got a whine towards the end of 3rd and 4th gear. Don’t know when oils were done so I got them sorted hopefully fixing the problem and then got told my IRD has gone… they told me to buy a brand new one from LR direct ha…

Is there anything I can check from under the car that isn’t too intrusive? I’m not the biggest hands on person however I have done some bits myself to that car.
Thanks
 
Also all tyres were replaced just before I got it in November 2019. All new.
Don’t seem to be any uneven wear on them either.
 
c_figliola said:
then got told my IRD has gone… they told me to buy a brand new one from LR direct ha…
Click to expand...

Absolutely no need to do that. The IRD is an easy unit to replace the bearings in, and any "proper" mechanic or experienced DIYer could it.

If DIY isn't an option, then Bell Engineering can supply a quality reconditioned IRD, for much less than the new LR price. ;)
 
Nodge68 said:
Absolutely no need to do that. The IRD is an easy unit to replace the bearings in, and any "proper" mechanic or experienced DIYer could it.

If DIY isn't an option, then Bell Engineering can supply a quality reconditioned IRD, for much less than the new LR price. ;)
Click to expand...

So I just spoke to the garage and the said the oil itself was metallic not just filings. /:
So what do you think I should do here. Wait. Get a second hand or recon… I am very worried now
 
They may not have cleaned it thoroughly when it was manufactured and I would expect a certain amount of wear. If it sounds and works ok save your money. Worst case you have to replace it in the future.
 
c_figliola said:
So I just spoke to the garage and the said the oil itself was metallic not just filings.
Click to expand...

Metallic oil isn't a good sign, however it could soldier on for a long time yet, as you've changed the VCU and it has matching tyres, which reduces the loading the IRD has to take.
The metal in the oil comes from the crown wheel thrust bearing, so there's obviously some where in that.
How long it last before the gears loose mesh is the uncertain part.
You could remove the propshaft as a temporary measure, which will make the IRD last much longer, but it means you'll only have FWD, and you'll also need to tell your insurance, as its a vehicle modification.

If you want a reconditioned unit, then you can currently use yours as a unit for remanufacture, but if the gears strip, and it goes bang, then unfortunately it's scrap value only, and you'll need to pay the surcharge on a reconditioned replacement.

Contact Bell Engineering, as they've got a good reputation, and have been reconditioning IRDs and VCU for almost 2 decades.
 
Nodge68 said:
Metallic oil isn't a good sign, however it could soldier on for a long time yet, as you've changed the VCU and it has matching tyres, which reduces the loading the IRD has to take.
The metal in the oil comes from the crown wheel thrust bearing, so there's obviously some where in that.
How long it last before the gears loose mesh is the uncertain part.
You could remove the propshaft as a temporary measure, which will make the IRD last much longer, but it means you'll only have FWD, and you'll also need to tell your insurance, as its a vehicle modification.

If you want a reconditioned unit, then you can currently use yours as a unit for remanufacture, but if the gears strip, and it goes bang, then unfortunately it's scrap value only, and you'll need to pay the surcharge on a reconditioned replacement.

Contact Bell Engineering, as they've got a good reputation, and have been reconditioning IRDs and VCU for almost 2 decades.
Click to expand...
I have often wondered if the while IRD needs reconditioning in these situations.

If either of the 2 gears are showing bad wear then a recon is definitely the way to go. However, if the wear is not so bad as to damage the gears, would simply replacing the bearings in the rear pinion be as good as a total recon unit?

This type of wear is not going to damage the diff, so its bearings would not need replacing. The bearings supporting the pinion gear are rotating in line with the forces exerted, but the bearings in the pinion supporting the crown gear would have considerable angled/sideways forces.

The pinion is a lot easier to remove than the whole IRD and presumably there is only 1 or 2 bearings in it to replace and only 1 seal. No cooler to replace either which is needed for a full recon and you don't even have to replace the coolant.

All in all a lot quicker/easier/cheaper job to to at home, even if you take the pinion to somewhere for the bearings to be pushed/pulled.

Even if it not 100% as good as a recon unit, would it be 90%?
 
Grumpygel, sorry to bring up this old thread, but do you now have an answer to your question?

I found traces of metal in my ird oil and i'm worried.
 
Dunno, nobody responded with their thoughts.

There are a few ways the IRD can be damaged - eg the RH drive shaft taking out its support bearing causing the diff to jam.

However, I'm confident most instances of IRD damage are due to wear in the bearings in the pinion. I would think there is much less damage elsewhere within the IRD.

So just replacing the bearings in the pinion would probably bring the IRD back to being healthy enough to live with and rely on.

As I say, so long as the crown/pinion gears are in decent condition.
 
I suppose we Can see the crown from underneath the car when the pinion is removed, but for the rest maybe an oil analysis in lab could spot where the damages Come from.
 
I wouldn't have thought an oil analysis could tell you which gears or bearings are failing.

If you can get the bearings replaced in the pinion for £100 It may be worth doing rather than the expense, and trouble, of removing the IRD and getting a recon.

Give it a good flush so you know its running on good clean oil, then possibly have an oil analysis after you've run it for a while.

Depends on how much money you are prepared to lose if you ultimately do need a recon unit.
 
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