Ignorant wannabe environmentalists

Alex <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
> >
> >
> Didn't somebody once prove that cyclist emits more CO2/mile than a
> petrol engine?
>
> Alex

Only in the 24hrs following a good curry.

Rich

Austin Shackles wrote:
>
> 'course, if they come back with "Actually, I ride a bicycle" then
> they've rather got you

No they haven't. They have just proved to you that they are a smug tosser
who deserves to be upended into the nearest ditch, their beards set on fire
(that includes the women) and their sandals smeared with tofu. All their
opinions can be safely ignored.

Bikes are great, and I've nothing against cyclists as such (I've done a lot
of bike miles in my time), but anyone who says "Actually, I ride a bike"
wants shooting. ;-)

--

Rich

Series 2a
RR 4.6
V8 trialler
Dawes Galaxy
Unidentified mountain bike, possibly Halfords

"Richard Brookman" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Alex <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:<[email protected]>...
> > >
> > >
> > Didn't somebody once prove that cyclist emits more CO2/mile than a
> > petrol engine?
> >
> > Alex
>
> Only in the 24 hrs after a good curry.
>
> Rich

Well they do say that a good curry repeats itself......

Steve

In message <[email protected]>, Richard Brookman
<[email protected]> writes
>Austin Shackles wrote:
>>
>> 'course, if they come back with "Actually, I ride a bicycle" then
>> they've rather got you
>
>No they haven't. They have just proved to you that they are a smug tosser
>who deserves to be upended into the nearest ditch, their beards set on fire
>(that includes the women) and their sandals smeared with tofu. All their
>opinions can be safely ignored.
>
>Bikes are great, and I've nothing against cyclists as such (I've done a lot
>of bike miles in my time), but anyone who says "Actually, I ride a bike"
>wants shooting. ;-)
>
Quite so - they shouldn't slag off their partner in public.
--
hugh
Reply to address is valid at the time of posting

On or around 17 Aug 2004 08:53:15 -0700, [email protected] (Richard
Brookman) enlightened us thusly:

>Alex <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
>> >
>> >
>> Didn't somebody once prove that cyclist emits more CO2/mile than a
>> petrol engine?
>>
>> Alex
>
>Only in the 24 hrs after a good curry.

mind, methane is a much more damaging greenhouse gas than CO2... Ideally,
you'd capture the methane and collect it for use in something like a fuel
cell.

--
Austin Shackles. www.ddol-las.fsnet.co.uk my opinions are just that
Appearances: You don't really need make-up. Celebrate your authentic
face by frightening people in the street.
from the Little Book of Complete B***ocks by Alistair Beaton.

"Fergus Kendall" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Having just filled up my 200tdi 90 at the Tescos filling station I
> started the engine back up to drive off with the usual small puff of
> engine startup smoke. Just before I pulled away some woman in her late
> 50s/60s started shouting at me "the smoke that thing puts out is
> bloody disgusting", I said "it's a direct injection diesel, it's just
> a characteristic of the engine, they all do it", she then started
> screaming abut how irresponsible it was to drive "a car like that,
> it's criminal" I said "look it's only a small puff at startup is it
> smoking now?" Then she went off on another rant so I told her "to go
> f**k herself and drove off" (wouldn't usually use such language to a
> member of the public but she seriously ****ed me off). The fact that
> her brand new nissan micra produced more pollution being manufactured
> than running a 200tdi 90 for 10 years didn't seem to concern her, was
> tempthed to reverse over her and her stupid toy car.
> Is there a Land Rover certified taser weapon I can purchase to teach
> these people a lesson or would it be hazzardous to use such a device
> on a filling station forecourt?
>
> Fergus

All this bull**** about 4wd vehicles does my bloody head in. I can use mine as a van, a car, an off road
vehicle, It can carry 7 adults for the school run, it can carry not a million miles away from an average
tranny. It uses less fuel than a tranny or even a mini cooper s ( I have owned both) it takes up no-more
footprint space than my wife's Audi A4 Convertible that does 22mpg & has 4 seats & you couldn't carry a
baby in it!! If anything, my 4wd 'contributes' rather than detracts, how would you get all your employees
to work in the snow if you owned a friggin' fiesta?

