handbrake won't adjust.. problem inside drum end. Can anyone advise!!

Hi Guys.
I have a problem with the adjustment on my handbrake.
I had a handbrake up until last week and all was well. Then one day.. NOTHING.

I have been through the range of adjustment on the 19mm nuts at drum end of cable and the best i can get is a little bit of resistance, but not enough as i can move drum by hand.
I have adjusted to as tight as i can with handbrake handle at various different positions.. but always the same result.
I have checked the connection points and all is well there at both ends of the cable.
I have taken off the drum and and cleaned it up aswell as the shoes which are actually quite new as these were changed when the transfer box gave up and filled the handbrake with oil not too long ago.

Now then.. i think i know where the issue lies but no idea why. This is where the oricle of LZ comes in. I HOPE.

Here's a pic to get started with.


Now.. I think the problem lies with (and i don't know what it's called) the part that the shoes sit into on the right side of the picture. The handbrake cable connects into the rear end of it via a lever arm.

Closer pic of said part:


When you pull the arm (i.e handbrake lever) the arm pulls outwards towards the rear of drum and the piston type parts, top and bottom, should, i guess, push outwards forcing the shoes against the inner of the drum and lock the drum from moving. That's fairly simple. BUT MINE DONT at least not very much.
When i last changed the shoes and i took the old ones out, the lower piston fell out of its housing along with a type of roller. I simply cleaned up and put back in.. bobs ya uncle.

That got me thinking so i took it out again and gave it closer inspection.

I found that the piston part has the groove that the shoes locates into on one end, but at the opposite end it has an angled channel in which the roller must sit. So thinking with my logic i placed this back in with the shallower end of the channel towards the back of the drum, roller greased into it, which would mean that as the arm pulls back.. the piston would in effect travel in and outwards direction. (Hope you can follow what i mean). I did the same with the other one which appeared to come out like that anyhow.

Having done this i still have very little travel in the shoes.

I then took it apart again and inspected the (lets call it PLUNGER) that the cables arm, coming through the back of drum, connects too. This has 2 flattened elevations too it and i take it that the roller located to this flattened surface on either side, but mine was more like half on the flattened and half on the rounded side.
I lined it all up to the flattened side so the roller sits against this.. pistones aligned as before, greased up and guess what... STILL NO DIFFERENCE and now.

The only other thing i have noticed that might be a problem, is that the whole unit that i am talking about.. moves where it is fixed to the back of the drum.. see vid, if it works.



Now.. i am dumbfounded as to what is wrong as it all works as it should.. just doesn't push the shoes out hard enough to lock the drum.

ANY.. guidence would be very much appreciated before i go strip this darned thing again.

Thanks in advance.

Just as an idea.. does anyone have one of these on the garage floor that they can strip and tell me how its configured inside.

That would be a big help.

http://www.landyzone.co.uk/lz/f41/handbrake-shoes-renewal-98882.html

sounds like you stuck the pistons in wrong

and if your expander is moving, then look behind it and see if the 3 clips are still there.

515467, 515470, 515468

when i looked behind it has a dust cover over it. i moved this but couldn't see 3 clips.
don't suppose u can dig out a pic of that anywhere?

hawky666 said:

when i looked behind it has a dust cover over it. i moved this but couldn't see 3 clips.
don't suppose u can dig out a pic of that anywhere?

Click to expand...

part numbers in previous post

here we go

Cheers Trax.
Will be back under there tomorrow to check out those clips.
Having read the how 2, i think i have got the pistons in correctly.. but it looks like i might be missing a part off the front of the expander. If you look at my pic you can see where i have pushed grease into the whole to the very front.
Looking at other pics.. this seems to be blanked off by something.

What does the square nut adjust?

clips wouldnt stop it working though it is better secure ,getting actuators right way round is critical and obvious if you pull on front rod ,looks like rod is pulled through too far in your pic, square nut ,do you mean shoe adjuster ?locking plates are 515467,515470,515468,and cover is 515466

hawky666 said:

Cheers Trax.
Will be back under there tomorrow to check out those clips.
Having read the how 2, i think i have got the pistons in correctly.. but it looks like i might be missing a part off the front of the expander. If you look at my pic you can see where i have pushed grease into the whole to the very front.
Looking at other pics.. this seems to be blanked off by something.