These chavs should get their **** correct about the actual 'usage' of the 4wd vehicles. Mine is regularly
full to bursting of all manner of things.

If any old bags give me **** about my exhaust smoking, they are the ones that will be smoking - in a
shallow grave.

All the **** brought about by the ****ers in power (basically, you can see the new tax coming) makes me
puke

Nige

In news:[email protected],
Peter <[email protected]> blithered:
> I would have started with "to go f**k herself" and just left it at
> that.
>
>
> Pete
>
> us colonials are so uncouth
>
>
>
> "Then she went off on another rant so I told her "to go
>> f**k herself and drove off" (


By all accounts some one else already did!
--
If Your specification is vague or imprecise, you'll likely get what you
asked for not what you want

hugh wrote:
> In message <[email protected]>, Richard Brookman
> <[email protected]> writes
>> Austin Shackles wrote:
>>>
>>> 'course, if they come back with "Actually, I ride a bicycle" then
>>> they've rather got you
>>
>> No they haven't. They have just proved to you that they are a smug
>> tosser who deserves to be upended into the nearest ditch, their
>> beards set on fire (that includes the women) and their sandals
>> smeared with tofu. All their opinions can be safely ignored.
>>
>> Bikes are great, and I've nothing against cyclists as such (I've
>> done a lot of bike miles in my time), but anyone who says "Actually,
>> I ride a bike" wants shooting. ;-)
>>
> Quite so - they shouldn't slag off their partner in public.

LOL

--

Rich

Series 2a
RR 4.6
V8 trialler
dog, wife, kids, whatever

Figure this one out then, if we all drove battery powered electric vehicles
the electrictiy to charge them would still have to be generated somewhere,
most likely inefficiently.

At least the pollution we cause is honest and visible.


--
þT

L'autisme c'est moi

"Space folds, and folded space bends, and bent folded space contracts and
expands unevenly in every way unconcievable except to someone who does not
believe in the laws of mathematics"


"Fergus Kendall" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Having just filled up my 200tdi 90 at the Tescos filling station I
> started the engine back up to drive off with the usual small puff of
> engine startup smoke. Just before I pulled away some woman in her late
> 50s/60s started shouting at me "the smoke that thing puts out is
> bloody disgusting", I said "it's a direct injection diesel, it's just
> a characteristic of the engine, they all do it", she then started
> screaming abut how irresponsible it was to drive "a car like that,
> it's criminal" I said "look it's only a small puff at startup is it
> smoking now?" Then she went off on another rant so I told her "to go
> f**k herself and drove off" (wouldn't usually use such language to a
> member of the public but she seriously ****ed me off). The fact that
> her brand new nissan micra produced more pollution being manufactured
> than running a 200tdi 90 for 10 years didn't seem to concern her, was
> tempthed to reverse over her and her stupid toy car.
> Is there a Land Rover certified taser weapon I can purchase to teach
> these people a lesson or would it be hazzardous to use such a device
> on a filling station forecourt?
>
> Fergus

On Thu, 19 Aug 2004 01:20:54 +0100, "Larry" <[email protected]>
wrote:

>Figure this one out then, if we all drove battery powered electric vehicles
>the electrictiy to charge them would still have to be generated somewhere,
>most likely inefficiently.
>
>At least the pollution we cause is honest and visible.

Large power stations operate at much higher efficiency than petrol
engines...

It is also much more practical to handle the attendant pollution when
it is all in one high-value installation, rather than spread around
the country and particularly localised in city centres and population
centres.

You still have to distribute and then battery the electricity, which I
suspect narrows the efficiency gap somewhat, but the control and
centralisation is probably the biggest argument in favour of it.


--

Tim Hobbs

'58 Series 2 88" aka "Stig"
'77 101FC Ambulance aka "Burrt"
'95 Discovery V8i aka "The Disco" (FOR SALE)
'03 Volvo V70

My Landies? http://www.seriesii.co.uk
Barcoding? http://www.bartec-systems.com
Tony Luckwill web archive at http://www.luckwill.com

Do not not let these people con you. Batteries have to be recharged at some
time and then they give off serious life threatening gases. I have now
retired so I do not have the report available. I was in charge of a workshop
which maintained battery driven forklifts also small battery driven towing
vehicles. The incidence of cancer among the workers caused an inquiry which
failed to establish the cause. The manufacture of these motive power
batteries is so poluting that the staff have to totally change their clothes
before going home. Also the waste water is not allowed to enter the drainage
system. Do not forget that there would need to be a lot more generating
stations if we went over to electric vehicles and how would these stations
be driven? Environmentalists seldom have the full picture and don't want to
talk to people with the practical experience. Just like politicians!
Robert
>

"Larry" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
> Figure this one out then, if we all drove battery powered electric vehicles
> the electrictiy to charge them would still have to be generated somewhere,
> most likely inefficiently.
>
> At least the pollution we cause is honest and visible.
>

Electric vehicles are not pollution-free, as some would claim. The
creation of the electricity to charge the batteries creates pollution
in a power station somewhere. But to be fair, all that pollution is
concentrated in one place, and it is much easier to control the nasty
emissions at source than it is from a million exhaust pipes. Plus
whatever is discharged goes up into the atmosphere, rather than being
emitted at face level in a city street.

I'm not a fan of electric cars - I'd rather use a bike or (gulp) walk,
but the envirotwats have a point when they say that battery-powered
vehicles are better for the environment. Note the word "better" -
it's all comparative. No transport is pollution-free. We all emit
CO2 when we walk.*

There's a similar argument with hydrogen cells. "Look", say the
e-****s, "it runs on water!" What they don't say is that it requires
massive energy to separate the hydrogen from the water in the first
place, and all that energy creates pollution for someone.

Rich

* Curry jokes to the usual address.

Tim Hobbs wrote:
>
> Large power stations operate at much higher efficiency than petrol
> engines...

Much ? No thermal power station can be more then roughly 30% efficient.
What is the conversion efficiency of a car engine ?
Steve

In article <[email protected]>, Richard Brookman wrote:
>
> Electric vehicles are not pollution-free, as some would claim. The
> creation of the electricity to charge the batteries creates pollution
> in a power station somewhere. But to be fair, all that pollution is
> concentrated in one place, and it is much easier to control the nasty
> emissions at source than it is from a million exhaust pipes. Plus
> whatever is discharged goes up into the atmosphere, rather than being
> emitted at face level in a city street.
>

Batteries don't last for ever either, what happens to all the nasty stuff
inside the battery when it's life is over? How much energy gets used
making the sort of batteries that are used for motive power?

--
simon at sbarr dot demon dot co dot uk
Simon Barr.
'97 110 300Tdi.

I looked out my window, and saw Kyle Pettys' car upside down,
then I thought 'One of us is in real trouble'.
-- Davey Allison, on a 150 m.p.h. crash

In news:[email protected],
Steve Taylor <[email protected]> blithered:
> Tim Hobbs wrote:
>>
>> Large power stations operate at much higher efficiency than petrol
>> engines...
>
> Much ? No thermal power station can be more then roughly 30%
> efficient. What is the conversion efficiency of a car engine ?
> Steve

IIRC absolute max is 56%

--
If Your specification is vague or imprecise, you'll likely get what you
asked for not what you want

>
>'course, if they come back with "Actually, I ride a bicycle" then they've
>rather got you, but you can point out that their bicycle can't carry 6
>passengers...
>

Didn't somebody once prove that cyclist emits more CO2/mile than a
petrol engine?