What does the square nut adjust?

Click to expand...

i see what you mean. i'm pretty sure mines just packed with grease.

the square nut on the back? It adjusts the brake linings.. if you didn't know that, then i think that's your issue

you adjust that so the brakes on, then back it just off so it's free, then adjust the handbrake cable. Have you not got a manual? There are free ones online

That's undoubtedly it then trax.

Egg on face :frusty:

I just took it that when the drum went on nice and snug.. but then leaving drum to turn freely.. you then adjusted with the cable at the 19mm nuts.

I'm pretty sure that there must be a clip or 2 missing. Now i seen the diagrams, i know there is at least one on there. But it moves a lot so cant be right.

I reckon the plunger is also wrong somehow.. as it did pull right through the back at one point which i had forgotten about. Probably some sort of a stopper broken. maybe even one of those clips does the job.

oh.. and NO.. NO MANUAL.
Obviously

if you were here now you'd think i had torretts lol

hawky666 said:

That's undoubtedly it then trax.

Egg on face :frusty:

I just took it that when the drum went on nice and snug.. but then leaving drum to turn freely.. you then adjusted with the cable at the 19mm nuts.

I'm pretty sure that there must be a clip or 2 missing. Now i seen the diagrams, i know there is at least one on there. But it moves a lot so cant be right.

I reckon the plunger is also wrong somehow.. as it did pull right through the back at one point which i had forgotten about. Probably some sort of a stopper broken. maybe even one of those clips does the job.

Click to expand...

hopefully that's it, as it's a simple fix

re the plunger, i'd have thought the lining being tight against the drum would stop it going out too far. If you've been adjusting by the cable nut, then it would just keep pulling out. So push it back in if it's still out, stick drum on, adjust the lining and see if it still pulls through.

btw, pull the handbrake on and off a couple times when adjusting to center the shoes.

Sorry Trax.. by plunger i meant the part that sits in the centre that the handbrake lever is attached too. At one point i was pulling on the lever to see what movement i was getting.. and it popped out of the back as i pulled.

hawky666 said:

Sorry Trax.. by plunger i meant the part that sits in the centre that the handbrake lever is attached too. At one point i was pulling on the lever to see what movement i was getting.. and it popped out of the back as i pulled.

Click to expand...

i think i am talking about that bit as well.. i'm getting confusled now

give it a go tomorrow and let me know how you get on

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Is your handbrake lever in the upright position (on) or in the lower position (off), as when mine was off was further back and filled this hole

My drum appears to be sitting differently to yours, my shoes sit at the sides (Left & Right) of each other, whereas yours appears to be top and bottom.

Just replacing my handbrake mechanism, the aluminium casting bit on the end of the brake lever had broke so that the retaining clips wouldn't locate.
Ordered spare parts from paddocks, hopefully here tomorrow..good luck with sorting yours

Hi Marmaduke.
From memmory, the pic was taken when handbrake was off position.
It would seem that this is deff wrong, and in conjunction with my stupidly not doing anything with the main adjuster.. i think i know what i need to do now.
Will just mean getting back under and stuck in tomorrow. Weather permitting.

AGAIN... A BIG THANK YOU FOR THE ADVICE TRAX AND JAMES.

I will update on the outcome once i've been back under there with my new knowledge and enthusiasm.
I'll have her running as she should soon i hope. But i still have a ffew hurdles so bound to be more threads like this. Sorry.

Landyfox said:

My drum appears to be sitting differently to yours, my shoes sit at the sides (Left & Right) of each other, whereas yours appears to be top and bottom.

Click to expand...

yours a later cable operated one?

this is rod

hawky666 said:

oh.. and NO.. NO MANUAL.
Obviously

if you were here now you'd think i had torretts lol

Click to expand...

http://www.landyzone.co.uk/lz/f16/service-manuals-parts-lists-90799.html

pdf Land Rover Manuals | Landroverweb.com

Thanks trax.
All saved to bookmarks.