Alex

On Thu, 19 Aug 2004 11:09:40 +0100, "Roberts"
<[email protected]> wrote:

>Do not not let these people con you. Batteries have to be recharged at some
>time and then they give off serious life threatening gases. I have now
>retired so I do not have the report available. I was in charge of a workshop
>which maintained battery driven forklifts also small battery driven towing
>vehicles. The incidence of cancer among the workers caused an inquiry which
>failed to establish the cause.

You, however, seem to have established the cause all by yourself? I
suppose you have eliminated the known carcinogenic effects of used
oil, various solvents which would have been used in such a workshop or
indeed normal statistical phenomena... The workshop was apparently
somewhat unusual in having been run by a fully qualified pathologist.

>The manufacture of these motive power
>batteries is so poluting that the staff have to totally change their clothes
>before going home. Also the waste water is not allowed to enter the drainage
>system.

The clothing regulatoins and control of waste effluent is more often
than not just as stringent in food manufacture, medicine manufacture
etc. It doesn't make the end product itself inherently dangerous to
use or store.

>Do not forget that there would need to be a lot more generating
>stations if we went over to electric vehicles and how would these stations
>be driven?

Probably by fossil fuels, but also quite possibly by other renewable
sources. I look forward to seeing your design for a car with a
built-in hydro-electric power station...

You can go on forever with calculating the overall energy costs. How
much fuel do we burn transporting fuel to petrol stations? The fact
is that reducing car useage simply isn't happening and simply taxing
pollution is only going to put the UK (or indeed European) economy in
the doldrums whilst the Far East and 3rd World stay deregulated and
flood us with cheaper goods. In a wider sense we need to incentivise
people and businesses to reduce pollution, partly by stick but also by
carrot.


--

Tim Hobbs

'58 Series 2 88" aka "Stig"
'77 101FC Ambulance aka "Burrt"
'95 Discovery V8i aka "The Disco" (FOR SALE)
'03 Volvo V70

My Landies? http://www.seriesii.co.uk
Barcoding? http://www.bartec-systems.com
Tony Luckwill web archive at http://www.luckwill.com

Steve Taylor wrote:
> Nigel Hewitt wrote:
>> Roughing it out on the back of an envelope
>> I'd say not quite...
>
> How do you do it ? Do you assume the fuel consumption/mile and a
> stoichiometric burn ?

<confession>
I was totally wrong. I lost a couple of zeros in the conversions.
</confession>

Done again properly

Riding a bike.
Let's say the same as a diver finning reasonably hard
as I know these numbers for a diving rebreather so
using the consumption figures of 1L of oxygen per minute
(what the RN test rebreathers to be able to do).

The CO2 scrubber expects to get about 66% of that back
(most of the rest is water) so for Carbon-12 and Oxygen-16

1L O2 = 1.27gms
66% of that is 0.84gms
so that makes 1.15 gm/minute of CO2
10mph so 6 minutes is roughly 7gms

Car
Lets say 20mpg for a Rangie
Pretend it is Octane not a brew of hydrocarbons
1 gallon (UK) is 4.5L so at 0.7Kg/L is 3.15Kg

so a twentieth of that (1 mile) is 157gms

of that C8H18 96/114 is carbon so 132gms of carbon
so *44/12 to get CO2 = 484gms of CO2

Even on a 40mpg car you're talking 240gms
We lost.

I clearly need better envelopes to work on.
I blame the drugs (tooth extracted this morning
which is why I'm at home).

sorry an all.
nigelH

Alex <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
> >
> >
> Didn't somebody once prove that cyclist emits more CO2/mile than a
> petrol engine?
>
> Alex

Only in the 24 hrs after a good curry.

Rich

Roberts wrote:
> Do not not let these people con you. Batteries have to be recharged at some
> time and then they give off serious life threatening gases.

Hydrogen ? only if you smoke too near it...

Steve